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did jesus of the new testament exist??

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Replies: 563
By:
dustybin
When: 26 Jan 17 16:22
Like I have said I dont argue I am sinless by whatever meaning of the word that is supposed to convey.
I for eg have conscience that doesnt sit well with a number of choices I make.
That could be the manifestation of the things you interpret.
My reluctance to ask God for forgiveness was based on that conscience too based on the belief that i might do the same mistakes again.
But as you have suggested I am bound to make those mistakes and having asked him to help then this puts me in his care.
Since (and I will have to look in greater detail later) I dont think I am guilty of any of the ten commandments (but I will look, and if I am I will ask for help there too)

But ultimately if it suits your christian conscience then within a few days I will ask god to forgive me, and I will discard my belief of that being immoral and we shall see how that goes.
As Ive mentioned previously I think faith grows, and as I have non to very little right now perhaps he will give me some.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 16:25
the interpretation of the text belongs to God. As it is with every written book, the interpretation of the author.

"Although it is impossible to obtain exact figures, there is little doubt that the Bible is the worlds best-selling and most widely distributed book. A survey by the Bible Society concluded that around 2.5 billion copies were printed between 1815 and 1975, but more recent estimates put the number at more than 5 billion."
By:
howard
When: 26 Jan 17 16:26
How do the other apes fit in ? We are closer relatives to chimps than african elephant is to indian elephant. That is SCIENTIFIC FACT.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 16:27
sincerity in all things?
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 16:29
If you want no part of God, want to be a monkey? it's your choice. Believe Science over God? or have science as a tool and believe in God.
By:
dustybin
When: 26 Jan 17 16:32
sincerity in all things?

Well I love the idea of the picture you paint so what is the difference when you base yours on the result of your own interpretation?
By:
dustybin
When: 26 Jan 17 16:39
If I interpreted howard's remark correctly he is asking what relationship has god with the apes given we are (cough cough) evolved from them?
By:
dustybin
When: 26 Jan 17 16:42
God loves a sinner apparently.
Personally I hope he has a developed sense of humour too Grin
By:
dustybin
When: 26 Jan 17 17:21
By the way zorro,
I was in a relationship with a woman some years back who was of a similar persuasion as you and she asked me 'If you dont believe religion is true where are all the missing links?'
I must admit it wasnt something I considered but the answer is rather worrying dont you think?

The 'missing links' being killed off by the very species that was entrusted to carry the most important of all messages as the only means of passing on faith. (since everything is witness of somebody else)
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 20:20
there is a lot of missing links? you can't find missing links in the human species? one species? but there's a lot of missing links in millions of species? where are the ancestors of the bat? the spiders? any creature out there. Because they all appeared at once in the Cambrian explosion - And why if you look in the fossil record are there Spiders that haven't changed in millions of years? if it was millions of years? Scientists(some of them) out there think there might not be such a thing as time, that everything happens all at once like a computer program.

scorpions
spiders
crocodiles
fish -  that they told us were extinct but rediscovered in deep oceans.

"the coelacanths were thought to have gone extinct 65 million years ago, until a living specimen belonging to the order was discovered in 1938. A living fossil is a living species of organism that closely resembles species otherwise known only from the fossil record." wiki

So man is evolving - but spiders cannot? or any other creature that has weathered time for sixty million years?
If some animals go extinct and vanish from the fossil record, did they evolve into something else? like the dodo?
By:
dustybin
When: 26 Jan 17 20:45
Survival of the fittest essentially picks off the low hanging fruit by way of the better adapted creatures live while those not adapted dont.
If something lives in an environment with few predators then I suspect evolution is slower since the dangers are fewer.

The crucial part though is that neanderthals were wiped out as they were a perceived danger and or competed for resources....that is after the **** sapians f ucked em first.
The ginger gene is the remnant of the neanderthal.

that again isnt really the question though, which was, does it not make you uncomfortable that those responsible for wiping out so many species are the very ones and the only source chosen to carry your message.....as a result of them themselves being told?
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 20:54
Death is a beautiful concept - a simple switch - off.

