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Iain Duncan Smith
Iain Duncan Smith
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We're in a situation that we created in the 1970's - effectively we pour resources into encouraging the least "fit" to procreate.
No other species does this, and its unsustainable. Problem is, you can't pull the rug out from under the feet of these people without being cruel. It took a generation to get into this mess, and in my opinion it will take a generation to get us out. My luvvie-of-centre solution is to set those born from 2016 onward as the "year zeroers" (assuming we agreed on the policy now, this would give us 16 months to enact the law and get the word out). So, anyone born from then onward will not have an automatic right to housing, benefits, or anything else. |
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To clarify So, anyone born from then onward will not have an automatic right to housing, benefits, or anything else - when they reach the age they'd normally get them.
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Food banks being funded by councils ?
Really ? Absolutely, and your link confirms it - £136m allocated to local welfare schemes. And that's on top of their housing benefit and all the cash they receive. |
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Stevie Strikes
We're in a situation that we created in the 1970's - effectively we pour resources into encouraging the least "fit" to procreate. No other species does this, and its unsustainable. The good people of the world should be shagging and impregnating women like crazy. History tells us that no culture with a fertility rate of less than 1.6% has survived. Mayans, Incas, Aztecs and lots more, all gone. By 2500 the world will probably be muslim. Then the can wipe each other off the face of the Earth, and Mother Nature can start from scratch. |
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Impending rant coming up, (i ran out of time to complete it).
Gotta get ready for my trip to the pool to join the blue rinse brigade lovelies in our "Aquafit session."  |
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We're in a situation that we created in the 1970's - effectively we pour resources into encouraging the least "fit" to procreate.
No other species does this, and its unsustainable. You've hit the nail on the head.The problem can be traced back to the watershed decade of the 1960s where 'values' were done away with and the labour governments started the shift away from Social Security being a subsistence payment to what it has become today where thousands of problem families fervently believe the State owes them a comfortable life as a right. As Steve Strikes points out this is an unsustainable situation and rather than people just abusing me on here for putting up a solution why not post your ideas of how we can get out of the current dependency situation that many families are in. Bear in mind all these people have received National Health and free schooling...they've been given at taxpayers expense the basic tools for free;surely that's enough and as a tax payer myself i see no reason why they don't have to work to live. |
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posy, I gather the policy has something to do with producing enough children to sustain their parent's and granparent's pensions, because the pension system is one giant Ponzi scheme. Or something.
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myself i see no reason why they don't have to work to live.
I see no reason why people who want to work are forced onto zero hours contracts. You seem fond of quoting stuff from the sixties, which is around the time the 40 hour week was consolidated, with union pressure of course. Then there's holiday pay, sick pay etc etc. No doubt you'd abolish all that too. |
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Bear in mind all these people have received National Health and free schooling...they've been given at taxpayers expense the basic tools for free;surely that's enough and as a tax payer myself i see no reason why they don't have to work to live.
Tell this to the thousands and thousands who want to work, but there are no jobs for them Tell this to the people who are working ,but whose pay is so low they can't afford to put food on the table and are forced to use the food banks. Tell this to the people who are sick and disabled and unable to work, but have had there benefits removed, because some third party organisation hired by the government has counted the ' boxes ticked ' and have deemed them fit for work. Open your eyes man and see what's happening to a huge swathe of this country's population . The divide between the have and have nots is growing ever wider. And fascists like you would have it so. |
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So Facts what's your solution ?
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1. Deport every immigrant who has no job.
Then have a recount of the benefits bill before deciding step 2. For me. |
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Simple solution, affordable rents, i.e. young single person in a one bedroomed house in the SE of England paying £400 a month rent, on minimum wage they are better off not working, this is unsustainable, cap the rents at £100 per month and give people an incentive to work.
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We force them to get a job. Then there will still be maybe 1.5m unemployed. Who really knows as the figures as manipulated to fck.
