Ok I'm watching the cricket.

This is turning into a good debate, many, if not most of the anti-British sentiments can be laid at the door of one Éamon de Valera, a fcking yank, who used and abused Irish history for his own political ends. Decent Irishmen did indeed wear the British uniform, and if they survived paid a heavy price upon return to Ireland after the war(s) because of his agenda.

My point is while De Valeras government stoked up anti-British feelings, others were prepared to give their lives and suffer should they survive. There were many like minded who could not fight, women for one example, who could not freely express themselves.

So to say the 'Irish' supported the Nazis is just so wrong. aka, good evening mate the IRA don't belong in this debate, they were and still are a despicible terrorist organisation, they do not and have not represented Ireland since 1922. Any discussions/help they had/gave the Nazis is no different than their relationship with Muammar al-Qaddafi, would you say 'the Irish' supported him, and his suppression of the Libyan peopole, of course not.

BTW, De Valera, used Michael Collins and Arthur Griffiths to 'get a deal' with David Lloyd George for Ireland to become a Free state knowing what might follow, a civil war, he was a sneaky snivelling coward, but then he was a politician, what's new?.

Hey lfc1971 , how you doing buddy, absolutely correct, De Valera saw to this, and indeed Irish people of a certain age who witnessed the dreadful behaviour of the back and tans, discredited for their disgraceful behaviour and withdrawn because of world opinion wanted protection.

I hate (strong word) Dev with a passion, but for him to use the 'British, armies failings/stupidity is a no brainer, it was an open goal.

The real point is this, as I stated earlier I do not recognise the 'modern Ireland/irish. Free EU muunny has turned their logic into mush, self serving, inward looking despite their protestations to the contrary.

The war was before my time, the political shenanigans that went on are no differant to the 3 years of s**t we have just enjured from 'Experts' about Brexit. You and I were not alive then and how on Gods earth do you explain to your grand children all the fake, opposing, printed and recorded material on Brexit that exits.

No problem aka, in this 2 dimensional world of printed matter it's easy to pick things up the wrong way, sorry buddy.

NPs Foxy and good evening to you too, hope you are well.

Thanks mate, doing ok, we all of a certain age have our problems, my eyes are fcked at the moment, but you know all about that, and never complain, fair play to you.

How long before a 'group hug' post appears on here,

Ireland had suffered many hundreds of years of appalling treatment from Britain as we tried to bring them

into Britain.

I don't think they ever suffered from Germany???

The Black and Tans who committed some terrible atrocities were ex British Soldiers.

I think the South of Ireland's neutrality was a reasonable position in WW11.

Many Irish people had died in their fight for independence from Britain, killed by British soldiers.


As for Nazi atrocities most of these were not known until after WW11.

They also gave us a good weather forecast for D Day. Those at the top knew we were going in.

Just my own opinion.

Of course pearl harbour changes everything.  But the fact remains there was a worry that the Irish Americans would have not if at all possible allow America to join Britain in this Great War , even if it meant the destruction of Britain
That shows the very dangerous mindset that is still there even today among many in Ireland

Hey lfc1971, thanks mate, thankfully I'm old enough, to discern the (mainly) agenda driven rubbish served to me on my screen, etc, etc. Who do we trust? who do we believe?, I am fully aware that my thought prosesses are shaped by my life experiences and other factors over which I have no control, but at least now with age  I can take a dispassionate view on many subjects without prejudice.

Or so I believe,

And the Welsh of course , sorry

well it’s just an interesting and pleasant conversation aka ,
and doubtless a little bit of love here and there :)

There is an interesting parallel with Brexit, , during WW2 conscription was never introduced into N Ireland although many volunteered
The reaso being the British didn’t want to upset Irish sensibilities at a time when we were trying to persuade America to enter the war
They were worried about the Irish lobby in America
Something similar , although not as vital to Britain’s survival is the attempt of the Irish lobby and others in America to stop Britain leaving without the backstop

Fairly spot on until the ludicrous last line.

Peckerdunne well said , always remember the workers united will never be defeated , the trade unions and the Labour party stays strong against the Imperialists, stay strong Comrade

^ No , that’s the problem right there , upside down thinking

The problem is still Ireland

You see the problem with Ireland is it likes to have all the advantages of being a pretendy independent country , without the responsibilities
That’s what they were up to in WW2 , and that’s what they are up to now

I would never have guessed irishone was of irish decent I thought he was Nigerian .

Lfc, Ireland is like a hedgehog,a solitary individual,all it ever wanted throughout a large part of it's history was it's independence,given England was the "aggressor" i don't know how you maintain Ireland is the problem.
It does have some positive legacies in it's buildings,systems though to this day.

At the moment the people in the North are in the main probably grateful that Ireland and the EU are in their corner,the British goverment certainly don't seem to be re brexit,whether the whole thing is a charade,i honestly don't know but my brain is having trouble accepting that the end result will be a no deal.

You seem to like putting down passages from books,selective ones anyway,you can "diss" this one as you don't do "history" but as you love "facts" it might do.

"Ireland starved because it's food from 40 to 70 shiploads per day was removed at gunpoint by 12.000 British constables reinforced by Militia,battleships and by 200,000 British soliers(100'000 at any given moment).
Thus Britain seized 10's of millions of heads of livestock,10's of millions of tons of flours,grains,meat poultry and dairy products,enough to sustain 18 million people."

Why did it do this? Because England itself was struggling to feed it's own.
When asked to put a stop to the genocide in progress,Trevelyan replied "We mustnot complain ofwhat we really want to obtain."
Queen Victoria's economist Nassau Senior expressed his fear that existing policies "will not kill more than 1 million Irish and that will scarcely be enough to do much good"

You are fond of saying "the Irish should be thankful to England",Lfc

Ok,so you glanced over that "holocaust" and you bang on about the nazis? Really?