Forums

Horse Antepost

There is currently 1 person viewing this thread.
These 173 comments are related to the topic:
prix de l,arc de triomphe

Post your reply

Text Format: Table: Smilies:
Forum does not support HTML
Insert Photo
Cancel
Page 5 of 5  •  Previous | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | Next
sort by:
Show
per page
Replies: 173
By:
elisjohn
When: 06 Oct 19 14:49
sottsass for me next year, better ground and or a bigger field will be perfect.
By:
brigust1
When: 06 Oct 19 15:30
Not sure about that Elsjohn. I didn't think Waldgeist would win the Arc and the 3 year olds were only 3rd and 4th. The 3 year olds next year will have to be another poor bunch not to beat these.
By:
roadrunner46
When: 06 Oct 19 15:31
that was a strange ride on magical, im wondering if coolmore were trying to soften up enable on that ground, they have been known to employ those type of tactics in the past.
By:
A_T
When: 06 Oct 19 15:42
it was a fast time in the conditions. I think Waldgeist ran the most even pace and the fancied horses used up too much early. reminded me of when Solemia mugged that Japanese horse
By:
Charlton2005
When: 06 Oct 19 20:59
wd Uncle. you do find a lot of winners! Grin
By:
unclepuncle
When: 07 Oct 19 06:20
Thanks Charlton - you're not too shabby yourself.Laugh
By:
elisjohn
When: 07 Oct 19 09:55
yes good call,  looking back what a cracking e/w bet he was
By:
Figgis
When: 07 Oct 19 10:06
On reflection I've changed my early take on the result. I agree with A_T that those racing very prominently early on did a bit too much but I don't think that was true of Dettori's ride. Enable beat Japan by almost the exact distance I would've expected if both running to form. There was a lot of talk after the race about Enable not finding her usual finishing kick in the ground, but it was no softer than when she won her first KG, and if you ignore Waldgeist from the picture yesterday she appeared to quicken up perfectly well. It's possible that she, Japan and Sottsass all ran below par, with Waldgeist only needing to do what he'd done before, which is what I originally thought. However, it's the time comparison on the day that swings it for me it's more likely they didn't run below their best. Waldgeist is the type of horse always going to be seen to best effect in a fast run race but he had that in the KG and still couldn't threaten Enable. I'm sure the soft ground also helped his cause yesterday but he had that in the POW and again didn't look an obvious future Arc winner. So it's true that he had all the conditions he required yesterday and had an easy prep beforehand but I think he was also probably in the best physical shape he's ever been and gave easily the best performance of his career. Personally I wouldn't fancy him repeating that level of form if running again, but it seems he might be retired anyway.
By:
roadrunner46
When: 07 Oct 19 11:10
you can find the sectionals for the race on france galop, think you see aiden o'breins tactics a lot in the derby, how they try and distort the pace of races,
no doubt in my mind they used magical for this purpose in the arc, the way that horse faded after challenging ghaiyyath most of the way around, you would of
thought it had just been shot, japan ran a blinder and was 2nd fastest in the race over the last 3 furlongs, had to come wide on the bend, drawn 10 dint help
its cause getting a better position early on.
By:
brigust1
When: 07 Oct 19 18:44
Figgis the difference between Ascot and Longchamp is the home straight. When Ascot announces soft ground that doesn't refer to the home straight. It has been laid specifically to drain easily and quickly and the ground is never as soft as everywhere else on the course. I remember Jason Weaver covering this point after walking the course on Champions Day one year where the ground was recorded as soft but it was only good to soft in the home straight. For that reason Waldgeist wasn't able to benefit properly from softened ground at Ascot when he made his challenge unlike at Longchamp where the softened ground actually helped him immensely.
By:
brigust1
When: 07 Oct 19 18:51
Work on the Straight Mile commenced in September 2004, once the course had been officially closed. This involved the redevelopment of the Home and Paddock bends to merge into the original Round Course, and making improvements to their camber. A three dimensional laser grading system was used to provide accurate shaping of the new track base, which would produce an even racing surface. A comprehensive new drainage system was installed and gravel drainage layers inserted to produce a uniform base. Work on the new underpasses to replace the existing track crossings commenced in July 2005 and the new track was completed in August 2005.

STRI continues to evaluate the condition of the track and advise on the optimum management of the turf. The track has matured and is widely recognised as one of the best courses in the world.
The results
Realignment work on the Straight Mile was completed to schedule in September 2005.
Positive comments made by John Gosden following a trial gallop of the new surface in October 2005.
Successful removal of two track crossings, replaced by new underpasses.
The creation of a durable, even surface and sustainable racing.
Recognition of the achievement by the media, with Country Illustrated reporting that the racecourse was now the ‘finest in the world’.
By:
Figgis
When: 08 Oct 19 09:22
Brigust, yes the straight at Ascot generally does ride quicker than the round part of the track. However on watching both races again it didn't appear to me that the Longchamp straight was noticeably slower than for the 2017 King George. It was soft in the straight on Sunday but it definitely wasn't heavy and the times back that up. So the conditions were definitely in Waldgeist's favour but I still rate he put up a better than average winning Arc performance on Sunday. That doesn't mean I would rate him an above average Gp1 winner overall, certainly not. That is one of the problems the ratings firms have when rating the race, they have to rate the horse on its best effort. I see Timeform have Enable 129, so if you agree with the rating you could say she was a 129 horse, as she usually runs to that mark or wins comfortably enough to suggest she could match it. I see they've upped Waldgeist to 132, which I'd say was fair enough on that performance, but personally I'd never call Waldgeist a 132 horse in general.
By:
Sandown
When: 08 Oct 19 11:18
The fresh ground for Arc day is for a degree or so faster than the Saturday and this year was no exception. On race times, I have to make the going as good to soft, at worse. "Very soft" was "very misleading." The final time was a good 7/8/9 seconds faster than when Ivanija(76) Sagace (84) Urban Sea (93) Montjeu (99) won their races.

Looking at the sectionals its clear that the early pace was too fast to be sustainable which gave an advantage to horses held up. Waldgeist, Softsass and Japan were. In the circumstances, Enable must be credited for finishing second having been on the front end all the way. Ghaiyyath was made to do too much from a wide draw which was a disadvantage.

Using the final 2 furlong splits only Waldgeist maintained an even pace whilst the ground gained by the other two from the back (Softsass, Japan) showed that even they faded in the final furlong as did Enable.

In conclusion, Waldgeist got the best trip in conditions which played to his stamina. As to his rating, the RP have given him a rating of 128 (+2) which I believe is more accurate than TF's 132.
By:
kincsem
When: 15 Oct 19 10:31
I keep an Excel spreadsheet of the Arc draw (Longchamp).
The 2019 time was 30th of the 47 years (1971-2019) i.e. a bit slow but nothing too extreme.
Page 5 of 5  •  Previous | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | Next
sort by:
Show
per page

Post your reply

Text Format: Table: Smilies:
Forum does not support HTML
Insert Photo
Cancel
‹ back to topics
www.betfair.com