What do we then do with the 1.5m? A work camp? 60 quid a week to pick up leaves? Housing benefit was mentioned. The reason that bill is so high is because house prices are out of control. House prices cannot fall as much as they need to, as it would 1) ruin the banks (who are most responsible for putting us in the mess and 2) it would destroy the 'aspirational dream' of having other people pay your own mortgage. |
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Certainly not your version of the ' final solution ' posy.
For a start I'd introduce a super tax for the mega rich I'd bring in a super mansion tax.to reap revenue from the huge amount of multi million pound homes sitting empty in and around the city of London. I'd make it illegal for any company to make profits from sales in the uk to not pay the correct level of tax./ vat etc. I'd abolish the obscenity of million pound bonuses being awarded to anyone. I'd stop the paying of mp expenses for anything other than proved essentials. The money ripped off of taxpayers by the payment of 'expenses' far outweighs any ' benefit fraud ' by so called ' scrounges ' In other words if you earn more and are super wealthy then you contribute more to the workings of this country . At the moment lawyers etc, earn millions finding ways for their clients to avoid tpaying what they should. So that these clients can live a life of untold luxury on the backs of those that have to choose wether any money they have goes on food or heating the house( for those still fortunate to live in one) this winter. In this country of ours millions are living below the poverty line. People are going hungry, people have nowhere to live, children are dying. The sick and disabled are having the door shut in their face. We should be ashamed. And the lies we are fed, puts the blame on immigrants and on the scrounges in our society. The deprivation that millions are suffering is down to these two factors is the line that keeps being spewed out, mainly by the people who aren't much better off. They point downwards, because it's something they can understand and it's easy to find fault and blame in those sections of society. To ' look up' at the section of society that's really to blame is too difficult. It's not easy to have a voice to these people, the small percent who own the majority of wealth. Not surprising really, because to all intents and purposes they live on a different planet ! |
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jackdanny 18 Aug 14 13:29
Simple solution, affordable rents, i.e. young single person in a one bedroomed house in the SE of England paying £400 a month rent £400 a month ain't a good example mate. I rented in the cheap end of London for 6 weeks in the spring of 2005, while waiting for house sales to go through. A refurnished 3 bed ex-council property on a sh!tty estate cost me £275 a week. The week after we moved out the landlord let it to the local council. Within days, an immigrant family were in it. Up to January 2008 the man of the house had never worked. I never visited that area after 2008, but it's a shade of odds on that he's probably still there with his wife and kids, and not working. There should be a survey on how much Housing Benefit is paid out in London alone, then compare that figure with the rest of the UK. |
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refurbished
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Facts an interesting response although it is not answering the question of what to do about the tens of thousands of families who contribute nothing to society and are generationally conditioned to believe they have the right to claim benefits which give them a much better standard of living than many who actually work. You have actually outlined your left wing belief in the redistribution of wealth and income which is not one i agree with, but that's beside the point because it's not the issue we're trying to resolve.
How are you proposing to restrict the hopeless cases from breeding like rabbits thus costing both left and right wing taxpayers billions of pounds . Or perhaps i've misunderstood you and you are not concerned about this problem and are happy for them to ever multiply. |
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Your statements
'......'To restrict the hopeless cases from breeding like rabbits....... ' and ' happy for them to ever multiply ' Do not deserve to be dignified by an answer. |
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Facts 4 million + have come and are still coming from all over Europe .We have untold illegal immigrants and asylum seekers plus enormous numbers risking life and limb to reach these shores .
Do you think these people would be or trying to get here if ,according to you, is equivalent to a third world country where the poor and disabled are in a dire state . Most people accept that the Welfare State needs reforming and that abuse of the system is a problem you may not share that view and we should have more of the same? When dealing with millions of people dependent on the state mistakes will be made and the genuine claimants will suffer but in most cases the situation will be rectified . The critics of reform are quick to pinpoint these rare cases which are sad but inevitable when the situation as been allowed to get out of hand. Your solution would make a minimal impression ,although abuse at all levels should be tackled,on the abuses of the Welfare State . Facts you are entitled to your opinion but I find it offensive you use the fascist slur with people who do nt share your view which is similar to the slur of 'racist' to those of us who highlighted the problems of unlimited immigration would have on communities and housing ,jobs and the Health Service . The people who made those slurs are now in the fore front of saying it is a problem that must be addressed. |
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why bury your head in the sand ? It's the reality.
