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'Team 12' bollox in the SPL - just say Rangers and be damned

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Replies: 603
By:
Outpost
When: 17 Jun 12 21:07
if that's for me to post the whole link milla445 then it's already up there.

that's all the link I have and it brings up the sky story on my PC.
By:
milla445
When: 17 Jun 12 21:15
All I get is "page not found" from your link - the Record website usually has the headline in the URL as well.

Most of their reporting has been direct from Fantasy Island anyway, so I doubt I'm missing much of any substance.
By:
Outpost
When: 17 Jun 12 21:17
works ok for me but try this one

http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/news/sky-threat-pull-plug-spl-113142799.html
By:
milla445
When: 17 Jun 12 21:31
That one works, cheers.

The old "unnamed source" again I see.

Sky's official help team has said in a tweet that the SPL deal will be unaffected. Will try and dig out a link, although it may have to wait until after the Dutch game.
By:
Outpost
When: 17 Jun 12 21:32
gave up on the dutch game after portugal scored again.

turned over in time to see second german goal.
By:
milla445
When: 17 Jun 12 21:33
Ive just stuck with the Dutch game because I can't be bothered finding the remote Laugh
By:
milla445
When: 17 Jun 12 21:51
Here's a tweet I've found in response to a Celtic supporter's question. Feel the need to point out I'm not Tony Duffy - I can string a coherent sentence together and don't feel the NEED to put random words into CAPITALS Laugh

https://twitter.com/SkyHelpTeam/status/214274899181707266

The fabled "no deal without 4 Old Firm derbies" seems to be bollix then.
By:
TheBetterBettor
When: 17 Jun 12 21:55
We have no plans to pull out of covering the Scottish Premier League. Jane


A bit like, "we have no plans to raise VAT", statement that was promised by the goverment a few years ago.
By:
milla445
When: 17 Jun 12 22:01
True. The main point of posting that was underlining that the unnamed source in the Record story wasn't the official company line.

If that changes in the near future then some clubs may find themselves struggling - but it shouldn't be held as a gun to the head of the SPL clubs
By:
lybertyne
When: 17 Jun 12 23:15
fascinating stuff
By:
Darlo Bantam
When: 17 Jun 12 23:29
Anything other than a "no" vote would be utterly farcical.
By:
shudacuda
When: 18 Jun 12 00:13
We need change.The SPL has only been a benefit club for the old firm.

Tweedl dee and tweedle dum have fished 1st and 2 nd in 12 out of the 13 years.

Rangers to div 3

Voting changed from the cartel of them voting with Celtic to block any changes.

