Vaniteux high class over hurdles against older horses, novices even good ones like Douvan have to improve to their level, not the other way around. Over fences Douvan showed no signs of improvement as of yet(jumping also questionable), his best form is still the Supreme against mostly poor opposition, with the exception of a nice stayer in Shaneshill and a horse in L'ami Serge who kept on hitting road blocks who would've been alot closer with a different ride. That form doesn't deserves anything short of 4/1, if Mullins is right which is usually the case then a 2/1 I'm happy to avoid, but at odds-on I have to build a case against and take him on.

The new one beat vaniteux convincingly, rock on ruby has beat him, he finished behind vautour and josses hill in the supreme.
douvan in rich ricci words could be the best horse he has, and willie and ruby says he's as good a novice as they've ever bring to cheltenham before the supreme.
was going past all the other more experianced horses at home on the bridle And just because you have money on vaniteux, your trying to argue that vaniteux would beat douvan over hurdles.

Ar mad only run left handed was poor, and he's not 100% going to line up for this reason.
Vaniteux your saying is a top 10 hurdler. there is a vast difference between faugheen
Then nicholls canyon and arctic fire, then the new one and my tent or yours, then the rest like kitten rock and vaniteux way down the pecking line.
Douvan won 3 grade 1s and a grade 2, hes been off the bridle once when he easily beat shaneshill a grade 1 and grade 2 winner, sizing john a grade 1 winner and lami serge a graded winner. Nicholls canyon was the 2nd string to douvan last year and he's a 5 time grade 1 winner.
vaniteux won 2 races, a class 3 and a class 4 novice hurdle from 11 attempts over hurdles . Not one horse who has finished behind vaniteux over hurdles has won anything better than a class 3 novice hurdle
how in your wildest dreams do you think douvan would have to improve over hurdles to be upto his standard.

"Vaniteux your saying is a top 10 hurdler"
The best horses take part in the CH, no matter how bad they run in it they have proper credentials for being in it. Vaniteux was one of them last season, finished 2nd to TNO on his best form over 2 miles.

Who assigned NC as the 2nd string ? NC was first string in the Neptune as Douvan will never stay beyond 2m. Shaneshill is a below top class stayer, no chance of competing in against older hurdlers over 2 miles and he gave a proper battle to Douvan. L'ami Serge had a path full of misfortunes in the Supreme and with a proper ride could've won.

Douvan won 2 out of 3 G1s from a much lesser horse than any of those 5 I've mentioned.

Ar Mad was given an idiotic quote by his trainer that he wouldn't go left handed, but his only win prior to that was on a left hand track, ironically on the SAME track that he mentioned as the culprit. Since then Moore revised his opinion and said will have to go to Arkle as its the only race available. Ar Mad and Vaniteux looked far better on sectional time analysis against 2 former CC winners in SDG and SS. Of course that doesn't often translates but it indicates quality.

We're being offered evens and shorter on a horse that'll face a couple of serious threats in March at double odds and people in his defence quote Mullins hype talk. Good luck with that but from hearing him talk those that he doesn't say much about are the ones he considers certainties. How he tried to convince us couple days ago that AF rating is a stone better than his other rivals in the 3 mile contest, that would've been true over 2 miles Willie.. Besides, Ruby did say Douvan wouldn't give Faugheen a race so Mullins saying he's the best he brought to Cheltenham was hype talk. Min is in the same category but to be fair I believe Ricci started that hype. That one would really have to be a star as it looks one of the hottest Supreme renewals in years.

Aug 15 / 15:38Single1 Arkle Trophy - 15th Mar 2016  –  OutrightDouvan @ 3/1–£50.00O/Aug 15 / 05:32Single1 Arkle Trophy - 15th Mar 2016  –  OutrightDouvan @ 3/1–£150.00

21-Sep-15
22:16:22

Arkle 2016

Lami Serge - Arkle 2016 
Betfair Bet ID O
15 
50.50
757.50 Open

Eternal optimist.
agreed you don't have to bet and well said.
Anyone whos on vaniteux, kitten rock or glv at big prices, fair play to them. The fields likely to cut up and they have a good ew shouts but what I would say, is so do sizing john and ttebbob if they all line up.
Sizing john and ttebob don't become bad horses over night,

Go on then. Name them.

Don't be trying to trick me now Arkle. The Stout has flown freely and it's on to the Bourbon for me shortly. Don't think I've not noticed the price shortening. You're like that Jewish fella I once asked to borrow £20 off and after a sharp intake of breath he said, "£15 is a lot of money and I rarely lend sums such as £10 so why would you be asking to borrow a fiver?"

You did say 15 if memory serves me correctly.

Somehow forgot faugheen of all horses and I'll throw in felix yonger for good measure

And you haven't even mentioned his best one scooby

If all 22 lined up including vaniteux, over 2 miles where do you think he would finish there?
And I deffinately couldn't be arsed to price them all up.

The big dangers to any short priced Arkle fav. at this time of year areinjury, sickness and on the day the fences. I make it around 1.4 to survive those three leaving 1.6 to beat the other runners.

"I'm really looking forward to runningL’Ami Serge over fences for the first time on Sunday at Plumpton 1.10pm, and we’ve just got to start somewhere. I’ve found it difficult to find the right race to start him in – and it’s the same for several of my top novice hurdlers from last season, there’s a real dearth of opportunity for novice chasers – it’s dire really. He is definitely an Arkle horse, and I would have no worries about the ground for him"
Vaniteux backers will be nervous when this feller bolts up on the bridle. Big thing expected from him over fences and Imo to main danger to douvan.

Yes Henderson certainly overdoes it about lack of opportunities for novice chasers. Timtin I wish you luck if you expect KR to beat Shaneshill 5-10 lengths on Sunday - but I've been wrong before and the ground may help KR.

Nice start from lami serge I was impressed with his jumping.
Shaneshill was very impressive Imo made some novice mistakes and powered away to the line. I'm sure he will get plenty of schooling and looks the jlt winner jn waiting.

Douvan's form franked to no end, so looks very nice for the arkle, with also learning kitten rock won't be winning a graded novice race at the festival

Looks an exciting jumper
Trainer sights firmly on the Arkle
With his breathing problems sorted ( a la Sprinter Sacre )
Seems a e w bet to nothing at 10-1

v. disappointing Kitten today, I thought he'd win it easily.. his form over 2m hurdles miles ahead and yet after 2 out he lacked the turn of foot to put away a stayer and an average horse in Sizing Codelco.. Kitten has the scope of a chaser, jumped the first fence beautifully but I don't know how to explain the lack of efforts at end of race.. head scratcher

Kitten Rock reported to be lame in behind post race Tintin.

I wouldn't write him off just yet myself but he'll not carry my money NTO that's for sure.
Was a very pleasing debut and the way he stopped today when asked did indicate a problem to my eye so was glad to hear something was reported.