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I Guess Thats The End For Me On Here
I Guess Thats The End For Me On Here
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Replies: 189
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One observation that may or may not be relevant..
I know a lot of people used to regularly withdraw and re-deposit balances amongst successful punters/traders , and whilst the cost to BF is relatively minimal, it's certainly undesirable to them...so there is a possibility that even something like that makes you more vulnerable to scrutiny... If BF are scrutinising beyond industry standard average then they are risking losing a key part of their client base, my suspicion is that they aren't, at least currently but open to hearing any other views about it... |
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Yes Brent I was put on a percentage deduction for transferring quite big amounts in and out
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you say you have a losing account on here well maybe they want the bank statements so they can see if you have other losing accounts assessed via deposits/withdrawals which accumulated over the period come to more or make a significant percentage of all income........you are annoyed but some people need protecting from themselves and if you were one of the unfortunate punters who should find a different hobby before they ruin their and perhaps their families lives......betfair may be asked what they did to help identify the potential problem and help to protect you from yourself........im not completely supporting it but can understand it.....
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it's very difficult to argue that's BF's business though, Winja...
if there were a centralised financial rating for the industry, you could just about argue it's validity ( I wouldn't personally) ...but that's an incredibly intrusive and largely irrelevant intrusion to most people's mind, I'd imagine..bank statements etc, lack of co-herent address of true long term pattern/amounts... as said before and other comments that relate to it...this isn't really the area for some of the worst problems, and the various backdoors, evasions to far more damaging gambling are probably not being addressed at the same time. |
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their business is regulated by the gambling act so they have a responsibility to undertake appropriate procedures if they suspect parameters put in place to trigger warnings have been crossed........i suppose the question is what constitutes appropriate...the OP obviously believes the BF requests are not...
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what would be your view, Winja ?
not specifically on the OP... the credibility of fairly arbitrary restrictions without recourse to reasonable discussion and the use of a lot of private documentation to indulge in what to many is an adult leisure pastime... the obvious areas of disproportionate control were cash betting on course or through bookmakers...and FOBT's, Casinos (though I concede I maybe a few years out of date on what has or hasn't been introduced in that regard) |
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Winja 30 Jul 22 19:13
betfair may be asked what they did to help identify the potential problem and help to protect you from yourself....... They operate slots and casino games so claiming that they are trying to save vulnerable people from themselves is a contradiction. It's like a drug dealer restricting someone from smoking weed on one hand but offering them coke with the other. I can't believe there isn't a law being breached here, a company demanding sensitive information, don't companies that do that have to have some sort of qualification/license to show that they competent to handle such information? What about bank statements that has excessively sensitive info i.e. medical/ health transactions? what about info pertaining to spouse's/partners purchases? I'd imagine that it wouldn't survive a court case but bottom line is that the books can just say, fair enough but it's our site and we can kick you out if we want. |
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bookmakers would have to work within the requirements of the gambling commission when dealing with financial documents but i dont think they are looking to see if you have purchased a gross of fiesta durexs they are looking for other gambling transactions and to see if there are bank loans in place which could be used to fund gambling accounts.....they may need to see pay slips if the person is paid cash and not directly in their account.....
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how would that work in regard to some of the earlier discussions regarding people who earn money through gambling...
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brentford.....i believe some people need saving from themselves......im not saying that is the case here but if the trigger has been pulled then due process has to be carried out.....
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Winja 30 Jul 22 20:21
i dont think they are looking to see if you have purchased a gross of fiesta durexs They might not be looking to see if I have purchased a gross of fiesta durex's but if they see my bank statement they will be able to see, whether they want to or not and I don't want them seeing my transaction involving the purchase of a gross of fiesta durex's. That's the point.!! |
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Theres one big problem with Smarkets though... fook all liquidity
If you think its bad on fair ive just tried to put £15 on over 1.5 goals on the inter game in play (smarkets) and cant get it on...  I think its basically big games and events only on there Maybe Purple is slightly better ? |
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duffy i get the point but how else can they undertake their due diligence.....brentford.....i have no bookmaker accounts all have been closed and its a fooking liberty but they are allowed to under current rules......the two are not really the same.......
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Thats my point with bank transactions, they aint asking for a small slip from the atm machine
They want up to 3 months (6 weeks in my instance) worth of transactions ffs, that is oersonal information and they shouldnt be asking for it Theres nothing for me to be embarrased about either, I and others need to stand their ground and tell them to do one Some spotty kid on chat can literally see all your banking behaviour ffs, its fooking comical |
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Let's see the percentage of predominant slots/casino customers targeted as oppose to sports bettors.
