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***** ARSENAL CHIT CHAT *****

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Replies: 3,498
By:
lurka
When: 04 Feb 19 00:46
Thought we were very poor today, just seemed to accept defeat with little intensity or fight. Sitting back against City, esp with our defence, was suicidal. Would have been nice to see Emery try to get in their faces higher up the pitch and have a go at them where they are weak. The defence is totally unorganised and that has little to do with personnel. He could do a lot to try and fix that.
By:
the fink sisters
When: 04 Feb 19 09:09
OK in parts yesterday but you got the feeling that there was absolutely no belief in the players. To be honest, it wasn't a bad result as I had feared a very heavy drubbing.

A run of fixtures now where we have a chance of picking up some points. Plus Chelsea have Spuds and the Oil Rig this month and United play the Dippers, so we may still be in touch with Top 4. And if you can't clutch at straws, what can you do?
By:
John.W.Henry.
When: 04 Feb 19 09:30
MO....350K per week 4 what ?
We are a shambles.
By:
John.W.Henry.
When: 04 Feb 19 09:32
This club has been left in a complete mess in respect of being a title challenging outfit. We are a million miles from being contenders
By:
jed.davison
When: 04 Feb 19 09:39
Strange, I thought you did OK yesterday, especially after conceding such an early goal.

Also you shouldn't be too disheartened given the defensive injuries you have had, can't be easy for the manager to organise his defence properly when as soon as he organises it a member of it goes down.

FWIW I think you're still well involved in the top four thing, just got to make the most of a decent run of fixtures, think you've only got to play us and Man Utd among the top six between now and the end of the season. Chelsea and Man Utd have what look much harder run-ins.

Be interesting what people on here would consider a successful first season for Emery.
By:
John.W.Henry.
When: 04 Feb 19 09:42
Winning the Europa League.
By:
John.W.Henry.
When: 04 Feb 19 09:45
Nuts and bolts of this is that you simply cannot have a player who is paid £350K per week and if he is fit then not play him in the toughest game of the season ?

If he isnt good enough to play in these fixtures then we just have to get rid and get players in who are good enough !
By:
jed.davison
When: 04 Feb 19 10:00
Ozil is almost the poster boy now for the obscenity of modern football. I'm sure Winston Bogaarde is breathing a sigh of relief.
By:
lurka
When: 04 Feb 19 10:40
Ozil is paid £18m a year. That's another £45m wages before his contract expires. He'll be 32 then and will have little resale value at that age. So the only way we'll get rid is if we release him on a free to a club who will pay him similar over the next 2.5 years, unless he decides to take a pay cut which he may not as it's his last big contract. Not sure the board would even let him go for free.

Emery has done nothing to organise the defence all season. We've been giving away goals from schoolboy defending even with our first choice defenders. Wouldn't be hard to correct if he tried but don't think he has. That sort of mug defending seems to be acceptable to him.
By:
the fink sisters
When: 04 Feb 19 12:26
To answer Jed's question, I think we all just want to see a little forward momentum, but there is little evidence of that so far. We're just about where we were under the apparently now 'hopeless' manager that was Wenger. Given our roster and that of the clubs currently above us, anything higher than sixth would be an achievement. We are a very hit-and-miss side with no consistency. You can bleat about injuries, but every side gets them and I seem to remember we've had just as bad over the years (Matthieu Flamini at right back, anyone?).

I don't think that the Ozil situation is being well handled and freezing out a player on that amount of money means he'll probably stay put until the end of the contract. It was a panic decision to sign him to new terms, though if he had been allowed to leave on a free, there would have been plenty voicing their disapproval, so in one sense you are caught between a rock and a hard place. Emery clearly wants to offload, but I don't think they'll be many suitors - perhaps they'll be able to send him to one of the big clubs in Turkey, where he would be welcomed as a superstar, though we'd end up subsidising the wages.