After this the money can be more evenly distributed.
By:
mactheknife
When: 18 Jun 12 00:20
Rangers would have to start in Scottish League Division Three, says SFL chief executive David Longmuir
David Longmuir, the chief executive of the Scottish Football League, is opposed to a proposal which would see Rangers demoted to the First Division.
His counterpart at the Scottish Football Association, Stewart Regan, has been discussing the matter with the SPL as they attempt to work out a compromise punishment for the club, who could be found guilty of misuse of dual contracts at a meeting of the Scottish Premier League board at Hampden on Monday.
Regan is also anxious to merge the SPL and SFL but there is little chance that a move to integrate the two bodies for the first time since 1998 could be completed in time for the beginning of 2012/13.
Should Rangers be expelled from the elite division (either by the SPL or the SFA’s appellant tribunal), then they would be forced to apply to join the SFL in the Third Division.
However, the possibility of Rangers dropping only one division has been mooted in an attempt to salvage the new, four-year broadcasting agreement with Sky, which has yet to be signed. Longmuir, though, is not convinced of the merits of that argument.
“The decisions that have to be made by the SPL and SFA in the coming weeks are far more crucial than the knock-on effects that come to the SFL,” he said.
“There are no winners in this situation. The good of the game is balancing sporting integrity with the finances available, and to be realistic about the future.”
Longmuir also suggested that — in the event of Rangers being ejected from the top tier – he would not welcome any application from them to join his organisation unless they were prepared to start at the bottom.
Any vacancy arising in the SPL would be filled by First Division runners-up Dundee, while losing play-off-finalists Airdrie United and Stranraer would be promoted to the First and Second Divisions respectively.
That would leave Rangers facing the prospect of meeting the likes of East Stirling, Annan Athletic, Peterhead and Montrose four times a season and replacing the Old Firm clash with derby matches against Queen’s Park.
“It would be a newco scenario and the only way we could accommodate any new application would be to create a gap in the Third Division through the play-offs with teams shuffling up,” said Longmuir
“We would then judge every case on its own merits. There would be no provision for any newco Rangers to go into the First Division rather than the Third Division.”
Meanwhile, Rangers are set to be left off the fixture list for the forthcoming Clydesdale Bank Premier League season, with 'Club 12’ taking their place, as the uncertainty at Ibrox continues.
The Glasgow club, champions in 2010-11 but now facing an uncertain future, announced the news on Sunday on the eve of the publication of the SPL fixtures, which takes place at 9am on Monday.
With the process ongoing, the punishment for Rangers being liquidated and the establishment of a newco Rangers is still to be determined and they could yet be demoted from the Scottish Premier League to the Scottish Football League.
It remains uncertain if Dunfermline, relegated from the SPL last term, or Dundee, runners-up to promoted Ross County in the Irn-Bru First Division, would occupy the 'Club 12’ slot should Rangers be denied a place in the competition.
A story on Rangers’ official website read: “The SPL are replacing Rangers with 'Club 12’ in the official list of fixtures for the 2012-13 season.
“The governing body is sticking to the schedule of announcing the matches as planned but have taken the Ibrox men out of the list after the developments of last week which saw Rangers FC change ownership under a newco scenario.
“The Sevco consortium headed by Charles Green completed the purchase of the club and its assets last week when HMRC refused to support an exit from administration through CVA.
“They are now seeking to transfer the SPL share from the old company – Rangers Football Club plc – to the new company, The Rangers Football Club.
“All 12 member clubs need to vote on this application and eight votes are required for Rangers to be playing SPL football next season.
“A date for this vote has yet to be set so the SPL have decided to use 'Club 12’ in their list of fixtures in order to cover all eventualities.
“If the transfer of the SPL share is successful then Rangers will assume the 'Club 12’ fixtures.”
By:
Hussard
When: 19 Jun 12 08:57
Every day we hear the down side for the SPL clubs of no Newco. There are potential up sides for the other clubs.

Hearts, Dundee United, Aberdeen, Motherwell have huge potential supports. Last season Kilmarnock and Hearts took trophies of Celtic. With Celtic being the only part of the OF left and as a Celtic season ticket holder I don't believe Celtic  are that great, is there not a serious chance one or two of these clubs could mount a challenge to Celtic ? Hearts would fill Tynecastle easily in those circumstances and so would the others.

The bottom clubs will have another small club who could save their SPL status as well.

The media want us to think we need Newco but does the SPL need them after the revelations, and poor as the Scottish game is, can it be seen to be so feeble and weak willed ???

Newco potentially being SPL champions next season how does that sound to Scottish football people ?

At the end of the day it's about right and wrong. Anyone club voting yes to Newco has no shame and their fans must do the right thing and that includes the supporters of my own team who must take money out of Celtic's pocket if they vote Newco into the SPL. I would also think all supporters  should boycott any club who vote Yes to Newco especially the utterly shameless Kilmarnock who have sold their souls the past two seasons in giving up their staduim to allow both halves of the OF to party while their players lay down and died in both games ensuring the party went to plan.
By:
TheBetterBettor
When: 19 Jun 12 10:16
http://www.eveningexpress.co.uk/Article.aspx/2818004

Rangers could be stripped of five league titles
Ruling due on charges of double contract dealing

Published: 19/06/2012
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    TAINTED TITLES? Steven Naismith celebrates winning the SPL title with Rangers in 2011.

