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Qipco Champion Stakes 18th October.
Qipco Champion Stakes 18th October.
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did n't back the winner but enjoyed the race as a spectacle, I also think Free Eagle ran very well and will be a force to be reckoned with next season.
Both the winner and the second ran with guts and class, quite rightly the plaudits went to Noble Mission but Al Kazeem must be blessed with a fabulous temperament to re-submit to the training regime and prove just as good (almost!) as before he went to stud. He could quite conceivably win a G1 at the age of 7 next season. |
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Joni as George Baker said after the race "they didn't go that quick up front and that helped him relax" but we will all have to read it as we wish. I'm pretty sure the ratings gus will not change anything at all for the reason I stated.
The best horse won on the day and the second best horse was second, if you ignore the fact that the winner broke the rules, and unlike the QE11 no-one can claim to be unlucky. That is certainly nothing I have claimed at all. The only horse I think would have benefited from an end to end gallop would have been Weld's horse Free Eagle. It doesn't matter if we see races differently that is what racing and gambling is about. I couldn't back Noble Mission with any money and he would have been my lay of the race but I was wrong and it cost me. Without that element there wouldn't be racing and gambling so enjoy the differences. |
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Not sure what all the hoohah is about. The race basically went exactly as expected - the only thing wrong with the last 2 furlongs is that it was Al Kazeem putting it up to Noble Mission in the straight rather than CDA.
Was it a top class race - no. The conditions played to one or two horses strengths and their jockeys maximised this so credit to them for that. The other horses either had off days (or just aren't as good as they once were - CDA/ROW) or didn't show up at all (Australia et al). |
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I find myself falling out of love with the game,hard sell TV with Snooty and co telling me this is top class racing. Maybe I am just at that age?, but the lack of real debate in the game,and politics, the propaganda is sickening,feck it.
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http://www.turftrax.co.uk/tracking.asp?t=BritishChampions2014
No soft lead there. |
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Did someone say it was a soft lead? That's assuming soft is based on time. I think he had an untroubled lead and not entirley sure what times can say when the ground is soft, heavy in places. Which places was it heavy exactly. Does turftrax tell us that?
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what a load of bollocks,he set a moderate pace.
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George Baker said they didn't go quick up front and I'm pretty sure with an untroubled lead JD would be saving something for the home straight, as it appeared. But with diverse goings how can sectionals tell you anything with jockeys giving horses breathers on that ground etc?
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awful stuff - shameless
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Anyone who thinks JD is going to run his horse into the ground after been nutted in St Cloud and Germany is doing the lad a disservice.
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A_T, how did we get from setting a good overall pace to running a horse into the ground?
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Based on soft/heavy ground seconds per furlong adjustments the fastest race against standard was the Champion Stakes.
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And that's evidence. Taking the Jockey at his word is just one person's perspective, like an opinion. It does not amount to evidence likes times and other factors do.
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No it isn't Sin. You are comparing with a 2m race and a 12f fillies and mares race. How can that be evidence. ROTW broke the course record in the Foy yet he set a steadyish even pace to start with apparently. Often fast finishing times are achieved off a steadyish early pace. Not knowing how or where the heavy patches were or how inconsistent the course was then times, in my opinion, are just times. That's just an opinion of course. I wouldn't someone explaining to me why that isn't so. I really wouldn't mind. Honestly.
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Judging the pace correctly from the front is a real art - Doyle did a great job. Hughes often seems to hope that they will go too fast and he can pick them up from the back in the final furlong - when they don't go too fast and/or you get traffic problems like yesterday you encounter difficulties.
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Perhaps all races should be run in lanes to eliminate this continuous and more often than not irrelevant banter. But then it wouldn`t be horse racing as we know it.
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Hey Brig if Ruler of the World broke the track record on the Foy then what did Ectot do in the Niel?
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Hey Brig if Ruler of the World broke the track record in the Foy then what did Ectot do in the Niel?
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The point is it's not always irrelevant. It's important to analyse if a result may have been different under different circumstances. Most people accepted the 1986 Derby result at face vale but some didn't, the winner went of fav when they met again but those who said the second should've won were proved right. The overwhelming evidence here, though, is that Noble Mission was in no way lucky to win and no horse behind was inconvenienced by the way the race was run (maybe some were by the ground but that's a different matter). I would've thought the visual evidence was enough but it's also backed up by the final time, that time couldn't have been clocked under those conditions at a less than true pace. They even finished the last furlong quicker in the two mile race if more evidence was needed that it wasn't a sprint finish.
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All fair points and I have never questioned the fact that the best horseon the day won. Ignoring the fact that JD broke the whip rules but that is a different point.
The fact that the 2m race final furlong was faster than the Champion Stakes could be a telling point but clearly NM and AK set too long before the final furlong so it is no surprise they were running out of steam. A fact not accounted for in the 2 miler where the winner belted away. A point I would be interested in was the time by the 3rd horse, Free Eagle, in the final furlong by comparison. |
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Also Brig that super filly Treve beat the afore mentioned times in the Foy and the Niel in the Arc and carried the same weight 9-2. The clock never lies but horses perform differently on different days and on different ground, ignore the clock at your peril.
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I'm far fom convinced Felt bu I am open to being convinced. So far all I am interested in is if a horse puts in a fast time the chance of a bounce is much greater. And recovery much longer.
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Free Eagle's time for final furlong was 13.97s versus 14.12 and 14.13 by Noble Mission and Al Kazeem respectively (courtesy of the link kindly posted by Figgis above).
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...might have misunderstood your point, brig - if you were looking for comparison between Free Eagle's final fulong time and the 2 mile race, then Forgotten Rules recorded 13.76s for final fulong.
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the first 3 all clocked progressively slower times for the final 4 furlongs - not a symptom of a race run below normal pace.
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Considering we are looking at potentially the stiffest part of the course until the final furlong that is understandable. And of course there is a possibility that GB was going so well on AK he thought the pace was steady but as I said before I don't think the pace really mattered except maybe for Free Eagle though he may have been flattered by the leaders weakening than him actually improving but that would be an effect of the race anyway.
I'm not sure what the final furlong time between FE and FR tells us. Anyone? |
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Free Eagle ran each of the last four furlongs quicker than the winner, but having backed him I have no complaints at all about the run of the race. It's not like Smullen held to him for too long, for me the horse was always being kept up to his work and if Smullen had forced even more out of him early he would've paid for it later. Initially I thought the gound may have been against him but on final analysis I have him only 1lb lower than his previous best, so a negligible amount and basically he ran his race. What his performance does confirm to me, though, is something I've always thought, that he'd be more effective over 12f, although we will just have to see if he goes on next year.
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That is very interesting F. If FE was making ground on the first at the hottest part of the race that is only to his credit. Especially over a sustained period. But my eyes told me I would back FE to beat the others next time anyway that probably only confirms it. Good point though.
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Just watched a replay. What a tough, reliable and genuine top class racehorse Noble Mission has become.
 Fantastic from Lady Cecil. |
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well done NM backers, he has clearly progressed more than I thought this season and clearly loved the ground. Was a really enjoyable days racing, even managed to get an invite in the betfair box to watch the main event.
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very good call sintonian
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