General Betting
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New PC charges
New PC charges
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Replies: 457
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Just be thankful they haven't brough in a tax on forum posts yet Step
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BF's strategy is to drive off the most successful big players, then replace them by becoming active in their own markets.
isn't that called insider trading?? |
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I'd be more than happy to see betfair putting up the prices.
Though I'm sure like conventional bookies they'd soon chuck you off if you kept winning their cash. |
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not necessarily, no.
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Seems very extreme to me. I know a number of people who are likely to be affected by this. Tough times
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this could cause a huge drop in liquidity here i suspect that the few supply the majority of it especially on more specialised markets.usually if you see a big amount there will be money on the other side but this is mainly cross matching money usually skimming fractions out of bets and is not really liquidity at all as it all vanishes if the big money on the other side is taken down.it will be very interesting to see how much impact this has.
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scarecrow - that's why I think they'll be becoming active in their own markets.
that's pure speculation on my part, but it just seems too obvious not to happen. |
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that's why I think they'll be becoming active in their own markets.
not sure if that's legal in australian markets...? |
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viva they have been active for years with cross matching bud in 95% of markets on here.
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they cross match on australian markets as well now.
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as a result of these changes it is now possible that someone who has never paid the PC and has a lifetime total charge % of 35%, but has made over 250k now finds themselves being stung for PC at 40%.
based on betfair's reasoning, they have paid their 20% cost of betfair finding the losers for them, and then a further 15% which goes straight into betfair's pockets which they can "develop their business" with. but now they want 5% more.  |
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it would make absolutely no sense for any large positional/opinion player to remain on here and be at the mercy of having losing runs with no prospect of a rebate.At the beginning of April I was 180k down on the year.I'm now currently in profit but if the first and last 3 months of this year had been reversed I would have paid a fortune in premium charge without receiving a rebate.I may as well go purple and cut the size that I stake in by 40%.
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Apart from the fact that the purple site is pretty poor in layout/market and liquidity wise - Its not going to be much fun if say 200 or 300 consistent winners turn up on the 18th july to face off with eachother. To say this is the end of the road for alot of users is not far off the mark.
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wicklow, i suspect liquidity over there will be experiencing an exponential rise very soon.
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its all about liquidity and markets available metal guru at the moment its here but if that changes things can happen fast.sadly for competion reasons its hard to see an alternative in the short term.
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Exactly how I see it Wicklow.
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it seems like the first people to be hit are the ones that have been here the longest....y'know the ones that paid for/built/promoted betfair....!
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wicklow its the lack of markets over there as well that kills it for example no frame betting,leg betting in darts etc.
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That's the ridulous thing about it dstyle, all based on your previous activity. They'll be plenty of the bigger staking value punters that'll now fall into PC with a 40% comm charge. It's hard enough for anyone trying to use PC avoidance like arbing etc at 20% there's no chance in hell of doing it at 40%.
I'm sure betfair will have run a few reports to see how much extra this will bring them and it must be a fair amount for them to risk their business on it. Only a matter of time before their own seed accounts come out in force to do a bit of PR work :) |
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as a result of these changes it is now possible that someone who has never paid the PC and has a lifetime total charge % of 35%, but has made over 250k now finds themselves being stung for PC at 40%.
That's the position I'm nearing. Lifetime profits £220k, but total charges at 27% so never paid PC. Naturally, moving overnight from 0% PC to 40% PC will drive me away. I'm not sure how Betfair thinks this will benefit their operations. |
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football liquidity is ok for the most part.betfair and a quite a few posters on the forum seem to believe that they have an infinite monopoly on the exchange product regardless of whatever charges may be brought in.
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do find it crazy that someone can have a 20.1% and never paid as penny in pc
whereas someone else could be on 22% and paid a fortune out before a bad run puts you at the 22% |
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quite Dr J.
i doubt understand how you can suddenly say: "this group of customers are fine and profitable for our business model and are therefore excluded from the PC" to "actually, they're even worse than existing PC payers and deserve to be charged double". as i said, the PC is just about justifiable on the basis of the rate at which money is taken out of the exchange, but NEVER on the volume. |
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STEPTOES, there will be plenty of people having paid PC , but now being well above 20 %
I've paid 135 k in PC and is currently just above 50 %. |
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* i don't understand
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I know scarecrow - we both do similar markets with snooker/darts and theres nothing of the sort over there - and sure if they did pop up over the coming months all your going to have is the defected winners - who are not going to so eager to back ronnie for a frame on a break of 10 at sub 1.2
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First they came for those who earned over 250k, and I did not speak out as I did not earn over 250k.
Then they came for those who earned over 50k, and I did not speak out as I did not earn over 50k. Then they came for everyone else, and there was no one left to speak out for me. |
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The other bookmakers will have a massive field day with this. Betfair claiming to be better odds, but now wait - subtract 60% of your winnings.
Disastrous PR for Betfair, and ultimately the end. |
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Does anyone find it crazy that if your lifetime commission generated to gross profit ratio is 4.99% then your pc is 60% but if the ratio is 5.00% then you get a third off your pc's? Have they never heard of sliding scale? Also, if these charges applied across the board there'd be little point in anyone opening a new account as they'd only get 250 markets out of it. Now you just have to find a new account to front you every quarter of a million. It's particularly funny when you think this is from the same people who couldn't consider rebates for fear of avoidance.
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Ryanair don't do a betting exchange but if they DID ..
 all their best ideas are already stolen.50-60%? That's absolutely insane. It's like they've got a tax advisor from a 70s Labour government running their operations. |
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Betfair shares are among the best performers on LSE today. Currently up 4 %
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yep eddie
just wrong, pc should work both ways, should get some of it back if you go back above the 20% all this talk about pc evasion is wrong and poor excuse |
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if betfair really think pc evasion is going on then how is it fair to punish those playing fair
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Betfair from "Be the bookie" to "Squeeze them until their pips squeak".
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scarecrow - I'm talking about them using a subsidiary to actively trade their own markets, on nominally the same terms as 3rd party customers.
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"Betfair shares are among the best performers on LSE today. Currently up 4 %"
What's betduck doing? (actually they probably aren't listed?) |
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i feel so sorry for the people this will effect,i was caught in the net the first time they introduced pc and know what it feels like.luckily for me over the last couple of years i have scaled my betting down on here and i am doing other things as well as this to get by,so i will still pay what i do now in pc as far as i can make out,until they move the goal posts again.i have a horrible feeling i may be looking for a job in the next couple of years and i will be nearly 50 then,i guess my options might be b+q or asda
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ah ok viva
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'That's the position I'm nearing. Lifetime profits £220k, but total charges at 27% so never paid PC. '
sorry can someone please explain that .. ? how can u be in profit by such a large amount an not paid the pc upto now |
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Ok who is going to set up the facebook group for those who do not want to put up with this?? I'm well up for investing my profits in a venture to MAKE THEM PAY FOR THIS... All my loyalty for them gone now...
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