That's OK Wickedt. Having read your first sentence I wondered why I had never come across you. Then reading your last sentence I realised I couldn't have cared less. However what you fail to grasp is that when you think the price is right there is always someone who will think the opposite. But according to you they are probably all clueless idiots and all wrong. You must be an amazing punter and if you are what are you doing on the Betfair forum you should be reclining somewhere enjoying your wealth. I've been betting for 50 year and I can assure you I've come across a lot of people who claim to be God's gift of betting but they probably haven't a pot to pee in.
The 'if it is deemed to be poor value' you wrote well that is a personal thing and bears no reflection on the outcome just whether or not the person is right or wrong. And that is the most important thing. How right and how wrong you are? When you get a little older and more experienced you will understand that. The word 'value' is just about the most costly word in betting.

The most important fact is whether or not you can find the horse that can win. If it cannot win then no matter what 'value' it is you will lose. Not backing a certain winner because the price is wrong, in your opinion, is giving up an opportunity. If you are not certain it can win then don't bet it.

Is Australia 'value' at 4/7? Well if he wins at 2/7 what does that tell you? The only thing to determine whether you bet or not is the outcome. If you are not sure he will win then 4/7 is the wrong price. If you are certain he will win then get the best price you can.

Just because someone disagrees with others that doesn't make them an idiot. So may I suggest that you try to understand what a forum is and that if it wasn't for different opinions it wouldn't exist. Though it is on it's last legs because some posters feel the need to insult others without any redress.

Do I think Australia will win? Yes. Will I back him at 4/7? No. Mainly because he may not run due to any number of reasons. Would I lay him at 4/7? Absolutely not. Never lay the best horse in the race. There will be other 4/7 shots that are not the best horse in the race.

If you are certain he will win then get the best price you can

In all the time I've been on this forum I've never seen you say a horse is certain to win. So where are these certain winners and what price do you back them at?

Will I back him at 4/7? No. Mainly because he may not run due to any number of reasons.

And if he's still the same price at non runner no bet?

Just because I don't spend 'my life timing races' or 'calculating ratings' doesn't mean or reading books about probabilities doesn't mean I cannot have a view. You can agree with it or disagree with it that is what a forum is for. Can you understand that?

It wasn't me that told anybody not to back or lay a bet, I wouldn't be quite so arrogant.

doesn't mean I cannot have a view

I still don't know what your view is, you say Australia will piss it but you don't say what price you'd back him at, to me that isn't really a betting view. Unless you're saying he's a 'racing cert', if so I'd still like to know the lowest price you'd take for a 'racing cert'?

I seldom bet 'non runner no bet'

So you don't bet the day before the race or on the day?

So I swerve that thank you

Or was it having to give an answer that you're trying to swerve?

I think Noble Mission is going to Ireland where he stands a better chance of getting cut in the ground and has more time since his run in Germany, but I guess it will depend on the going at York.

There must be a supplementary stage for this race? I suspect a few trainers will fancy a shot.

Brig, it's not about being allowed an opinion, it is your constant ambiguity, hypocrisy and lack of humility when you've got something royally wrong. You always come out with excuses and thus your opinion cannot be trusted. It's too egocentric and desperate to be correct, hence the back-fitting and excuses. People hate that sh1t, I certainly do!

Figgis I was joking ffs. Read it again. I wrote : 'Don't do it Fig.'It was a joke ffs. Some of you guys are so far up each others backsides you must have worms. It was a joke ffs!! Grow up. Do you honestly think for a single moment I think you would listen to what I say? Do you really?

Then you neatly, without any guidance from me, talk yourself into telling everyone how you under rate the older horses while trying to criticise me for thinking the same. How hypocritical you are. Try just having a grown up debate. Your legion of follower will hang on your every word so you will have an audience.

I seldom bet 'non runner no bet' Seldom doesn't actually mean never, it means seldom.

I still don't know what your view is, you say Australia will piss it but you don't say what price you'd back him at,

For someone who is supposed to have common sense why write such rubbish? If I told you what price I would back him at you would question the fact that I didn't know the runners and didn't know the going or any other incidents that may happen in between.

I knew what price to lay Kingman at and I knew what price to back him at in the Sussex, thank you.

I can manage to work some things out myself. I will let you know when the time comes as I have in the past. I have nothing to hide.


You should read that Sin. You may then understand the meaning of what you write. No it doesn't matter I make allowances for you anyway everyone is welcome as far as I am concerned. We all have different piints of view and that's what makes a forum successful.

Stop being childish. When you rate a group of horses you start at the top. So because you cannot grasp the thought let's say the top older horses are an average bunch.
I've said some of the older horses are average Gp1 winners. What do you mean with that Figgis? I don't understand how you can rate a bunch of horses, I find it absurd. You appear to have a problem with the English language Figgis. Or are the rules different for a hypocrite?

If the ground is good to firm and all the opponents in the current betting market turn up what price do you think he should be and what's the lowest price you'd take? Given your annihilation and win by daylight comments it should be easy to answer.

Thats completely hypothetical as far as I am concerned but as I am sruggling to answer the question why don't you tell me what price you will lay him at given the above points? It's easy you know.

No just as I thought when asked you avoid the question. After all you said it was easy. Either it is or it isn't. I never said it was easy you did. All hot air eh? You would know. Why not just answer the question if it's easy? Figgis. Or were you talking rubbish and it's not easy at all?

This shouldn't need explaining, but it appears I'll have to. There is a massive difference between knowing what price you'd take on a horse when you think he'll annihilate all the known opposition and laying one where you think you have 2 or 3 horses running for you but aren't sure if they'll all run. I take it your annihilation and win by daylight comments were also "hypothetical".

he just digs himself deeper, he,ll be recruited by hamas soon

Of the current runners in the market, granted good ground, I would say Aus is a 10/11 chance. However, he is not likely to be that price on the day, he is likely to be something silly like 4/6 or god forbid 1/2, which makes him a no bet price. Why? because he could pull a muscle, meet trouble in-running, and basically has shown NOTHING to say he is that far ahead of the opposition.

hit nail on the head there sint, on the other hand at what will he be a backable price?

4/5 is the best available price now but I'll be surprised if he's bigger than 4/6 when the final runners are known. I don't believe that makes him a 4/6 chance.

Was written yesterday, when he was 4/5 with SJames, assuming you can get on at that price, in your case I'm assuming you could

SJ won't accept my bets. And PP only limited but hey ho.

Again Brigust has trouble understanding what average means. I have sympathy with whoever his maths teacher was

SJ won't accept my bets. And PP only limited but hey ho.

Probably because you insist on aftertiming a price

Night chaps, early start for me tomorrow.

They should be ashamed calling themselves bookmakers

I have A level maths actually Figgis and that was when A levels actually meant something. Not when you went to school.

Yep, everything was better in your day, brigust

So why are you not laying him.

Ffs, my sympathies go to the poor English teacher too, must've had to read every ****g thing twice


This shouldn't need explaining, but it appears I'll have to. There is a massive difference between knowing what price you'd take on a horse when you think he'll annihilate all the known opposition and laying one where you think you have 2 or 3 horses running for you but aren't sure if they'll all run.