I loved it for twenty five years... no problems, I saw how everybody collects all sorts of guff in their lifetime. Butterflies, paintings, stamps, videos, books, pottery and ceramics, music and a thousand other things. People find anything to burn up their time. Some even choose the deathwish and burn time faster by eating too much, drinking too much or increasing stress levels with a career. Most people don't fear death, I didn't fear it. But now, i'm fearful for others that cannot comprehend eternity. They think it's all an abstract joke. Something to talk about over a pint or a forum? I know for a statistical fact that Jesus existed. He fulfilled three hundred prophecies and that was impossible.
You can imagine anything to get away from Him but he's going to catch up to everyone.
The creator gave us laws and grace to teach us. Some will fail the test. because they prefer to be blind. They refuse the gift of grace. they prefer the law. the rules.
You choose to imagine that God is a torturer of humanity. Those that refuse to drop their sins in the garbage might get that wish fulfillment vision right. eternal suffering?
I believe God made man a spiritual being, one that needs dreams to live, music and art for the soul. That soul is immortal and cannot die. Covered in sin, God cannot allow sin to persist so he will drop those that love their sins into the pit. The rest of Isaiah 61 will be fulfilled by Jesus. All evil will be swept away. He'll rule for a thousand years on the throne of David and then take up his place in heaven forever. All the prophecies are true and cannot change. the promise of God is a sure thing.

keep mocking him, keep up with all the BS. I see Israel coming again into the land, i see the high priests after 1,947 years in that land. Israel was formed in nov 1947, Pascal talked about this happening centuries ago. Its a reality, Jerusalem is part of Israel again(prophecy) because of a war against several nations in 1967. This is the jubilee year - perhaps the last jubilee year. Israel was destroyed in 70 AD - now israel is 70 this year. One generation in the land.

I think I'll soon know if I'm right - I won't be waiting very much longer for the coming King.

But you can stick to the world's story of Monkeys changing into men.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 21:04
The historical evidence for Jesus himself is extraordinarily good. …. From time to time people try to suggest that Jesus of Nazareth never existed, but virtually all historians of whatever background now agree that he did

NT Wright, Oxford & St Andrews Universities, in the Guardian
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 21:26
For as Daniel hath said that the wise shall understand, so he hath said also that none of the wicked shall understand.

If then the Prophesies which concerned the Apostolique age were given for the conversion of the men of that age to the truth & for the establishment of their faith, & if it was their duty to search diligently into those Prophesies: why should we not think that the Prophesies which concern the latter times into which we are fallen were in like manner intended for our use that in the midst of Apostacies we might be able to discern the truth & be established in the faith thereof, & consequently that it is also our duty to search with all diligence into these Prophesies. And If God was so angry with the Jews for not searching more diligently into the Prophesies which he had given them to know Christ by: why should we think he will excuse us for not searching into the Prophesies which he hath given us to know Antichrist by? For certainly it must be as dangerous & as easy an error for Christians to adhere to Antichrist as it was for the Jews to reject Christ. And therefore it is as much our duty to indeavour to be able to know him that we may avoyd him, as it was theirs to know Christ that they might follow him.

the spelling is accurate for the time period - some text from Sir Isaac Newton. Another Bampot who believed in Christ. Some say he was the smartest guy to have lived. But Dusty bin and Foinavon know better. He was just another mug.... who wrote over a million words about God,and did some part time science stuff in between his religious studies.
By:
cardifffc
When: 26 Jan 17 21:33
zorro.......you know its 2017 and not 1617......
By:
Foinavon
When: 26 Jan 17 21:43
Cardiff, scanning zorro's meanderings, it's easy to see why religion can be so dangerous in the wrong hands. The poor brainwashed followers would do anything if they thought it would lead to the fulfilment of prophecies or has been ordained by their deity.
By:
cardifffc
When: 26 Jan 17 21:47
we must be grateful he"s not a muslim
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 21:49
Some I know will be offended that I propound these things so earnestly to all men as if they were fit onely for the contemplation of the learned. But they should consider that God who best knows the capacities of men does hide his mysteries from the wise & prudent of this world and reveal them unto babes. They were not the Scribes & Pharisees but the inferiour people who beleived on Christ & apprehended the true meaning of his Parables & of the Prophesies in the old Testament concerning him. The wise men of the world are often too much prepossest with their own imaginations & too much intangled in designes for this life. One has bought a piece of ground, another has bought five yoke of Oxen, a third has Married a wife, & therefore since they are for the most part otherwise ingaged it was fit that the poor and the maimed & the halt & the blind & those that are in the high ways & hedges should be also invited. God who intended this Prophesy chiefly for their sakes is able to fit their understandings to it. And it is the gift of God & not of human wisdom so to understand it as to beleive it. - sir isaac newton - ya dilberts
By:
cardifffc
When: 26 Jan 17 22:03
do you believe in the adam and eve creation story??......its a simple question...........can I please have a yes or no answer ......no long speech.............just a yes or no
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 22:08
yes

