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2ND TEST ENG v PAK - HEADINGLEY

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Replies: 928
By:
wondersobright
When: 05 Jun 18 10:54
apologies...you are right buttler was in the 40s when curran was out and broad came to the wicket...so its even more of a sin then for broad to play the d1ck role Crazy half an hour more of buttler and england were looking well in advance of 200 lead

this time its you who is looking with hindsight and saying it wasn't particularly a problem here

well yeah great eng won by an innings but if (and that is a huge IF) pak put together 350 2nd time around, then those runs that were potentially missed out on could have proved way more important than they actually were
By:
wondersobright
When: 05 Jun 18 10:57
and no I haven't cherry picked my stats, I've presented the bare facts that suggest since 2016 in 4 out of every 5 innings in england broad has been out in single figures...that's number 11 form

you can look to his knock in melbourne if you want, the series was dead and my nan could have got a 50 on that pitch
the same melbourne pitch that apparantly excused cook his woeful performance in the ashes which that apart from failure after failure after failure
By:
trader pj
When: 05 Jun 18 13:19
WHY have they put the tennis on ??!
By:
Fatslogger
When: 05 Jun 18 19:56
No, your accusation of hindsight is at least as wrong as mine was. I said after he was out that whatever approach he took was unlikely to matter so I’m not at all basing it on England winning easily, which was always highly likely. Your hypothetical that England could have been under pressure second innings is not much more valid than the counter that if Pakistan were going to bat long (and obviously it didn’t matter either way if they didn’t), that quick runs would reduce the draw risk, especially if bad weather intervened. It’s also clearly not the case that Broad was automatically going to get out playing attacking shots; that he wasn’t going to get out playing defensive shots (this gets forgotten a lot criticising players who get out attacking) and that Buttler wasn’t himself going to be out before they added many more, especially if Broad wasn’t scoring any.

While I’m pointing things out you’ve got wrong, you’ve just inadvertently shown that Broad did actually support Buttler adding more runs. I say it again, from 170 or so on, of course you want more but you don’t really need to be trying to bat conservatively to get them. Your aim, given the large amount of time left in that scenario, is mainly to maximise run expectancy, sure but there should be some intention to score quickly too, as long as that doesn’t have a big effect on expectancy. You wouldn’t, for example, particularly want the set batsman to block four an over unless they were real buffet balls then look for a single fifth or sixth ball.

Also, clearly you have cherry picked your stats. Why two years, not one or three or more? Why no away tests? It’s because it suits your argument, not because of any validity conferred by excluding one good score on a flat deck. In fact, he averages rather more at home than away and at a better SR. At least I owned up to my 24 plus stat being arbitrary and suiting my argument.
By:
wondersobright
When: 05 Jun 18 20:55
While I’m pointing things out you’ve got wrong
lol
By:
wondersobright
When: 05 Jun 18 21:00
Your hypothetical that England could have been under pressure second innings is not much more valid than the counter that if Pakistan were going to bat long
I countered that with the statement 'if and that is a huge if'

correct no away tests considered as batting versus the moving duke ball is a totally different ball game
and last couple of years used as his batting has suffered since being hit on the head (cannot remember exactly when this was so I just took the last 2 summers as my sample size, if you want to go further back then you must accept the relevance of stats dwindles the further you go back)

move on
By:
Fatslogger
When: 06 Jun 18 23:10
I countered that with the statement 'if and that is a huge if'

No you didn’t. That’s in no way a counter to the point I made about also considering the draw, even before you worry about the notion of countering something’s that’s not actually been said yet.

correct no away tests considered as batting versus the moving duke ball is a totally different ball game
and last couple of years used as his batting has suffered since being hit on the head (cannot remember exactly when this was so I just took the last 2 summers as my sample size, if you want to go further back then you must accept the relevance of stats dwindles the further you go back)


Yet Broad has a better average and SR at home.

The head injury was four years ago.

The sampling window issue is a complex one. Suffice to say though, that test careers aren’t long enough to draw remotely meaningful conclusions about recent form and the more narrowly you sample, the less valid your conclusions. So the opposite of what you say is probably more true.

move on

Really? At the end of a post not moving on?
By:
wondersobright
When: 07 Jun 18 12:37
and who the f uck are you to tell me what points I am and aren't making??

you really need to get over yourself

end of conversation, you are blocked
By:
Fatslogger
When: 08 Jun 18 14:01
Lol. Masterful bit of analysis. I just read what you post. If it didn’t cover what you later incoherently said it did you could blame that on me and block me but would be a bit of an odd reaction. Anyway, don’t suppose you’re reading this so I’ll cut it short.
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