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***** ARSENAL CHIT CHAT *****

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By:
pixie
When: 04 Dec 18 11:04
They're not really comparable as Ozil always plays in the playmaker role and starts most games, Ramsey more often comes on as a substitute and is more versatile and has played pretty much every position across the midfield, spending a lot of time on the left wing in his early days.
By:
roadrunner46
When: 04 Dec 18 11:17
goes without saying they are both very different players, those stats still paint a picture, ozil is much
better player than ramsey.
By:
pixie
When: 04 Dec 18 11:26
Those stats paint no picture at all.
By:
lurka
When: 04 Dec 18 11:27
No Arsenal manager would or could have agreed to pay Sanchez what Man U or City would and Sanchez wanted out because of Wenger primarily. Ozil has just turned 30 and now is the time to get some money for him. The problem is he can sit there and take his wages as I can't see anyone else paying him those wages but you never know. If we sell at a knockdown price someone might. The contract Wenger gave him will end up costing the club so much money and tying up a huge chunk of the wage bill that would be better spent on a couple of good additions.

You need to build your whole midfield around Ozil to get the best out of him and that means having players doing the donkey work for him as he will not change and will not tackle. Ozil is a unique player and not comparable to anyone really. He doesn't really fit in to modern football pressing tactics and a lot of modern managers wouldn't have much use for him.

Ozil might seem a better player than Ramsey on the ball and against weaker teams esp but you are ignoring the disruption he causes to the tactics and midfield when we don't have the ball, when he is a complete passenger. Ramsey is also 2 years younger and you can't really take his all time stats as relevant as he was awful for about 3 years after his injury and played out of position for a lot of that time. Ramsey will look a lot better playing under Emery as well imo.
By:
roadrunner46
When: 04 Dec 18 11:39
the new manager has his own ideas, like you say ozil might not be a part of his plans going forward, hes going to create a team and a style of play that he wants to see.
By:
enpassant
When: 04 Dec 18 12:00
It seems either Ozil has to change his game to suit the manager or accept he may only be a squad player ie if he cannot command a starting place he can be a quality player from the bench. Obviously he would be a very expensive sub but that situation is in his hands due to the length of his contract. Ultimately if he is useful to gain winning results that will mitigate most of the problems.
Emery has already earned the right for trust in his decisions. So if he wants rid or keep him, I will accept his judgement.
By:
Blackrock
When: 04 Dec 18 12:45
Thought the main reason Emery withdrew Ramseys contract offer was AR didn't want the number 10 role? He preferred to play deeper but Emery said we are well stocked in that position.

Ramsey and Ozil both have great games then disappoint for their next half a dozen games. Happy to leave the decisions to Unai though.
By:
darren_discombobulates_sports
When: 04 Dec 18 14:26
roadrunner46   
all time premier stats

ramsey - 248 games - goals 37 - assists 46
ozil - 152 games - goals 30 - assists 51




Goals/Assists per minute is a lot more accurate than goals per game, you can come on in injury time and that's 1 game, a bit different to playing 90 minutes, Wenger played Ozil centrally and Ramsey on the right side of attack many times so can't really compare fairly.

Ramsey
15,987    minutes played     
1 goal every 432 minutes
1 assist every 347 minutes


Ozil
12,895 minutes played
1 goal every 429 minutes played       
1 assist every 253 minute


Goals per minute are near identical.
By:
pixie
When: 04 Dec 18 14:43
Good post, Darren.
By:
roadrunner46
When: 04 Dec 18 15:19
good research darren, you havent mentioned which player you think is the best out of the two of them
By:
Johnny_Mustang
When: 04 Dec 18 15:42
Am off to see the Arsenal U21s at Portsmouth tonight in the EFL Trophy although I have absolutely no idea what that competition is about.
By:
enpassant
When: 04 Dec 18 16:39

Dec 4, 2018 -- 3:42PM, Johnny_Mustang wrote:


Am off to see the Arsenal U21s at Portsmouth tonight in the EFL Trophy although I have absolutely no idea what that competition is about.


Quality ^

By:
Johnny_Mustang
When: 04 Dec 18 16:45
Lol. There'll probably me myself and eight other people there.
By:
enpassant
When: 04 Dec 18 16:54
That just adds to the quality.
By:
enpassant
When: 04 Dec 18 16:56
"Those in England now a-bed will hold their manhood's cheap, whiles any speaks, that fought with us upon St Crispins Day "
By:
lurka
When: 04 Dec 18 21:57
It's just as silly comparing goal numbers between the two as well. Ozil has never been a goalscorer and never been sought after for his goals. He is an assist merchant and one of the best in the world at it. He has never scored more than 9 league goals in any season for any of his clubs, yet has been considered a marquee player for club and country his entire career. I'd expect Ramsey to score as many as him if not more playing deeper.

It's pointless comparing the two, they are completely different players with different qualities and play in different positions. Playing off Giroud for years hasn't helped Ozil either but if he's not willing to do what the manager wants from him for those wages then get rid now and get some money in and his wages off the bill.
By:
enpassant
When: 04 Dec 18 23:01
Portsmouth 2 v 1 Arsenal U21
By:
Johnny_Mustang
When: 05 Dec 18 07:17
^ And a fine match it was too with the exception of Koscielny limping off towards the end.

Pleased to report there were 109 of us in the total attendance of 3,000, reduced to 108 after just before half time when someone was ejected for industrial language. This was reduced further by one when his girlfriend returned carrying two coffees, one of which was clearly now surplus to requirements but was instrumental in her also getting chucked out after flinging it in a steward's face in a passionate display of loyalty.

And people have the cheek to say romance is dead.
By:
enpassant
When: 05 Dec 18 08:16
It might have all been different if only she knew the 'industrial language' was aimed at her for taking too long to get the coffee.