All things being equal, the slots players being hit should heavily outweigh the sports bettors being hit. Let's see the figures. |
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If they have any suspicions about banking fraud they should be getting onto the bank about it.. but no they aint interested in that they want to see where ,y wages is going day in day out
Feck off |
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it would be prudent to ensure triggers operate in reasonable manner and allow for anomalies though (through reasoned discussion) ...some of the concern expressed about the methods at work is far from unreasonable and even at it's intended level are pretty borderline in appropriateness ..
levels of commitment from other companies and use of parameters as compared to here here are no to be taken lightly....serious dangers of selective use when not applied through a central mechanism. |
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the liquidity here for the 3pm champs games was probably as bad as i've seen. also notice they've taken down a lot of markets such as first goalscorers(even on televised games) and sending off markets that they used to always offer. place is going downhill fast
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as i say you know what they are looking for and its not fraud.....so if that information is not on your statements then you have nothing to worry about and under the data protection act they can not retain the information.....im sure there is a department within betfair that deals with these issues...i cant guarantee they dont have randolph scotts but i would be surprised if it was not professionally managed.....
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Senyatta
Oh I think we’re seeing the death of sports betting for sure esp the exchange I used to love laying correct scores in the 300 challenge thread but there so poor now once you get towards £250 you cant get matched, not that I get that far 99% of the time but for people who do lay big its nye on impossible unless its on big games This proof of funds stuff has just killed it sooner than expected |
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Winja
The scrote on the chat gets all the transaction stuff... if he/she can see it then anyone can. We’re talking the internet here, nothing is wiped clean ever remember that. Every piece of data leaves a ghost trail. |
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What comes after this if you fall into line with giving banking and wage documents?
Skyping them your penis to make sure your balls have dropped I guess But seriously once they get you giving them that info theyll move into the next round which could be mortgage payments? What next? |
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that does not sound right.....i imagined it would be an email attachment to their accounts department......that would be the only way i would send such information......
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Oh you can send them it in that fasion yes
But thats worse... thats literally an email which as we know isnt exactly private either |
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I was told you can send it throuh a pdf on chat and them its destroyed the moment the agent on the chat has seen and verified it...
Nothing is destroyed online |
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the issue of a lifetime significant profit, pc charge incurring account that suddenly as it may often have, incurs a significant loss and attempts to redeposit to bring balance to appropriate levels ...is met with bank statement requirements and or wage slips ...would previous BF withdrawls be considered sufficient or would lack of direct income preclude your account remaining viably operational..that's unlikely to effect me due to previously mentioned dynamics but that is from what I gather a real concern for some even aside from moral aspects at more basic levels..
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I just about gritted my teeth and gave them my id and address to verify my age and account
But sorry its getting stupid now so.. cant be going further with the dystopian bs |
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I said before, players have been restricted for years anyway by way of limited stakes, so that is proof if you need to see it that there has been business that the books have been quite happy to see the back of and that has been happening long before they could use the "excuse" that this has all been GOVT induced.
They want sports betting dead and long live the casino. What's happening now to the online product is the exact same thing that is happening to bookmakers in the high street, they are vehicles to peddle the crack cocaine of gambling and nothing more....and online is heading in the same direction. The books are taking a punt that if they make it look like they are clamping down by way of restricting certain accounts, and in a lot of cases will be customers who have previously suffered restrictions in any case they won't be analysed to see just who they are letting slip through the net. |
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good to hear a bit of common sense being applied at least Lat' - appreciate your input, and likewise hope is all is good mate..
still think the whole thing is, as so often with this stuff misguided at best... |
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I think it was the quick deposits that triggered mine or it must have been it wasnt said
Bit we’re talking £30 £20 £25 if it was that its pretty stupid |
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He's the only PC payer who I've seen say they've fallen foul of the checks to date.
Think I've posted my travails with Betfair at least twice. It was a nightmare. December 2020 |
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I missed that CB. Were the circs of your similar, ie multiple deposits in a short-period of time?
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And how long had it been since you last paid PC at that point, if you don't mind saying? (forewarned is forearmed)
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Yep, total agreement here Lat' - I'm probably getting too old for this stuff anyway...but I fundamentally disagree with both the implementation and lack of transparency...
if I get blocked, I'll shrug on a personal level but I remember how unique this opportunity was and seeing yet more damage to it's original potential and inappropriate targeting when so much of the industry seems to be remarkably untouched (that may be an illusion on my part as I don't use most of it) is yet another sad moment in a business area that constantly is supported by govt in it's true failings...whether it's losers only bookmakers, high stakes FOBT's against fixed 10 % plus margins , phone apps with non skill games that can cost naive people thousands again at 10% plus rake I'll wager (irony) |
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You can only take people at face value over what they say on here, but so many of those caught up in this are adamant that they don't play any of the peripheral BS that "bookmakers" serve up that it does make you wonder about the real motives, as you say... Throw a few sports bettors to the GC overseers and let the really valuable mugs (I mean clients, aka those with actual gambling problems) carry on doing their nads scot free....
Where does it end? |
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The really pi33 poor thing is I opted out of their casino bs and still get loads of their ads for their idiotic slots, I think we know they aint motivated to ditch those players
Doing your balls on a slot is actively encouraged and no checks are ever carried out |
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yep, golden age age of betting lasted about 4 years max ....no ?
enough money on exchanges to make them viable ..2003-2007...different ownership ...pc charge...more drastic pc charge...promotion of sportsbook over exchange... I do reserve a bit of judgement on the specifics here but yet more negative travel... |
We both know how quickly markets can enter death-spirals....