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Early USA Democratic Caucusses/primaries February.

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Replies: 353
By:
MartinK
When: 02 Feb 20 19:42
I agree, such a random error with a single interviewer, who presumably they could subtract from the poll (their id is presumably associated with all their interviews) and compare the before and after results.
By:
thegiggilo
When: 03 Feb 20 00:49
https://twitter.com/ARMilani_/status/1224130793016037376/photo/1
By:
politicspunter
When: 04 Feb 20 00:14
If you’re the sort of person who was glued to political Twitter on Saturday night — and God help you if you are — you would have seen a mass freak-out when it was announced that that the Des Moines Register would not release the much-anticipated final version of its Iowa Poll (conducted in conjunction with CNN and Selzer & Co.). The Buttigieg campaign got word that at least one survey respondent had been read an incomplete questionnaire that did not include Buttigieg’s name. “While this appears to be isolated to one surveyor, that could not be confirmed with certainty,” the executive editor of the paper wrote, and acting with an abundance of caution, they declined to release the poll at all.

Nevertheless, a tweet made the rounds that night purporting to give the poll’s results, and after doing some reporting around this, FiveThirtyEight can confirm that it contains the correct final findings of the unreleased Iowa poll: Sanders 22 percent, Warren 18 percent, Buttigieg 16 percent, Biden 13 percent. Imagine the news cycle that would have been, with national front-runner Biden making such a poor showing in the last, highest-profile poll before the caucuses.

It should be noted that Selzer and Co., the pollster in charge of the Iowa Poll, has an A+ on our FiveThirtyEight Pollster Rating
By:
politicspunter
When: 04 Feb 20 00:15
Above was from 538 liveblog tonight. Seems genuine enough.
By:
politicspunter
When: 04 Feb 20 00:39
Biden out to 11.0. Never thought I would see that before a result is in.
By:
razz
When: 04 Feb 20 05:19
what a ****how, feels like the DNC are trying to halt the sanders momentum by denying him the media coverage if he has indeed won. buttigieg can still take it though. Biden looks like he'll be 4th but a "strong 4th" im sure CNN will report.
By:
InsiderTrader
When: 04 Feb 20 08:39
Democrats have learned nothing from 2016 and are playing into Trump's hands again.

National polls are irrelevant in the national election in the USA.

It does not matter how many votes someone like Bernie racks up in do-gooder rich states. The Dems are in exactly the same situation as Labour in the UK. Focusing on minorities and do-gooder uni types whilst ignoring their historical core white working class votes who want a hand up not a hand out.

Trump will win the working class votes again and take the Whitehouse again. This is even more likely if Bernie wins the dem nomination.
By:
MartinK
When: 04 Feb 20 11:59
Both the Buttigieg and Sanders campaign have claimed victory in the Iowa caucus.  Buttigieg saying returns from 77% of precinct captains give him likely victory, but only give one detail, that he was viable in 1064 of 1301 precincts. The Sanders campaign gave detailed returns from 40% of precincts from their precinct captains, giving first count and final count totals  as well as State Delegate Equivalents which gave Sanders a total of 28.62% against  Buttigieg 25.71%, so it's quite close at the top.
Assuming the Sanders numbers are valid, it then depends in how representative those 40% of precincts are of all precincts, so all up in the air still.

As for turnout, if those 40% are representative on the different sized precincts then with a total of 87,396 first count and 79, 162 final count the total turnout would be  218,000 and 197,000, but it's unlikely to be exactly 40% so may well be lower which will be a disappointment to the Sanders campaign which was hoping for a HHHUUUGGGEEE turnout.
By:
aaronh
When: 04 Feb 20 12:45
IT talking nonsense like usual and just thinking that because they are both left in their parties, the situations are exactly the same.

Bernie absolutely has a stronger working class core than Labour/Corbyn did. He is going to be far stronger than the sensible centrist Buttigieg would be in the very states that the Dems need to win. Trump would sweep the board against the likes of him and Bloomberg in Mich, Penn, Wisconsin, NC etc. Bernie can win these states.

