Sounds reasonable F. I will be taking a price on BOG depending on what is on offer and with whom. I can often get on small with outsiders but lumpy, for me anyway, can be a problem especially with knock backs. I will almost certainly end up on here but the bookies seem to hold down these prices early on so it will have to be nearer the off anyway. Good luck. We'll be collecting I'm sure, just how much.

I meant if it comes up good to soft, I imagine they'd withdraw if it got genuinely soft.

Ladbrokes have completely left this market alone.

This is how I see it on figures:
116 Mukhadram
116 Telescope
116 Australia (possible scope for improvement)

In terms of Mukhadram against Telescope,I think it's a Golan / Nayef scenario, where a very tight King George finish will translate into a win for the speedier animal at York. To my eyes, Mukhadram travelled better than Telescope into the final 2 furlongs. However, I suspect Australia will be able to pounce late on for a narrow victory. In terms of fatigue, Mukhadram has had 3 big races but he did have a 3 month break after the World Cup, whereas Telescope has been on the go since late April. Australia should be a fresh horse and ten furlongs should be fine, but it does intrigue me that there have been precious few 'vibes' about him over the last two months. At the prices I will be backing Mukhadram. Sorry if that makes no sense to you, Brigust.

O'Brien voicing "fitness concerns". as if he's going to send Australia light to the Juddemonte. Covering all angles, if he gets beat he wasn't 100% and will come on for run, if he wins he's won despite not being at full fitness so must be a wonder machine.

Does anyone else think it is incongruous for AOB to claim the horse will need the run while his son is breaking his balls to ride it?

Thanks F. My plan was three and a half at 4/7, five and a half at 8/11, seven and a half at 4/5 and a k on anything bigger. I reckon this is the crunch race. If he doesn't win here then the Irish Champion and Arc can almost be forgotten. None of these would win an Arc, it's his best trip and the ground should be perfect plus he gets the allowance. Plus I always think a good colt will beat a good filly and look what the filly did. If he loses and heads for Ireland I think it is very likely he will be very short in an uncompetitive race. And the Arc would almost certainly be out of the question.
It's not uncommon for trainers to say something negative about their horse before a big race and it's usually because they expect it too win and look for any reason it may not. I thought this horse would beat these easily and I still think that.

laddies always open up too short brig, I learnt that from my hols as only bookie near by, no bog in store ever there, rancid firm

I think mukh will tow Australia into the race and if Australia is good enough he wins imho at least he will have beat by kingman on his cv

I agree about the price Fig, the bigger he is the more I will have on.
I don't agree about the proximity though AOB's comments may make me eat my words. I think he will win well because I don't rate his two older dangers. I think the course will be too fast for both of them and when you consider Mukhadram was 14/1 for the Eclipse and he finished alongside Telescope last time puts it into perspective. Apart from the JOB weight issue and 'fitness' comments this is the perfect scenario for me. You need some opposition to give you a price.

I would n't be overly concerned about a 53 day lay off for Australia nor the alleged weight gain as a developing 3yo (as long as he does n't show up looking fat as butter!)

UP's thoughts about the track for Mukhadram are interesting, he is 1/1 there but was hardly impressive when disposing of Grandeur at 4/9 last summer - Haggas concedes he was n't at his best that day and initially thought he was n't suited by going left-handed - however, it transpired he was lame after the race which is more likely to have had a bearing on his performance.His only other left- handed run was a perfectly respectable effort in the Dubai World Cup.

Anyway, I think Mukhadram should be clear second favourite - he's perenially underrated - probably partly due to a non existent juvenile campaign and a less than stellar 3yo season - more pertinently, he gave Telescope a nice tow in the King George and was coming back at him right at the death, prior to the King George Telescope's entourage were adamant that 12f on fast ground were his optimum conditions wheras Wednesday's race will be far closer to Mukhadram's optimum conditions if the excuse for his (winning) performance at the track last summer is legitimate.

I'm similar to Figgis but might be prepared to back Mukhadram ew two places... will have a think about it and see if there's some 13/2 knocking about come race day.

I an also see the argument for The Grey Gatsby being overpriced (he definitely likes the track!) but it's really hard to see him reversing the 2,000 Guineas form with Oz given 10f is likely to see the latter to best effect.

Arod will finish in front of the Grey Gatsby

Cant see why Arod should finish in front of The Grey Gatsby.Was the French derby win a fluke?

Don`t you use Betfair Brig?

Almost exclusively.

Do you find a benefit on here as opposed to the books F? I guess you leave it very late? I have a range of bets I invariably cannot leave it to the very last minute on. Sometimes if I leave it late on here I can find myself chasing down a price. I try to back it and it's gone. I try to get the shorter price and that's gone etc. I look at the books and the price is better so I take that if I can then find the price has recovered on here. Do you find that?

I must admit I haven't done any research on it, I suppose if I get the time I will. I do like to go racing on the odd occasion though. I cannot remember the last time I had a bet in a betting shop.
I have tried something a little different for a bit of fun. I have backed Oz on here for the Arc at 11s with a view that when he wins tomorrow his Arc price will detract and I can cash out at a better profit and a free bet. We will see about that one.

Gone for TGG as he represents  value  e/w , he won the French Derby doing Cartwheels,  hard to believe any three year old  with the exception of perhaps Australia could have won more easily .  We know for certain that TGG  improved for stepping up to ten furlongs , theoretically Australia  may well do the same , but theory is all very well  when an animal has some  punting value to mine but in his case there is none  and the ground is  not firm which would make him  a  very hard horse to beat   , we do not have to speculate over TGG  because this exuberant and  enthusiastic runner  he is clearly  better over ten  GL

get yourself to jam staines then brig, 8-11 still available

I can see a scenario where Telescope and Mukhadram beat each other up allowing Australia to take advantage (if he's able) just like what happened in the King George.  Ryan Moore may plan to attempt to get past Mukhadram later than at Ascot, or even allow Australia to hook up with Mukhadram for the first duel and pick up the pieces from their battle.  Mukhadram is such a good horse and difficult to pass that it may go against whichever of the other two tries it first leaving the other to pick up the softened rivals late on.