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Facts 4 million + have come and are still coming from all over Europe .We have untold illegal immigrants and asylum seekers plus enormous numbers risking life and limb to reach these shores
Less than 2 million net migration in the last 10 years |
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Epicurean
Extract from an earlier post by posy I would stop the problem from multiplying by preventing the women in these 'problem' families from having children. Thereafter all able bodied men and women under the retirement age would be either given three months to get jobs and if they fail their benefits would be restricted to subsistence level.They would then be made to live in old army camps and subjected to a military type regime with the aim of instilling discipline ,getting them fit and giving them training for various vocations. This ' solution ' is fascism in my book |
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And as IDS does his best to save a couple of million at the expense of the vulnerable Theresa May spunks off a quarter of a billion.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-28840966 |
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Yep. Just one of many instances of huge sums of money being either spent,wasted or defrauded. Hey but let's blame the immigrants and benefit scrounges - more easily understood by the plebs !
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The first step towards reversing the decline would be to only allow income tax payers the right to vote.
We could do the same for local council elections by only giving people who pay council tax the right to vote. These changes would be a major step towards putting things straight. Why should people who don't pay income tax be allowed to vote for tax increases, for the money to be spent on bigger benefits? Political parties are bribing the scroungers to vote for them using tax payers money. |
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Whats the revenue lost to the government by non tax payers( ' scroungers '? ) vs revenue lost to the country by creative accounting for fat cats and big businesses ?
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^^ utter lunacy
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what's that got to do with the price of fish ?
The question is what would YOU do about the tens of thousand of scrounger/scum families ? |
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Give us some proper figs. Dont just keep waving a banner of hysterical generalisations i.e tens of thousands of scroungers/scum families. What arrogance.
How many people exactly are 'scroungers'? Define scroungers Define scum What revenue are they taking out of the economy ? |
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Whoever it was that said Julius Streicher was dead is obviously wrong.
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and his pal "Pol Pot" who wants to take us back to the year zero
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Louise Casey, the head of the Government’s troubled families unit, says the state should “interfere” and tell women it is irresponsible to keep having children when they are already struggling to cope.
The Government must not be a “soft touch” but instead be prepared to “get stuck in”, challenge taboos and change lives. Britain’s 120,000 problem families cost taxpayers an estimated £9 billion in benefits, crime, anti-social behaviour and health care. A fifth of them have more than five children. Now tell me what YOU would do about them ? |
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So what would you do about them Gruppenführer Posy? Extermination perhaps or would you be happy with sterilisation and put into work camps until death?
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£75,000 per problem family per year (according to dubious Govt statistics [always reliable])
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I doubt any sensible organisation would come up with the label "problem families", looks like the telegraph used that from the governments original 'troubled families'.
You can see the agenda clearly, those familes needing help and troubled are a problem for those that read the telegraph |
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there is, however, one problem family living at the taxpayers' expense which costs far more than that
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All political parties have betrayed the British working class History shows that the only way that living standards improve for both middle and lower classes is when there is a shortage of labour. Surprisingly
although it is counter- intuitive a labour shortage not only benefits indivjduals it also benifits industry and the country. (It is not difficult to see why) The massive increase in immkgration means it will be impossible for Britain to be prosperous again. |
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mightymac if you read this thread i've set out very clearly what i think should be done and with one or two notable exceptions most have responded by name calling.All i'm asking for is Facts to tell me what he would do rather than just refer to me as a fascist which assuredly i'm not.
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I just can`t understand how they can refer to you as a fascist.
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Everybody should be made work, providing they are fit, including the Royal Family and their aristocratic friends and Everybody from a road sweeper to a brain surgeon should be paid the same wage.
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