    TAINTED TITLES? Steven Naismith celebrates winning the SPL title with Rangers in 2011.

TAINTED TITLES? Steven Naismith celebrates winning the SPL title with Rangers in 2011.

RANGERS face being stripped of past honours if found guilty of giving players double contracts.

The SPL have confirmed a general meeting has been convened for Wednesday, July 4, when the 12 clubs will vote on whether newco Rangers can stay in the top flight.

The Ibrox club could also be stripped of all honours won between 2000 and 2011, which includes five SPL titles.

---


Does this mean that these titles get awarded to Celtic...

And what about denining further progression in the Champions League for Celtic and other Scottish teams?

Also what about Queen of the South and Falkirk who where runners up in the Scottish cup final within this time period?
especially Queen of the south...cos they where in the First Division at this time.
By:
ghostofzipifried
When: 19 Jun 12 10:32

Jun 17, 2012 -- 8:37PM, dbrfcno1 wrote:


Being a rangers fan I would be happy to see them start fresh in the 3rd division. Least if we do it that way nobody can slate us for getting a free pass straight back in. Also be interesting to see how other clubs in spl handle the difference in revenues with out half the old firm


Glad to see some acceptance of your fate at last. I tried telling you 6 months ago just how wrong you were. Still though you must rid yourself of the ' lets see how you live without us' mentality . Show some remorse for the cheating culture we have all warned you for years. You cannot live like this and get away with it.

By:
Platini
When: 19 Jun 12 10:44
Five titles stripped should be thebare minimum.

And of course they should be awarded to the runners up. What else can possibly happen?
By:
TheBetterBettor
When: 19 Jun 12 10:49
Vote meeting on the 4th of the July


Will it be Born on the 4th of July or INDEPENDENCE DAY??
By:
Platini
When: 19 Jun 12 10:53
Independence on the 4th, followed by carnage on the 12th  Laugh
By:
mactheknife
When: 19 Jun 12 10:57
Disbelief as SPL prepare to charge Rangers over EBT scheme
Jun 19 2012 By Gary Ralston.

RANGERS sources have reacted with disbelief to news the SPL will charge the club over EBTs before the start of the season.
Former Gers chairman Sir David Murray declined to comment after league bosses declared there was a case to answer in respect of their rules.
Rangers could now be stripped of the titles they won during the period of the tax scheme if it is found EBTs breached the SPL’s regulations.
The league appointed lawyers from Harper McLeod earlier this year but documents on the EBT issue were not forwarded by the Ibrox club until the end of May.
But Ibrox sources are surprised the SPL is forging ahead as they only spoke to one senior club official – not Murray or a director – and only for an hour.
They’ve also questioned the mechanism through which charges can be brought while law lords ponder the complexities of the ‘big tax case’.
Sources insist no decision can be made by the SPL until the big tax case is resolved for fear of prejudicing that case.
However, the SPL are not investigating the legalities of EBTs – only if there were double contracts which is not allowed under SPL/SFA rules.
Ibrox insiders also point out EBTs were disclosed on Rangers’ accounts.
One said: “Details of the remuneration trust were given every year and were passed by the SPL.
“They granted the licence that allowed Rangers to represent Scotland in European football.
“Are the SPL now going to sit in judgment of itself in light of this decision?”
By:
Platini
When: 19 Jun 12 11:31
Desperate, desperate mob. Still pleading their innocence with both hands and feet caught in the cookie jar.

Find some dignity, and accept your punishment.
By:
Northofperth
When: 19 Jun 12 15:46
when will the TEAM 12 players start their pre-season training and where  will that be ? Camperdown Park . And what's going to happen when the ARABS are playing just yards down the road ? Or am I thinking of the wrong team ?Crazy
By:
shudacuda
When: 19 Jun 12 17:06
Its all going pete tong for them now.

Sir Cardigan Smith has just announced that him and his backers have now withdrawn their bid completely.

Alex Thomson on twitter has just said that there has been a massive fraud involved with Rangers.

Liam Craig has also said they cannot change theitr name to The Rangers Football Club without the liquidators permission.