I do have sympathy for Emery as he's very hamstrung in the transfer market. Mislintat's departure means that Summer recruitment could be chaotic. I'm pleased we've got Torreira, Aubamayang and Gendouzi - all Mislintat signings. My suspicion is that the manager will have a greater say in who comes in for next season and it's telling that some of the names we were trying to bring in on loan had all worked under him previously. I don't know if anyone has an insight into what the Summer transfer budget is but we have new sponsorship deals with adidas and emirates worth £500 million from next season (over a five-year period). We'll also be able to trim the wage bill and offload players (Jenkinson and Cech will save around £160k a week from what I can gather). We are in dire need of a major rebuilding job, particularly at the back.
By:
enpassant
When: 04 Feb 19 12:34
I think it is untenable to suggest the defending was acceptable to him. If that were the case he would have 'got in their faces' and very likely suffered a humiliation that would have put the Liverpool debacle into the shade. We have excuses with an injury list that rivals any Wenger had and the constant changes in players and systems would be hard for any team.
He needs to get to the summer and get rid of the players he doesn't want and get a few that fit his style. I think he is doing OK all things considered though I have some issues with some calls he makes in team selection (that is the case at any club and with any supporters).
If that is as good as City are then they are not a great team by any means. Emery has bags of improvement to come from the younger players at the club and with a few astute additions I think we can be a far, far better side next season than what we are at present.
By:
the fink sisters
When: 04 Feb 19 12:41
.....and good to see you back on here Jed; you're always welcome if your comments are thoughtful and well-constructed rather than of the "we're better than you" variety (which clearly at the moment you are).

I do dip into the Spurs Files 3 from time to time, which is way busier than here since Wenger left, though am alarmed to see that Spurs fans on there seem to be in a minority....
By:
pixie
When: 04 Feb 19 13:00
I agree with all your points, the fink sisters. I would, however, like to see Ozil start against all teams including top 6 sides as when he doesn't play I feel we are missing a creative midfielder like him, to play in the two strikers. I too like all of Mislintat's signings and am very sad to see him go, it wasn't at all long ago when I was delighted that he'd joined the club and we would be moving in a different direction with signings - with Wenger towards the end it was always 'oh no, not another lightweight, technically brilliant, attacking midfielder to join the other five we already have.'

Emery has a huge job of rebuilding at the back, our best centre half, Kos, is getting past it and his most important attribute was always his pace. It's touch and go whether Holding will make it, Mustafi isn't anywhere near good enough, Bellerin might be but is becoming more and more injury prone and needs to work harder at his defending and we need a new first choice left back.

Emery really does have work to do.
By:
the fink sisters
When: 04 Feb 19 13:44
I agree with you broadly about Ozil pixie, but having had a look at the stats, it's impossible to come to any other conclusion than that he is past his prime. In 2015/2016 he provided 19 assists in 35 PL games (when we had, variously, an attack of Giroud, Walcott, Sanchez and Welbeck). That return has been dwindling and I don't think we'll ever see the player of that season again, either for us or anywhere else. Following the Germany fall-out and Emery's 'tough love', he looks very much like a player who has fallen out of love with the game. It's frustrating as an Ozil in prime form is exactly the player we are missing in terms of creativity. Yes, I appreciate that he's a luxury in terms of work-rate (but so is Pierre-Emeric to be honest), but I would like to see them try and re-integrate him into the team rather than freeze him out.

It's a difficult one for Emery, to be fair. He's got a lot of fans on board with his no-nonsense approach to player selection and management and though some of his calls have been questionable, he is decisive. Had Wenger completed his contract, my feeling is Ozil would have started every game if fit this season and we'd be broadly in the same position we are now. Some good performances, some complete guff and a lot of hapless defending.
By:
lurka
When: 04 Feb 19 16:14
and Emery's first signing is Denis Suarez, another lightweight attacking midfielder..... And you playing Ozil with 2 strikers would further unbalance the side

Sitting back against any side with our defence is a ridiculous tactic. We need to get in their faces and keep them away from our defence as much as possible until he sorts it out. That's what City do, their defence is suspect but you have a hard time getting near it. You can barely get out of your own half when they lose the ball - look at the first goal yesterday when Iwobi got caught by their press. Man U had a weak defence and strong attackers under Mourinho and sat back and fared poorly. It's not rocket science. Play to your strengths and make the opponent play in a way they are not comfortable with. Don't rely on the weakest part of your team to get you a result. Nobody gets any change out of City sitting back off them.
By:
EastLower Gooner
When: 04 Feb 19 16:15
Man of the Match yesterday....by far...Granit Xhaka

Did an amazing job stopping City from playing through us. Kept the score down with his awareness and tough tackling. Forced City into constantly switching the ball back out wide.

