I still maintain that the King George rating was a bit high, imo Nacarat was the second best horse in the field and set the race up for KS at the cost to himself.

Both Madison and Barbers have hardly run to their rating since, have they?

To be Happy with a 193 plus rating you would have to be happy that Madison and Barbers were superior to Nacarat, subsequent events have not proved this.

Personally id have both Madison and Barbers in the low 150s now

Well said Budd. Could be talking about it for the rest of the season.

and y would this be the race of the century ? race of the century would have been if kauto had have had decent ground wen he was beat by denman in the gold cup wen they were both off level wieghts. i cant over estimate how disgusting i think this idea of running this horse in this race is

ide be more interested in a race over 3 miles over hurdles and some fences a mix of the two  with 4 pace makers big bucks v denman v kauto star and ide be all over big bucks for the race

Sorry if I've missed it but when did Ruby say it wasn't wise? I can't see Ruby having a real say in whether it happens or not. Dan you're going way over the top. It's a horse race, Kauto's a horse, this is a race. IMO Denman has regressed since he won his GC so I think Kauto would have a very good chance this year if he's anywhere near his best still

Not sure how much Rubys opinion would count if the owner is adamant.Also Ruby would i imagine ride Denman at the weights,and would not like to see someone else on his beloved Kauto.Maybe his judgement might not be totally genuine?
End of the day the owner pays the bills,and i guess he will decide,although when i was involved in ownershp,the trainer always made the decisions,and quiet right too.Trainer should know better than the owner!!

Ruby would certainly ride Denman. Kauto's presence helps his chances. 11-4 in the Hennessy, it's a dream for Denners. He'll be able to go another mile I'd say. Kauto coming 2nd to Denman off 190 is as good as a win for him really. Hope it happens now and that it wasn't just hyperbole.

I don't think it's certain who ruby would ride, but IMO it would be kauto. He could have ridden denman in the 2008 GC when denman was at his best but chose to stick with Kauto, I really don't see him riding denman at all. Having said that if he did would AP rise Kauto?

To say that, Eric, is to completely misunderstand jump racing.
PN would be trying to get both horses to Newbury at their peak, any so called skullduggery is plainly ridiculous. PN, Paul Barber and Clive Smith love NH racing and none of them would want it any other way.
And Resner finally got around to it, there is absolutely no way Ruby would give up the ride on Kauto. If there was any doubt about the horse it wouldn't run in the first place.

There is no way Nicholls will want both horses to rip the guts out of each other in November in a handicap against the young set imo unless he expects Denman to perform some way off his peak. No trainer in his right mind would want that with the important races to come for his best 2 horses against each other so early. If he did that he'd be making a big mistake, Nicholls doesnt make big mistakes so expect Denman to be some way off his best if Kauto runs. Denman wont be placed imo in a normal Hennessy field if Kauto turns up ... that I would have a bet on.

brigust1 there is no doubt you have taken a price Kauto in the Hennessy chancing he turns up your views are driven by that and not with the rest of the season in mind for Kauto.

Eric, every race Denman has been involved in since 2008 has been a hard race for him, and apart from his KG wins quite a few of Kauto's have been hard races. Why can't this just be down to the fact this is probably the last season for at least one if not both horses. Therefore the last chance to do something as potentially exciting as run them in a Hennessy. I do think Denman isn't the horse he once was, but don't think this is the reason Kauto is under consideration for the race

Kirk already making excuses for Denman in case he gets beat. Sure Kauto doesn't stay more than 3m. I tight your proved that as fact, kirk or eric or whatever name you change to this week.

Look, Kauto is the toughest horse we'll see in a long time. Nicholls has said time and again he is bouncing the day after a race. It's like he never had one. That's why it was so hard to find out he was best run fresh. The race will not stop him paying a 180 at kempton. He may have taken a slight edge off by running in the hennessy, but he's still unstoppable round kempton.

As for Ruby, we all know he'll ride Kauto. Ruby knows and always has, that Kauto is, was, and always will be a superior horse in every single way to Denman. He'd never ever ever get off his back as Kauto had never been beaten by a better horse.

I don't understand the semantic's of name changing and it doesn't bother me.
What does bother me is the lack of understanding about trainers, owners and jockeys.
Aiden O'Brien often races his best horses against each other whether the Guineas or the Derby etc. so KS running against Denman is not new.
If I owned KS I think it would be brilliant to run in the Hennessy, if I owned Denman I think it would greatly enhance his slightly tarnished reputation if he beat KS in the Hennessy and if I were PN I would want to get both to the track in peak form. This will attract a massive amount of interest even outside the racing world.

CV,i have to disagree with the Superior in every way comment mate.Over 3m 2f Denman has won more races and in no way has been proved to be inferior.

Even he if thought he cannot win,and the one he thought could win he could have rode??

Bit daft for a pro jockey imo

Could all be a moot point anyway, i'll still be amazed if he runs at Newbury

Anyway that dont answer my question,i said even if he tought Denman would win.

I am in neither camp, but Bud Kauto did beat Denman 13 lengths in the Gold Cup.

Loyalty i guess you mean,fair enough,but he quiet likes Denman as well i would think.
Anyway,you are probably right.