But the designe of them is to try men & convert the best, so that the church may be purer & less mixed with Hypocrites & luke-warm persons. And for this end it is that they are wrapt up in obscurity, & so framed by the wisdom of God that the inconsiderate, the proud, the self-conceited, the presumptuous, the scholist, the sceptic, they whose judgments are ruled by their lusts, their interest, the fashions of the world, their esteem of men, the outward shew of thing or other prejudices, & all they who, of how pregnant natural parts soever they be, yet cannot discern the wisdom of God in the contrivance of the creation: that these men whose hearts are thus hardned in seeing should see & not perceive & in hearing should heare & not understand. For God has declared his intention in these prophesies to be as well that none of the wicked should understand as that the wise should understand, sir isaac newton = loving this guy
By:
cardifffc
When: 26 Jan 17 22:09
not going to read the speech..........youre a fu**ing imbecile
By:
cardifffc
When: 26 Jan 17 22:12
how do you expect people to take you serious when you believe in a talking snake
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 22:14
sir Isaac Newton is dealing out the smacks to your heads ladies...
Wherefore if Christ thought it just to deny a signe to that wicked & adulterate generation notwithstanding that they were God's own people, & the Catholique Church; much more may God think it just that this generation should be permitted to dy in their sins, who do not onely like the Scribes neglect but trample upon the law and the Prophets, & endeavour by all possible means to destroy the faith which men have in them, & to make them disregarded. I could wish they would consider how contrary it is to God's purpose that the truth of his religion should be as obvious & perspicuous to all men as a mathematical demonstration. Tis enough that it is able to move the assent of those which he hath chosen; & for the rest who are so incredulous, it is just that they should be permitted to dy in their sins. Here then is the wisdom of God, that he hath so framed the Scriptures as to discern between the good and the bad, that they should be demonstration to the one & foolishness to the other.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 22:15
not a snake bozo - ignorant monkey - it's a serpent. You get that from Holywood?
By:
pumphol.
When: 26 Jan 17 22:16
In the story of the loaves & fishes was there any mention of a very large net.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 22:28
http://www.newtonproject.ox.ac.uk/view/texts/normalized/

Oxford has made available some of the one million words that SIR ISAAC NEWTON wrote about God.

Previously in Latin.

isn't that nice - that they take the time to do this.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 22:29
i'm sorry I'm mocking the afflicted. The blind ones.
By:
Foinavon
When: 26 Jan 17 22:51
I've been watching "The Cult Next Door" on BBC2 this evening. Quite an eye-opener. I hope you watched it too Zorro.

Zorro is is a well-educated man of normal intelligence brought up through the British education system. Somewhere along the line he became indoctrinated into a religious cult and believes that every word in its religious book is the word of god and therefore true.
He is what you might call a religious fundamentalist.
We know this has happened time and time again. The mind control system was perfected long ago by bronze age tribes and is still very effective today despite our greater knowledge of the way the world works giving the lie to many of the ancient claims.

Amazing innit?
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 23:07
excuse me o enlightened one. the people of the bronze age was just as smart as you.

there has not been any advancement in brain matter since those times. They had cutting tools that are comparable to steel. Drop you on the moors and you'd be poorly adapted to it.

You are the beneficiary of technology which came from Steam power. We still rely on coal and oil. Your tech is all reliant on minerals that are in short supply - tungsten is running low. Mineral shortages will start to impinge on your vision of the future.
By:
Foinavon
When: 26 Jan 17 23:27
Where did I say that bronze age people were not as smart as people today?
We are the beneficiaries of the painstaking work of many thousands of scientists and a few inspired geniuses who discovered that the earth is not the fixed centre of the universe but revolves around a very ordinary star on the edge of a galaxy containing billions of other stars, our galaxy being one amongst billions of others. Men and women who discovered a myriad of other things not known to the bronze age tribes such as the cause of many natural phenomena, rainbows, earthquakes, volcanoes, the water cycle, thunder and lightening etc. In the bronze age, these were mainly attributed to the changing moods of deities. You can probably find examples in your book.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 23:27
A cult is usually a short lived closed off community of people with strictures imposed upon it by madmen.

Christianity's message is one of freedom from evil. Nobody brainwashed me. I chose it freely in my late twenties. I haven't spent more than £5 on my beliefs - a bible from Ebay.

There is nothing to win on your side - you are the loser here.

God's gonna kick the trash to the kerb. You still can claim a victory if you are smart but you are not as smart as you think. You'll keep posting and commenting on Christ as a false god. I've shown that the old testament is separate and verified from the new testament. Ive shown prophecy from the OT. Jesus changed the world - the year is 2017 dated to Christ. The historicity of the messiah is guaranteed by oxford and Cambridge and the majority of Historians - only those that have sins they cannot drop, hang on to the faint hope they will not be judged. They think some petty episode in their life is unforgivable and cannot be absorbed by Christ. They are special in their sins. God can forgive Satan if he wants to do it.