Looks like their could be no team 12 next season.
By:
Platini
When: 19 Jun 12 17:47
What I find the most staggering is that the Old Co club will be able to participate in the vote on whether to allow the New Co a place in the SPL.

ABSOLUTELY STAGGERING SurprisedSurprisedSurprised
By:
mightymoyes
When: 19 Jun 12 17:55
that is just daft, how can something that doesnt exist get a vote??
By:
Platini
When: 19 Jun 12 17:58
that sums up Scottish football  Cry
By:
Outpost
When: 19 Jun 12 18:04
oldco not officially liquidated yet and still officially a member of the SPL so stupid or not . . .
By:
Hussard
When: 19 Jun 12 18:34
Wily Mitty thought he'd slither in once the reaper and hector had gone and the buns would have a saviour. I can just see him today "Oh God there's more, sorry Sally we're out until I can seem like the new Minty Moonbeams".

Glasgow is still Green and Whyte at the Big Hoose !!!
By:
Shrewd_dude
When: 20 Jun 12 12:38
Old co. doesn't meet criteria of being a member of SPL though. No stadium, no players and has made it clear it will not be playing football in the future. One would imagine on that basis that their membership would therefore be revoked and they wouldn't get a vote but it is the SPL we are talking about here.
By:
mactheknife
When: 21 Jun 12 09:42
Rangers ready for life in Scottish Football League first division.

