Horse Antepost
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05 Oct 10
12:52
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Date Joined:
05 Jan 10
8-11 Frankel, 5-2 Dream Ahead, 5-1 Saamidd, 14-1 Dunboyne Express, Native Khan, 20-1 Seville, Titus Mills, 33-1 Roderic O'Connor, Strong Suit, 40-1 Elzaam, Glor Na Mara.
Frankel has been installed as 8-11 favourite for the Dubai Dewhurst Stakes at Newmarket.
Henry Cecil's colt was a brilliant winner of the Royal Lodge Stakes at Ascot but could face his acid test at Headquarters.
His potential opponents include wide-margin Middle Park winner Dream Ahead (5-2) and Champagne Stakes winner Saamidd (5-1).
"We've seen some terrific performances from several two-year-old colts already this season, and if the market principals all turn up for the Dewhurst, it should be a mouthwatering showdown, with the winner certain to head into winter quarters as hot favourite for the 2,000 Guineas," said Coral's David Stevens.
"However, it is a measure of how highly we rate Frankel that Henry Cecil's charge is odds-on for the race, even though he could face fellow unbeaten Group winners such as Dream Ahead and Saamidd," added Stevens.
Frankel has been installed as 8-11 favourite for the Dubai Dewhurst Stakes at Newmarket.
Henry Cecil's colt was a brilliant winner of the Royal Lodge Stakes at Ascot but could face his acid test at Headquarters.
His potential opponents include wide-margin Middle Park winner Dream Ahead (5-2) and Champagne Stakes winner Saamidd (5-1).
"We've seen some terrific performances from several two-year-old colts already this season, and if the market principals all turn up for the Dewhurst, it should be a mouthwatering showdown, with the winner certain to head into winter quarters as hot favourite for the 2,000 Guineas," said Coral's David Stevens.
"However, it is a measure of how highly we rate Frankel that Henry Cecil's charge is odds-on for the race, even though he could face fellow unbeaten Group winners such as Dream Ahead and Saamidd," added Stevens.
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Replies: 220
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shouldn't be fav imo let alone odds on . Will be laying antepost .
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Of course it should be Fav, but 8/11 skinny especially ante post.
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dream ahead or dunboyne express far from certain to turn up. you can probably get 1.9 on frankel, but then when you think zafonic started 10/11 for his dewhurst, against arguably much weaker oppo, shows you can never get any value about favs anymore [smiley:crazy]
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Saamid is very good each way value at those prices
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saamid is betetr than dream ahead but frankel on a different level
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coral bet to 137 %
no value at all. |
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saamid is betetr than dream ahead but frankel on a different level
A line through Approve would say otherwise. |
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corbiewood Joined: 21 Feb 07
Replies: 899 05 Oct 10 19:43 coral bet to 137 % no value at all. Are you suggesting all the quoted runners will run ??? |
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im on saamid at 16/1 for the 2000 guineas and if the top 3 in the betting turn up for the dewhurst frankel dream ahead and saamidd i think this is the flat race of the decade as the three are all very exceptional colts and the value imo has to be a lay of frankel at the price if the three do turn up. however i bet sir henry will be first to pull out his colt with the statement. we have decided to put away frankel for the season to let him mature and we are very excited for the following season
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from my limited experience of racing you very rarely get three great two year olds in the same season. so the idea that the three of them surge ten lengths clear of the field in a head bobber while simultaneously smashing the track record seems somewhat far fetched.
something's gotta give, and I think frankel will win fairly easily. |
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Will you run naked down the newmarket dip if he does not?
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I think this event is as epic as teofilo v holy roman emperor v strategic prince, all soon to be well established stallions imo.
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As much as I have been impressed with Frankel, when was the last Dewhurst winner to have previously run over a mile? Possible negative from a stats perspective, on good ground I think I will be with Saamidd at the prices.
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Saamidd not in same league as other pair on the clock. Will be close between Frankel and Dream Ahead. Neither been off the bridle yet - one reputation about to be burst.
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dream ahead wont run imo.
frankel v saamidd |
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corbiewood Joined: 21 Feb 07
Replies: 899 05 Oct 10 19:43 coral bet to 137 % no value at all. Are you suggesting all the quoted runners will run ??? at the tim coral only had a handfull of runners priced and still bet to 137 - i was simply poining out that they had plenty of margin, even allowing for scratchings. |
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I agree dream ahead wont run , and i cannot see Saamid beating Frankel in any race.
