anyway, interesting to see if he remains in training next year

Has to be the ground. She sluiced through Soft last year in several of her races.

I suppose with the injuries and so on.. she deserved a bit of luck, I think she got it with the way the draw panned out .. Frankie Dettori must be sick as a pig

I  believe the  Treve  2013 Arc win could be rated much higher than the 133 -134 generally given, because of the draw and ease of victory,she was probably close to a 140 at best,and performed on the wrong ground with a better draw to around 129-130 yesterday,she is brilliant.

Good morning mac,  yes she was in many ways unexposed,possibly a little rushed?,I will always regard her the stayer,over further we may have seen even better,CDA confuses matters,for CDA must be declining over the years but what a fantastic ,brilliant horse CDA was and in many ways underrated for sure.

Boooooom

Some afterthoughts:

1. I ignored C.Heads comment that Treve's last gallop put her at her best, although to be fair I don't think that the media picked up on this very well.Back t0 near her best,(I've rated her below 2013 win) Treve had far too much speed for KH, Taghrooda, Flintshire. She went through on the inside like a ferret up a drainpipe. Excellent ride by Jarnet.Excellent training perhaps the best by any trainer anywhere this year.

2. The pace was not very fast, on fastish ground,which I didn't expect given that a pace maker for Ectot was in, and as a result the first 4 were in the van the whole way.KH was given as great ride from the coffin box draw. The hold-up horses were disadadvantaged especially those  who came wide round the final turn. Their jockeys gave them no chance in the circumstances.

3.I've no idea about Ectot who I thought would show a lot of improvement. He was gicen a poor ride (the jockey showed his Arc inexperience, as did the **** anese jocks) but even so the horse never picked up. Did he bounce? Was the ground to blame? Have I over-rated  him?

4. The bookmakers got this one right in making it 7/1 the field and first 4 places. The japanese horses were over-bet as is now usual.

5. Older horses (5+) seem to have veery little chance in this race.

A losing Arc for me this year. Well done those who kept faith with treve. What a great price.

I do find it odd that a trainer who has failed to get a horse to the track in tip top condition on three occasions out of four then benefits from what may be circumstances can be lauded as performing the greatest training performance of the year.


We know that Treve has had hoof and back problems to overcome, so must have been very difficult to get fit. I'm sure that the Arc has been the target all year so any earlier runs would have been part of the preparation. CH has displayed great skill in getting the horse to run at//near its best after such a  year and i think that judging the trainer on those early runs is harsh in the extreme.

Personally I think she ran her half fit in the Ganay and bottomed her. She never recovered for the POW so she blamed Frankie. Then she gave her an easy in the Vermielle just to tee her up for the Arc. If it had been a gambling trainer he would have been thrown off the stands.

Hi MJ. There is more than one way to skin a cat.

Do you think they will run ROTW in the Champion Stakes?

You think AOB knew more than anyone else? Almost everyone had written her off so I cannot think he thought that. I guess he just expected the ground to be against him. Plus I don't think he expected him, Australia, to get beaten in Ireland and decided not to jump out of the frying pan.

I pretty much agree with Brig about the 'best ever training performance' stuff.

She had a very tough race first time up (which should have been obvious beforehand given the opposition and going) and then was below form next time at Ascot. Whether she already had the back injury or it was caused (or just made worse) by running on fast going in the POW I don't know. She then had a nice rest while she was treated, ran a trial in the Vermeille when not primed or fully fit, and then came back on song in the Arc.

Not sure what 'amazing things' the trainer did - maybe the vets and back specialist deserve the acclaim, but the trainer just did a normal job from what I can see.

will get back too you later on the subject brigust,gotta pick the kids up.

It's always easy to say with hindsight but it was very poor and lazy judgement on my part to not include Treve in the likely winners. As on my figures this year even her POW 3rd gave her an excellent chance in an Arc with no outstanding runner and doubts about the better ones, as was evidenced by the result of Flintshire finishing 2nd, imo. The only runner I had higher at the weights was Taghrooda and I had was inclined to think she'd peaked for the season. Treve was held up at the back in a slowly run Vermeille with a view to keeping her for this race so there were valid excuses that day. I'd been determined to oppose her at short prices earlier in the year, which served me well, and then just got complacent with the idea that she'd been a disappointment this season and didn't have her on my mind. I really should have been looking at her on merit this year in the context of the race and the price available. That said, I wouldn't have had the confidence to have anything more than a small bet on her anyway.

That's OK Felt. I love the 'for no good reason' bit. Magic.

brigust, I think  a lot depends on where TGG goes next? there must be some conflict between the stables?

now which one would prefer conditions in the turf?

It's a flipping mess for ante post punters until we see where they actually go?

So Treve should not have run against CDA because it was no cake walk? What do you expect Group 1 races to be Uncle? Uncompetitive affairs with nothing more than a gallop around? If the trainer had pulled Treve out she would have been accused of bottling it. Why bottle it when you have the highest rated 3yo from last season.

unclebungle = pauvre con

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