Bernie's signature policy is M4A, this is something that would benefit all voters (unless they have vested interests in the medical insurance industry). It's not Labour handouts that target specific voters
By:
aaronh
When: 04 Feb 20 12:47
It is kinda funny though, if you hate Bernie from the right - he is pandering to minorities.
If you hate Bernie from the center, it is because he isn't appealing to them enough.
By:
InsiderTrader
When: 04 Feb 20 12:52
aaronh
04 Feb 20 12:45
Joined: 18 Sep 09
| Topic/replies: 267,309 | Blogger: aaronh's blog
IT talking nonsense like usual and just thinking that because they are both left in their parties, the situations are exactly the same.

^

Back in the real world the more Bernie shortens to win the dem nominee the more Donald shortens to win the election.

Donald vs Bernie results in the a big win for Trump.

The Americans simply will not elect a socialist/communist. It doesn't matter how much the do-gooder intellectual classes wish it to happen - the working classes simply are not that stupid.
By:
aaronh
When: 04 Feb 20 12:53
Who should Trump be most scared of?
By:
aaronh
When: 04 Feb 20 12:54
I don't see any communists running, IT
By:
razz
When: 04 Feb 20 12:54
but trump hasn't shortened at all during the caucus... while bernie has to win the nomination so..
By:
aaronh
When: 04 Feb 20 12:55
not fool proof but..

Data for Progress used the Lucid survey sampling platform to test three different versions of a Sanders and Trump polling matchup question. The survey was in the field from January 9 to January 19 of 2020 and ran these three polls:

No information: “If the 2020 U.S. Presidential election was held today, who would you vote for if the candidates were Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump?”

Partisan cues: “If the 2020 U.S. Presidential election was held today, who would you vote for if the candidates were Democrat Bernie Sanders and Republican Donald Trump?”

Socialists and billionaires: “If the 2020 U.S. Presidential election was held today, who would you vote for if the candidates were Democrat Bernie Sanders, who wants to tax the billionaire class to help the working class and Republican Donald Trump, who says Sanders is a socialist who supports a government takeover of healthcare and open borders?”
By:
razz
When: 04 Feb 20 12:55

Feb 4, 2020 -- 12:54PM, aaronh wrote:


I don't see any communists running, IT


a "communist" that's to the right of david cameron on healthcare Laugh

By:
aaronh
When: 04 Feb 20 12:56
first one - Bernie 47-41
second one - Bernie 45-43
third one - Bernie 47-42
By:
aaronh
When: 04 Feb 20 12:57

Feb 4, 2020 -- 12:55PM, razz wrote:


Feb  4, 2020 -- 12:54PM, aaronh wrote:I don't see any communists running, ITa "communist" that's to the right of david cameron on healthcare


nearly everyone one who is sympathetic to the right shows a complete lack of knowledge about any politics to the left of like Blair

By:
razz
When: 04 Feb 20 12:58
i don't get the argument either, a faltering incoherent biden cannot inspire any reasonable degree of confidence to beat trump assuming it's 1 of them that wins, especially coming 4th in iowa
By:
razz
When: 04 Feb 20 12:59
bernie is much more likable than corbyn also who comes across as a beta, and the US election is now much more of a popularity contest than the election was in the UK
By:
aaronh
When: 04 Feb 20 13:00
so we have Buttigieg who isn't going to inspire many other than the idea of having a gay president
Warren - who is a better and more progressive Clinton but the value of owning Trump in debate will be well overhyped
Biden - Trump would probably be the more coherent candidate of the two in this situation
By:
aaronh
When: 04 Feb 20 13:01
Bernie needs to be more of an alpha and go for the kill now on Biden Happy
By:
edy
When: 04 Feb 20 13:05

Feb 4, 2020 -- 12:54PM, aaronh wrote:


I don't see any communists running, IT


Them is all do gooder communists. Elites against the normal people.

By:
edy
When: 04 Feb 20 13:07
Just like in the UK where hedgefond owners, plutocratic funders, Eton graduates and multi-billionaire media moguls were the champions of the little man, enemies of the 16 million metropolitan elites.
By:
edy
When: 04 Feb 20 13:08
Metropolitan Elites like YOU, aaronh!
By:
InsiderTrader
When: 04 Feb 20 13:08
It is interesting that every time we have these debates I get shouted down and told I am wrong this time.