2017 in christian years - God gave us 6000 years. Adam was 4004 BC, by some count of ages in the bible. The 6000 years are over. You made it to the end.

i'm going on up to the spirit in the sky... you can stay here and suck yer thumb.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 23:32
Some reverence for science - top voted physicist on gogle - Sir Isaac Newton - you accept his work in science and throw out everything else?

the third top voted physicist James Clerk Maxwell - devout christian.

the second guy - einstein talks about God a lot.


three smart scientists tell you - God exists?

You have been blinded by God. You won't see it. You can't see it. It's so fkin funny.
By:
Foinavon
When: 26 Jan 17 23:34
Keep repeating the mantra. Whatever you may think. it doesn't make it true.
I'm off to bed, carry on posting if it makes you happy. Grin
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 23:47
mantras are Buddhist, part of your pal Satan's portfolio.  who's doing a fantastic job recruiting little anti christs into the beast system. Anti - means opposing, in opposition to..
You've placed yourself in opposition to christ here.
John says you are anti christ.

A typical normal person usually does not discuss the validity of God at all. they just get on with their day. You have actively opposed him. Bravo. How stupid is that?

Because even if it's a 1 in a thousand he exists - you've been opposing him.

please tell your wife what you've been doing.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 26 Jan 17 23:50
The historical evidence for Jesus himself is extraordinarily good. …. From time to time people try to suggest that Jesus of Nazareth never existed, but virtually all historians of whatever background now agree that he did

NT Wright, Oxford & St Andrews Universities, in the Guardian
By:
Foinavon
When: 27 Jan 17 10:01
You have been blinded by God. You won't see it. You can't see it. It's so fkin funny.

A typical normal person usually does not discuss the validity of God at all. they just get on with their day

That's rich coming from you Zorro, but you don't see it do you? Laugh
By:
Breedingmad
When: 27 Jan 17 11:16
What Zorro is really doing is looking for a reason why he will be alive when he's dead.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 27 Jan 17 11:23
I do see it - your wife has made a choice like me. you call me deluded , a cultist for being a christian. you said your wife was a christian too. Is this how you see your wife's choice.

All the christians out there know that Jesus is coming back very soon. They keep watch for the groom. You are faffin about with some earthly BS while God prepares it all. What's more important than your eternal soul.

normal people don't give a thought to God who are unbelievers, you are actively in opposition to God. polluting the waters for others.

History department's say Jesus existed - Constantine the emperor believed it. The Protestant church fought to keep the true faith, men died to wrestle it from Latin into english. You belittle generations of faith with the intellect of the pot bellied man of the 21st century. With a burp, you say Sir Isaac Newton was a twit and knew nothing. Well the man spent half his life in the bible's pages.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 27 Jan 17 11:25
I am dead to this word, mate. I admit it. I'm with Christ.
I'm part of the bride of Christ.

You marry yourself to all evil.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 27 Jan 17 11:41
The Year of the Lord’s Favor

The Spirit of the Sovereign Lord is on me, because the Lord has anointed me to proclaim good news to the poor.
He has sent me to bind up the brokenhearted,to proclaim freedom for the captives and release from darkness for the prisoners to proclaim the year of the Lord’s favor
(Jesus repeated that bit in the synagogue - then completed it in actions)“Today this scripture is fulfilled in your hearing.”

(jesus will now do this part)

and the day of vengeance of our God, to comfort all who mourn,and provide for those who grieve in Zion—to bestow on them a crown of beauty instead of ashes, the oil of joy
instead of mourning, and a garment of praise instead of a spirit of despair.
They will be called oaks of righteousness, a planting of the Lord for the display of his splendor. They will rebuild the ancient ruins and restore the places long devastated;
they will renew the ruined cities that have been devastated for generations. Strangers will shepherd your flocks; foreigners will work your fields and vineyards.
And you will be called priests of the Lord, you will be named ministers of our God.
You will feed on the wealth of nations, and in their riches you will boast.
Instead of your shame you will receive a double portion, and instead of disgrace
you will rejoice in your inheritance. And so you will inherit a double portion in your land, and everlasting joy will be yours. “For I, the Lord, love justice; I hate robbery and wrongdoing. In my faithfulness I will reward my people and make an everlasting covenant with them. Their descendants will be known among the nations and their offspring among the peoples. All who see them will acknowledge that they are a people the Lord has blessed.” I delight greatly in the Lord; my soul rejoices in my God.
For he has clothed me with garments of salvation and arrayed me in a robe of his righteousness, as a bridegroom adorns his head like a priest,and as a bride adorns herself with her jewels. For as the soil makes the sprout come up and a garden causes seeds to grow, so the Sovereign Lord will make righteousness and praise spring up before all nations.

oil - holy spirit
seeds - the word of god
bridegroom - Jesus
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