Rangers’ opening league game of next season will be on Aug 11 at home to Dumbarton in the first division of the Scottish Football League, if major moves behind the scenes to resolve the Ibrox crisis are successful, Telegraph Sport can reveal.
Informal but intensive talks involving several parties have taken place and will continue throughout the week.
The belief is growing that the single solution with a significant chance of achieving a consensus will be the readmission of Rangers to the Scottish Premier League as a newco - but with the sanction of immediate relegation because of past misdeeds. Several obstacles have yet to be negotiated for this outcome to prevail.
For a start, most chairmen of non-Old Firm clubs want a change in the voting structure of the SPL, from the current 11-1 majority required for key issues, such as distribution of TV revenue, to a 9-3 majority. Some hope that the consortium headed by Charles Green, which achieved control of Rangers last week, will agree to a pact on the voting process - which would leave Celtic as sole supporters of the 11-1 rule – before the general meeting of SPL clubs considers the application for admission by the Ibrox newco at Hampden Park on July 4.
However, if Rangers are relegated, Celtic would no longer have their Old Firm ally to veto any such proposal for change, which Dundee - last season’s first division runners-up and next in line for promotion - would support on their admission to the top league.
Meanwhile, the SPL has stated that charges, in respect of unregistered payments to players when Sir David Murray controlled Rangers, will be brought once the status of the club is clarified. While this raises the question of how far the new entity should continue to be punished for the sins of previous owners, it also allows chairmen of other SPL clubs - who are under pressure from their fans not to permit free access to a newco - to minimise the potential all-round damage by demoting Rangers and gambling on the assumption that the Ibrox club would regain their top-flight status within a year.
An additional and crucial calculation - that has yet to be verified by the broadcasters - is that the SPL’s TV contracts would not be affected materially if Rangers were to be absent for a single season, despite the loss of by far the biggest fixture on the schedule, the Old Firm derby, which guarantees substantial viewing figures four times a season. Telegraph Sport understands that if the broadcast contracts should be torn up, there will be an immediate move to set up a dedicated SPL TV channel.
A number of first division sources – whose club representatives met yesterday – have told Telegraph Sport that they want the SPL to compensate them for agreeing to accept Rangers into their ranks. “If Rangers play to their potential we are effectively competing in a dead championship for the next year,” one said last night.
The SPL’s response is likely to be that the presence of Rangers in the lower league would increase the other clubs’ revenue by up to £250,000 apiece, but the mood within the SFL is to play hardball on that issue.
As for Rangers, Green has previously stated that the best outcome would be simple admission to the SPL as a newco and he returned to the theme on Wednesday when he said, on his club’s online TV channel: “Look, we’ve always said that we bought the club because we want to play a team in Europe, we want to rebuild the image of this club, and everybody wants to play in the Premier League. Whether that can happen is out of my control. It’s in the hands of the other members of that league but my emails are blocked at the moment with fans thanking me for saving their club and making it very clear that Rangers fans will unite whether we play in the SPL, the First Division or Third Division.
“I know Rangers fans will not desert this club but it’s important, not just for Rangers but for the whole of Scottish football, because the financial implications for the whole of Scotland, not just for SPL clubs, is a massive, massive problem to face up to.
“There is no easy solution. It’s something we all have to deal with, we all have to take responsibility for and we all have to come up with something that works, not just for an individual club, but for the whole collective.”
Green added: “I think some of the views we see and some of the comments are not based on business and, of course, the criticism I regularly get burdened with is, for me, every decision is about business. It’s not about passion, it’s not about commitment to a cause. It’s purely about doing what is right financially because if there is no money - and that doesn’t just include Rangers FC, it includes the SFA, SPL and the old mantra of going right down to grass roots football, we go out of business.”
Green’s mention of the SFL third division was a reference to the publicly expressed belief among some Rangers fans that it would be better to start at the bottom of the league pyramid and work back to the SPL over three years - during which the newco is, in any event, banned from competing in Europe - in a self-imposed exile that would have the additional purpose of inflicting pain on top league clubs by depriving them of TV, sponsorship and corporate revenue.
That prospect is diminishing, Telegraph Sport has learned. One SFL chairman described the prospect of Rangers playing through Scottish football’s bottom tier, as “an invitation to carnage.” He added: “It raises too many questions about policing and resources and also a gross mismatch of resources. In fact, there is now a greater chance of the SFL refusing to allow Rangers admission if they are rejected as a newco by the SPL - so where will they play and who will they play against if that happens?”
More immediately, Green stated that he and Ally McCoist will meet the players on their return from holiday next week to discuss their status. It is his belief that their contracts shifted automatically to the newco, a view disputed by PFA Scotland.
“We, as a newco, started having discussions and, as far as we are concerned, all the contracts transferred under Transfer of Undertakings (Protection of Employment). They’ve also been having holidays and taking their families away so it has been more difficult with the playing staff than the non-playing staff.
“We’ve been speaking to the PFA though and to individual agents and, as the players come back next week, Alistair and I will be sitting down with them and explaining where we are.”
Also on Wednesday night, two Glasgow property developers - Alan Stewart and Steve McKenna - claimed to be preparing a bid worth £11 million for the club. The men are directors of a scaffolding firm in Glasgow but their business past includes an episode which will resonate in depressing fashion with fans. When matters were seemingly going well for them in property development – in 2007 - they claimed to have a turnover of £134 million a year and to have constructed 14,000 flats worldwide. Three years later their original company, Stewart & McKenna Ltd - which was founded in 2005 - was placed in the hands of liquidators, Buchanan Roxburgh, after being taken to court by HMRC over an unpaid tax bill of £78,000.
By:
TheBetterBettor
When: 21 Jun 12 10:04
Feck that....

Livingston got dumped into  Division 3 for a lesser crime.
By:
TheBetterBettor
When: 21 Jun 12 18:03
HEARTS

On the line for around £600,000 in lost revenue if the TV deal takes a heavy hit with no Rangers in the SPL, money – including the £800,000 Rangers owe them for Lee Wallace – will dictate their attitude. Hence director Sergejus Fedotovas’ take: “Justice is very important but lessons learned are more valuable. Scottish football should not put all focus on the punishment.”

How they might vote: Certain to back a Rangers return.


------------


www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18539483

Rangers newco will not get Hearts vote, says Vladimir Romanov
  LaughLaughLaugh

Hearts plan to vote against Rangers being allowed into the Scottish Premier League when clubs vote next month.

The company which ran Rangers until last week is soon to be liquidated and Charles Green's consortium has bought the Ibrox club's assets.