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Why wouldnt Dream Ahead run?
Ground will be in favour trip will suit & a chance to overturn Frankel with a turn of foot with conditions to suit. Looks like extra experience wont do him any harm either Got a full winter to recover from 2 races in short space of time Come may ccould well be fast ground no certainty to get trip . Strike whilst the irons hot. |
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8/11 could look a desperate price if it comes up soft.
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if it dont like soft over firm id be gobsmacked
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same i think frankel wont be as good on better ground, huge action, loves the muck(no matter what henry says)
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"no matter what henry says"
deary me. |
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Frankel has beaten trees in a good time. Probably good enough but not at that price.
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MP im not contesting that the great henry doesnt know more about the horse (and racing in general than me) OBVIOUSLY, but what im saying is from what ive seen , this horse is not going to be much more suited by better going, hes not going to improve much more imo because if he does he'll be rated 160, do people not see how this is impossible?
i think he loves cut, plain and simple and i dont see him improving because of better ground, thats all im trying to say, i can see how that would come across a bit arrogant, i apologise. |
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the faster the ground the better he will be imo.
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I'm not convinced where all of this talk is coming from that Dream Ahead will appreciate the step up in trip. How many horses have you seen win the Middle Park and then try going up in trip and failing? the answer is many.
The Middle Park only seems to produce sprinters, who very rarley stay any further than six furlongs. I agree that he shapes like going further won't be a problem but he has such a high cruising speed and by going that one click slower like they do over seven, it'll ruin his cruising speed and turn of foot. Just an opinion, of course - but I've never been a fan of backing horses over seven or a mile after they have won the Middle Park. Ofcourse, this fella could be a freak but would prefer to see him do it, first. As others have said - Frankel has beaten trees so far, but the times he's recorded suggest thathe could have won the same races against much, much better opposition anyway. However, 8/11 is very skinny. |
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I am a cynical old layer, but not since 1983 (Gorytus v Diesis) has the Dewhurst been more anticipated. Gorytus was regarded as just about the best 2yo ever seen, based on the brilliant time he did at York. This may seem ridiculous now, but in those days people really believed that fast times (when recorded "electrically") where are all you needed to confirm a horse's brilliance. After weeks of hype about him in the press, in the final week before the Dewhurst, the Middle Park winner, Diesis came into the picture with reports of him doing outstanding work at Newmarket. I remember that the Newmarket correspondent in the Handicap Book, said that even if Gorytus was as good as people said, there was enough confidence behind Henry Cecil's Diesis to make him the selection. Diesis won the Dewhurst. And now after all these years, a resurgent Henry Cecil is back there again.
I can't wait! |
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The year was actually 1982.
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King Torus is the most underrated 2-year-old colt of the season! Hated the soft ground at Longchamp last time out; if he's given his chance I think he's a massive each way bet! Frankel will probably win, Saamidd is good but still very unexposed and I don't see how Dream Ahead will stay the trip on decent ground.
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'explosive'
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gorytus would have picked diesis up and carried it had he not been got at.
the major knew what happened he just couldnt prove it. |
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Strong Suit looks big each way price if ground good or better.
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doubt strong suit will be lining up in the dewhurst mate. i reckon he'll be put away til next yr now.
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Yeah he won't be going. Put away until next year.
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i hope he destroys the field!
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Interesting piece about Gorytus here....
http://www.thefreelibrary.com/FROM+HERO+TO+ZERO%3B+Twenty-five+years+ago+tomorrow,+supposed...-a0169787616 |
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Fascinating stuff. The parallels are uncanny, let's hope we don't get a repeat. Cecil really believes in this colt and it would be a cruel irony if he was on the receiving end of a Gorytus-style flop all these years after profiting from it in the first place..
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To those who say Frankel has "beaten trees" I refer to the "Tree" Rainbow Springs, who finished 3rd in the Prix Marcel Boussac beaten 4l. Frankel could have beaten him a distance at Doncaster (won 13l)
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To be fair, she was making her debut that day and the way she was staying on in the PMB certainly would indicate 7f wasn't her trip.
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