Bad news re Koscielny though on the Arsenal site it doesn't say anything about it so maybe it's not a big problem.
By:
lurka
When: 05 Dec 18 09:08
Ljungberg said Koscielny just had cramp and wasn't injured. Big game later. Man U have a seriously depleted team so I'm sure Mourinho will play for a 0-0 or 1-0 and go physical. Will prob use Fellaini and the long ball so might be a big test for our defenders.
By:
lurka
When: 05 Dec 18 09:10
Xhaka is missing tonight as well so perhaps Ramsey will start. Can't see Ozil featuring anyway, prob the last game he should be playing
By:
the fink sisters
When: 05 Dec 18 09:32
Great post Johnny_Mustang.....
By:
enpassant
When: 05 Dec 18 19:06
Was hoping Niles might get a chance to partner Torreira tonight but given how Emery subs he may still.
By:
enpassant
When: 05 Dec 18 19:06
19Leno
    5Papastathopoulos
    20Mustafi
    16Holding
    2Bellerín
    11Torreira
    29Guendouzi
    31Kolasinac
    8Ramsey
    17Iwobi
    14Aubameyang
By:
enpassant
When: 05 Dec 18 19:17
1De Gea
    3Bailly
    12Smalling
    16Rojo
    20Dalot
    31Matic
    21Herrera
    36Darmian
    14Lingard
    11Martial
    10Rashford
looks like a team set up to play on the counter -pace and mobile front 3 and 3 at the back !
By:
enpassant
When: 05 Dec 18 19:18
Thought they had NO CH's ? Now they have 3 in the same side.
By:
anxious
When: 05 Dec 18 19:20
Lol we have been feckin awful , youse will never have a better chance to wallop us , Rojo and Bailly have hardly played recently defensively we are atrocious, our only hope is rashford , martial and our keeper
By:
Whisperingdeath
When: 05 Dec 18 19:21
Can't believe Arsenal are 2-1 plus. Have been here before and been disappointed since 2006 but for the love of God I cannot stop myself putting money on Arsenal!

Oh Lord please help me. I don't want a Mercedes Benz!
By:
enpassant
When: 05 Dec 18 19:24
Ian Wright said he was worried b4 the game with the scum but now knows that was a wenger hangover syndrome- he said he thought we will win and it was because of the evidence of his eyes.
By:
cricketnut2
When: 05 Dec 18 19:24
I was just about to say that Arsenal are 3.15 on Betfair Exchange to win this game, surely if your an Arsenal supporter you would want to back them at a massive value price and Arsenal are rarely a value price to bet, but this evening they really are.
By:
lurka
When: 05 Dec 18 19:27
Adams barely holding it together on BT. Still doing the hand signals from his Granada days
By:
Whisperingdeath
When: 05 Dec 18 19:35
I have to say I have been drinking and am trying to be prudent but I want to throw the sink at this!

Maybe wait till we go 1-0 down?
By:
enpassant
When: 05 Dec 18 19:44
Ramsey will surely be stuck out on the right tonight so likely not to be making the late run into the central space  (as was the case between PEA & Lacca on Sunday)
By:
Johnny_Mustang
When: 05 Dec 18 22:03
Disappointing result in the end but Guendouzi and Torreira were superb once again.
By:
enpassant
When: 05 Dec 18 22:07
Holding and Ramsey coming off knocked us a bit. I thought we were still the better side. 13 unbeaten in the league with Huddersfield, Southampton & Burnley to come. Mhikitayan looked better in his cameo which is a plus. Could do with all hands on deck now so hope Ozil shows up and take some of the pressure off the squad.
By:
Whisperingdeath
When: 05 Dec 18 22:16
Ramsey was poor and out of position. The injury to Holding was not a hinderance. We were sheite in the first half! Better in the second but not really at the races.

For 10 years we have needed a centre forward, a centre midfielder and a centre back. Two out of three aint bad but we need a beast at the back.
By:
enpassant
When: 05 Dec 18 22:20
Can't agree. For one, it took away options for Emery's ht/2nd half tactical substitutions.
By:
lurka
When: 05 Dec 18 22:23
2 poor goals conceded again. Disappointing but a decent result. Thought they did very well going forward seeing as Auba was more or less marked out of the game and had little threat through the centre as a result. Torreira and Guendouzi were excellent. Bit of a nasty game at times and good to see them stand up to the physical side for a change. Two very tough games done and will prob have a few more injuries and players needing rests.
By:
jon b
When: 06 Dec 18 12:41
Enp, Ive no idea what Ramsey is on now or has been asking for, is he worth 200k per week, obv not but there are some extreme wages out there as we know. I agree with John w  as in the Ozil wage could if he does leave free up at least an offer that Ramsey can handle and would be fair given his commitment to the club, Ive no doubt Ramsey wants to be part of this clubs future.
Btw stat  finders, find one that compares tackles, interceptions etc, would be a landslide, or find goals and assists against the other top 5 even. Ramsey like others under Wenger has played almost everywhere, almost to versatile for his own good.
Sanchez wanted out and was very vocal about it to the point where I was happy he fcuked off tbh, Ozil wanted out and said nowt, no one wanted him, that tells a story in itself, then Wenger gave him a deal of a lifetime, shocking really, obv not a fan but tbf never have been, he never wanted to come in the first place
By:
the fink sisters
When: 06 Dec 18 13:40
That I'm disappointed to come away with a point at a ground where our form has been so miserable over recent seasons speaks volumes. Good to see us pushing forward after conceding the second equaliser. As has been said on here, Torreira and Gendouzi were both very good. Just needed a bit more quality in front of goal or with the final ball. Chelsea dropping points makes the Top 4 spot interesting now - have to take advantage of our next three fixtures, which on paper all look winnable.
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