More please.
By:
enpassant
When: 04 Feb 19 17:34
'And you playing Ozil with 2 strikers would further unbalance the side' ?



enpassant • February 2, 2019 11:13 PM GMT
leno CJ SM LK NM SK LT MN MG MO PEA 451
By:
enpassant
When: 04 Feb 19 17:36
'Sitting back against any side with our defence is a ridiculous tactic'

You posted the same pre- Liverpool and we all know how that panned out.
By:
enpassant
When: 04 Feb 19 17:37
'Nobody gets any change out of City sitting back off them. '


Really ?
By:
enpassant
When: 04 Feb 19 17:47

Feb 4, 2019 -- 4:15PM, EastLower Gooner wrote:


Man of the Match yesterday....by far...Granit XhakaDid an amazing job stopping City from playing through us. Kept the score down with his awareness and tough tackling. Forced City into constantly switching the ball back out wide. More please.


It's the most positive influence Xhaka has had on the team this season.

By:
the fink sisters
When: 05 Feb 19 09:07
Summer transfer budget being reported as £40m. Hmmm....

Can't believe even the Board would be so parsimonious with new sponsorship deals and, potentially, Welbeck, Monreal, Cech, Ramsey, Jenkinson and Lichtensteiner all off the payroll.
By:
the fink sisters
When: 05 Feb 19 09:18
Emmanuel Petit interviewed in the Irish Independent:

“The frustration level must be very high for Emery.

“You look at the money Manchester United, Liverpool and Manchester City spend and unless you join them and put the cash on the table to compete for the best players, you are going nowhere.

“Tottenham are not spending money, but they are in the position Arsenal were in a few years ago building a stadium, but there is no excuse for Arsenal now.

“If you sack Arsene Wenger and then say to the guy who replaces him you have no money to spend on new players, I would ask what was the point of sacking Wenger in the first place?”

Despite Wenger's achievements at the club, it was time for him to go. But the point about funds and backing is an important one. It shouldn't be a surprise to anyone that we are in almost exactly the same position as we were last season.
By:
lurka
When: 05 Feb 19 09:56
enpassant, we sat back against liverpool and got mullered. What game were you watching? I am talking about getting in their faces and pressing them high up the pitch, not just pushing up to the halfway line as a tactic like we did under Wenger. Liverpool pressed us and we were pushed back deep, same with City and we coudn't string any decent attacking play together and were like lambs to the slaughter. You are playing right into the hands of teams like that by sitting off them, which is why they broke the PL points record last year as Liverpool were the only PL team to do it last season. Everyone else sat back and got mullered.

Re City, yes numerous teams have got change out of Pep's City by pressing them high up and not allowing them time on the ball or to play out from the back. Liverpool did it twice last year, Lyon twice this year, Celtic were the first team to do it two years ago. Their defenders are not comfortable on the ball under pressure and make mistakes. If you sit back deep they counter-press as soon as they lose the ball and win it back from you in your own half or else you give away possession by playing a long ball and it starts all over again.

Kroenke will hide behind FFP or whatever he has to come up with an excuse not to spend within the club's means and keep the club's resources for himself. Gazidis was coming out with the same guff about renewed sponsorship deals 5 years ago and Wenger only spent big when he was under pressure.
By:
dambuster
When: 05 Feb 19 10:25
Kroenke
Wenger
Gazidis
ruined the club we love
By:
enpassant
When: 05 Feb 19 19:39
It seems to me lurka that we not only disagree on team selection and tactics but we (perhaps due to that) appear to be watching different games entirely!
By:
enpassant
When: 05 Feb 19 19:40

Feb 5, 2019 -- 10:25AM, dambuster wrote:


KroenkeWengerGazidisruined the club we love


Agreed with the caveat that Wenger started well but couldn't let go; or perhaps I give him credit where there ought to be some scepticism.

By:
the fink sisters
When: 06 Feb 19 10:21
I love the fact that Wenger "started well". Three titles, multiple FA Cups, an unbeaten season and some of the best football I've ever had the pleasure to witness.

Won't be too long before some clown comes on here and says that Wenger never built his own defence.

I don't think it's a coincidence that the club went into a relative decline after the departure of Dein. Since Kroenke took over fully in 2011, that decline has been more pronounced.