Green wants his 'newco' Rangers to replace the old one in the SPL and needs the support of seven other clubs.
Continue reading the main story

    “Without these people football will become cleaner and stronger”

Vladimir Romanov Hearts owner

Hearts owner Vladimir Romanov says "the football mafia represented by Rangers' former owners" should not gain entry.

In a lengthy statement on the Hearts website, Romanov expressed "deepest condolences'" to Rangers supporters "who have been lied to for so many years".

The issue of whether Rangers will appear in next season's SPL gathered pace when attempts to exit administration via a company voluntary arrangement failed and the club began heading for liquidation.

Should Green's group not get the required votes for top flight football, they would have to apply to fill the vacancy that would be created in the Scottish Football League and attempt to work their way up from Division Three.

Motherwell have asked their supporters to vote on how the Fir Park club should vote on Rangers' application on 4 July while Kilmarnock have expressed concern about the financial implications of an SPL without the Ibrox side.

Rangers entered administration in February over unpaid tax and HM Revenue Customs' vote against the CVA proposal prompted the setting up of a newco.
Rangers: in or out?

    The company which had run Rangers until 14 June 2012 will shortly be liquidated
    A new company (newco) has bought Rangers' assets, including Ibrox Stadium
    The newco wants to replace the old company in the Scottish Premier League
    An 8-to-4 majority of SPL member clubs, including Rangers, is required for the newco to be admitted
    If 5 or more clubs vote no, Rangers will need to apply to be admitted to Scottish Football League Division Three

"It had to happen sooner or later," said Romanov.

"Victories were achieved not by sporting merits, but through slander, conspiracies amongst players and their poaching via third parties, unfair pressuring of referees, who in themselves are as valuable to the fabric of football as the football stars themselves.

"All of this brought hollow victories and destroyed football.

"There is a saying about digging a grave for someone: you get it for yourself.

"Without these people football will become cleaner and stronger.

"Supporters deserved a new beginning and have to accept the fact that their club has to start from the lower league, keeping order in the SPL and without creating unfair competition with other clubs."

Romanov also turned his ire on media mogul Rupert Murdoch for what the Lithuanian-based bank owner perceives as an imbalance between television revenues for clubs in Scotland in England.

"As regards the pitiful state of Scottish football finances, a lot of the blame should be placed at the doors of Murdoch's media," added Romanov.

"They pay huge sums to English clubs, whilst in Scotland, where football is better supported per capita than anywhere else in Europe and there are more cable or Sky subscribers per capita than in England, clubs receive peanuts for their broadcasting rights."
By:
TheBetterBettor
When: 21 Jun 12 18:04
Hearts owner Vladimir Romanov says "the football mafia represented by Rangers' former owners" should not gain entry. Laugh
By:
iamajambo
When: 21 Jun 12 18:15
Good.
By:
shudacuda
When: 21 Jun 12 18:32
Well done MAD VLAD.

Looks definite now that no club 12 in the SPL next season.
By:
Northofperth
When: 21 Jun 12 18:39
There will be a Club 12 in the S. P. L. It's just that their identity is as yet unknown . How ironic is it that it could be Dundee F. C.
By:
Shrewd_dude
When: 21 Jun 12 18:47
In Vlad we trust. Perfect timing and spot on as usual.
By:
TheBetterBettor
When: 21 Jun 12 22:06
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18539483

Dundee United say "no...."
By:
tambhoy5
When: 21 Jun 12 22:50
That awkward moment when the tax-man turns up at Ibrox


So the general feeling in regards to what's happening here,is that Celtic and Aberdeen are having a Mexican stand off to be the one to put the final nail in the Newco's coffin.Somebody tell them a joint 'get it up youz' statement would suffice.....-M-
Like ·  · Share · 3 · 2 minutes ago ·LaughLaughLaughLaughLaughLaugh
By:
liamcol
When: 21 Jun 12 23:14
Mad Vlad is mad as a box of frogs, but you have to admit, he knows the score, love the guy.
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