Trump 2016 I was laughed at on the forum. Same with Brexit. Same with the Brexit Party to win the EU parliamentary elections last year. Same with Boris to win the Tory leadership. Same with Tories to win a majority last election.

I am always told to trust the polls and that international socialism will win this time. The intellectual politically correct types who get the air time always predict it.

I just don't see it happening until the white working (and middle) classes in America and the UK are no longer a silent force quitely going about their lives and voting when asked. They don't want handouts and massive government inference in their lives.
By:
edy
When: 04 Feb 20 13:10
You misunderstand things. It's just everything you say around your predictions that is utterly ridiculous.
By:
razz
When: 04 Feb 20 13:13
i think bernie would lose to trump(he would of won in 2016) but he has abilities the other candidates simply do not so he does pose a unique threat to trump compared to the others.
By:
edy
When: 04 Feb 20 13:13
Like when you talk about communists you show yourself up as incredibly ignorant.
By:
edy
When: 04 Feb 20 13:17
Bernie aligns with classical social democracy. It's a long, long, long, long way from Communism. I know you just parrot about him being a communist though without knowing anything about it. You can't help yourself.
By:
InsiderTrader
When: 04 Feb 20 13:20
I cannot see the American public under the system they have for electing the President voting for someone like Bernie over someone like Trump.

America and the UK are very different other countries in this respect. Socialism/Communism has never done well in the countries that have tested it out.
By:
razz
When: 04 Feb 20 13:24
it's like he purposely ignores edy's statement about him aligning with social democracy.
By:
edy
When: 04 Feb 20 13:26
He's been too manipulated by his twitter bubble and really thinks Bernie is a communist. IT has always been easy to impress by certain people he adores and has always been willfully parroting their messages, no matter how removed from reality.
By:
edy
When: 04 Feb 20 13:29
It can get quite hilarious though. During the Brexit process, whenever someone from the ERG coined some slogan, you could bet on IT using that same slogan for the next few weeks before then adopting the new trendiest slogan from his masters.

#NoDealNoProblem
#ManagedNoDeal
#UndemocraticBackstop
By:
InsiderTrader
When: 04 Feb 20 13:32
'Social Democracy' is a very broad term.

The democracy part means if enough don't like sharing your hard work with everyone they can vote out the government next election. In that sense it differs for Stalin's Russia and China when totalitarianism is used to force through communism. But communism does not have to mean totalitarianism.
By:
razz
When: 04 Feb 20 13:51
I'm not sure biden actually wants to win anymore
By:
politicspunter
When: 04 Feb 20 14:32
I stayed up till after three, eventually heading for bed when the reporting of the results froze at about 1.8% of the total. Got back up and it's exactly the same. Frankly, this whole scenario makes a mockery of the caucus system and it really should be ditched asap. Apparently the "culprit", the reporting app, will be in use again in the Nevada caucus in a few weeks so looking forward to that!
Anyway, on the betting front, managed to get £50 on Bernie at 1.79 this morning so at least I won't lose anything now if he wins (I will be +37). The guy that layed me 27 fivers Buttigieg a couple of days ago must be kicking himself though!
By:
MartinK
When: 04 Feb 20 23:55
The guy that layed me 27 fivers Buttigieg a couple of days ago must be kicking himself though!
Especially after the release of 62% of results giving  Buttigieg  a 26.9% to 25.1%  state delegate equivalent - almost a 2% lead.
By:
thegiggilo
When: 04 Feb 20 23:59
https://thegrayzone.com/2020/02/04/pro-israel-buttigieg-seth-klarman-iowas-voting-app/
By:
razz
When: 05 Feb 20 05:25

Feb 4, 2020 -- 2:32PM, politicspunter wrote:


I stayed up till after three, eventually heading for bed when the reporting of the results froze at about 1.8% of the total. Got back up and it's exactly the same. Frankly, this whole scenario makes a mockery of the caucus system and it really should be ditched asap. Apparently the "culprit", the reporting app, will be in use again in the Nevada caucus in a few weeks so looking forward to that!Anyway, on the betting front, managed to get £50 on Bernie at 1.79 this morning so at least I won't lose anything now if he wins (I will be +37). The guy that layed me 27 fivers Buttigieg a couple of days ago must be kicking himself though!


i heard they have ditched the app for nevada now

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