If I were to get into my time machine now (it's parked in the shed) and fast forward a decade, I'll see a succession of managers trying to make us competitive against bigger-spending rivals. There will be little or no silverware to show for it.
By:
enpassant
When: 06 Feb 19 16:55
To be clear, I believe Wenger was magnificent in the first half of his tenure. He will take his rightful place in the history of our club alongside the real legends.
This does not hide the fact that in staying too long he, at least in the short term he sullied his status. He earned the the right to be included in the above list- I find that a little hard to face but imho it's true.
By:
EastLower Gooner
When: 06 Feb 19 18:09
Apparently the £45m summer spend is based on us being in the CL.

It’s closer to £20m if it’s the EL and we already know £18m of that will probably go on Suarez.

So a probable £2m to spend....f u c k me.

(obviously not taking into account player sales but how much would realistically get for some of these clowns)

Could end up being Lucas Perez / Gabriel type losses...certainly on the cases of Mustafi and Xhaka.

—-

The players on loan will be key...ESR, Reece, Chambers...and that’s just to hold a EL spot.

Martinez too...we’re skint so no fancy dan no2s.

Leno 1 and Martinez 2.
By:
enpassant
When: 06 Feb 19 18:19
I have yet to read any evidence to back up this claim of £40m odd to spend.
By:
dambuster
When: 07 Feb 19 16:54
The only way forward is to hit Kroenke in the pocket, Don't go and don't buy any merchandise, but as we know, that won't happen
By:
tobermory
When: 07 Feb 19 18:46
People still think - like Gary Neville defending Wenger - that Arsenal don't compete because they don't spend X£000M Confused

Arsenal get dreadful value for money in the transfer market. They spend very poorly for years on end, spending more on the same sort of signings will make little difference.

It's not as if they spend so little anyway. Yes City, PSG et all spend more and are far better, but there are typically another 8 or 9 sides around Europe at any given moment that spend less than Arsenal and have better teams than Arsenal.

eg Shokdran Mustafi is the 6th most expensive central defender in the history of football, and maybe the 37th best central defender in the premier league atm
By:
the fink sisters
When: 11 Feb 19 10:33
Blimey, it's quiet on here.....due mainly to another underwhelming performance, I guess, though it didn't stop the manager talking the boys up.

Is it just me, or does everyone just feel that we're stuck in a groundhog-day hinterland of 5th/6th?
By:
dambuster
When: 11 Feb 19 17:18
Nothing will change until Kroenke goes
By:
the fink sisters
When: 11 Feb 19 17:51
Ramsey's deal announced as £400k a week! Nice lad, dedicated pro and all that, but you can understand why they withdrew the offer.
By:
John.W.Henry.
When: 13 Feb 19 13:00
Letting Ramsey go is a huge mistake. We will only realise that when we try to buy a replacement
By:
John.W.Henry.
When: 13 Feb 19 13:02
Sadly the legacy of the total mismanagement of the preceding 10 years is going to go on and on and on ....................................................................................
By:
Wesdag
When: 13 Feb 19 16:33
Ramsey is an average player on superstar wages.

Could someone please explain what he brings to the table?

Goals? Assists? Tackles won?
By:
John.W.Henry.
When: 14 Feb 19 06:53
I would suggest that Ozil is the average player on superstar wages !!!!

Lets wait and see who we replace Ramsey with and what money we have to pay them

Ramsey brings quality, vision, creativity and heart / determination. Thats what we have got to replace.
By:
the fink sisters
When: 14 Feb 19 12:26
I do like Ramsey but I'm guessing the club would have had to get close to the £82 million that Juve are reportedly paying him over the next four years, so you can understand why they withdrew the offer IF they want to use those funds elsewhere. With Mislintat gone, I expect Emery to have a bigger say on new recruits and to ear-mark players he has worked with previously, so expect some cast-offs from PSG, Valencia and Seville. I think Nkunku looks likely in the Summer.

According to the Telegraph, Ozil is being hawked around China and Italy by "intermediaries", but I cannot realistically see him going unless we pay a chunk of his wages, especially as he's not exactly in the spotlight these days. By my calculations, if they let him go on a free (unlike the AFC Board to sanction this), it will free up £45 million.

I was underwhelmed with a few of the names being bandied around in January (Perisic and James) to name but two - both players on a downward curve imo.
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