Sunset cristo. Mr News Corps & Isreal. your very close.

The same Geraldo Rivera whose credibility was shot to pieces in the Al Capone's Vault fiasco.

Oh dear, Cristo. I can't believe you still haven't grasped it after so many people have gone to the trouble of explaining it to you so many times. I'm sure a six year-old would have no trouble undestanding it.

Atheism is not a belief.

It won't go in will it.According to the dictionary it is.

the doctrine or belief that there is no god.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/atheism


Some atheists consider it to be a religion as well.

Even courts recognise that ahteism is a religion.

A federal court of appeals ruled yesterday Wisconsin prison officials violated an inmate's rights because they did not treat atheism as a religion.
"Atheism is [the inmate's] religion, and the group that he wanted to start was religious in nature even though it expressly rejects a belief in a supreme being," the 7th Circuit Court of Appeals said.

http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=31895



You see what I did there. I gave evidence for my assertions, rather than just making crude assertions like you are your ilk do.


Atheism is the LACK of a belief. The burden of proof lies 100% with the theists.

So you keep saying.Still haven't provided any evidence for it though.


That proof has never been provided.


Evidence has been provided. You are in denial.



It can't be. It doesn't exist.

So you say. Prove it? This is your delusional belief.


All you've ever done is provide reasons why YOU believe there's a god.

Which is more than you have ever done for why you don't believe in God.


That is not evidence.


If it's a logical reason then it is evidence.You have not shown they are not logical. In fact most of the time you have ignored my posts and just made  ad hominem arguments.It's not about me, or what you think of me.It's about the evidence that you dismiss,ignore and deny.You are wasting my time.
Talking to people like you is like talking to a brick wall.


It was all explained to you yet again by several people on the Noah's flood thread.You never  posted again on that thread after it was explained, presumably so you could claim not to have seen it

I replied back to you.Not sure if it was on the Noahs flood thread or not.I didn't continue to read the Noahs flood thread because it gets a bit tiresome talking to a brick wall. I've got better things to do than talk to people like you.You've obviously got nothing better to do than keep chewing the fat.

(as you've done on more than one occasion before).

I'll bring it back to the top for you to read again.

If you any more nonsense to add, do it on that thread rather than this one, which is supposed to be about the events of 11/9.


Yet again you show how biased you are. I don't see you saying anything when other people go off subject.You always blame me. This is typical of you and just shows how prejudiced you are.Get rid of that chip from your shoulder and take the blind fold off and then may be when can have a proper civilised conversation.

We are all atheists about most of the gods that societies have ever believed in. Some of us just go one god further.

Richard Dawkins

Faith is the great cop-out, the great excuse to evade the need to think and evaluate evidence.


Faith can be based on facts and evidence.

Faith is belief in spite of, even perhaps because of, the lack of evidence.


It can be, but not always.Every one has faith in something. Some have faith in Richard Dawkins.

Richard Dawkins

that is the thing though isn't it? Religion requires faith to exist because it doesn't stand up to scientific scrutiny.

So you say.
Science and religion deal with different areas. There is not much over lap. Science deals with the how questions. Religion,metaphysics and philosophy deal with the why questions.

Why Are the Feds Cultivating Their Own "Homegrown Terrorists"?
High profile domestic terrorism plots appear to have increased in recent months, but they’ve been largely concocted.

The FBI caught another homegrown terrorist this week, except like many recent plots the agency has “uncovered,” the attack was a plant, a plan concocted by the FBI itself. It’s the latest in a growing number of terrorism plots that the FBI stirs up by infiltrating communities and helping to devise attack plans. The practice raises serious questions about the government’s implementation of it’s ongoing war on terror.

Sunset:

"Is "not collecting stamps" a hobby?"

True.

???

Sorry misread your post. Not sure what point you are trying to make. Presumably you are saying that theists collect gods. They don't they believe in God or gods,so you are comparing apples and oranges.

No problem, Sunset.

To clarify: what I am suggesting is that atheism is no more a belief than "not-collecting-stamps" is a hobby. Let me give an example: do you believe that the Universe is run by an invisible, intangible force called Wibble? No. So you are an aWibblist, if you will. Does that make you a believer that there is no Wibble? Of course not. You are merely someone who doe not believe in Wibble. As an aWibblist are you required to provide evidence or proof to support your lack of belief in the existence of Wibble? Again, no. The onus of proof is on those who believe in Wibble not those who don't.

ho hum

Another J.F. K. conundrum, might get the facts in 1.000.000.000 years time.

Slarty you are just playing word games. I've just explained it to you in my last post. If you don't understand then you are not very bright. It's not rocket science. Go back and read it again. And debunk it point by point instead of just ignoring it making new posts with the same crude assertions not backed up with any logical arguments or evidence.I have a non belief in Islam. I have a non belief in the 9/11 conspiracy. I have a non belief in atheism. So according to you are your ilk the burden of proof is not on me.We all have non belief in things. Think about it.

I don't believe in fairies. Do I have to justify my position? According to you, yes. Bizarre.


Yes you do. You should have an agnostic position because you can't prove a negative.Some people don't believe in aliens. Why is it wrong to ask them why?

As for your previous post I posted a link to dozens of pages disproving your first point. You ignored this.


Must of missed this. What was it again?

To quote some of your antagonistic stock phrases- which seem to have come from the "Teenage Boy's Book of How to Pretend You've Won an Argument by Being Really Really Mature", says it all really about you and your ilk. 


What are you on about? 

That definition is sloppy and there are others that frame the position much more accurately. Here is Wikipedia: "Atheism is commonly defined as the position that there are no deities. It can also mean the rejection of belief in the existence of deities. A broader definition is simply the absence of belief that any deities exist."


Agreed , but it's the same as saying you don't believe in God or gods. You must be really stupid if you can't comprehend this. It's like talking to a brick wall.

Atheism is a belief as much as not-collecting-stamps is a hobby.


Why do you keep going on about this silly illustration. This proves nothing as I have already pointed out. Stop ignoring my rebuttals.

Cristo has fallen for the cover up. He believes incomptence within the military, security, governmental organisatations, and unique architectual frailties all came together on the same day. The media has certainly done its job on him.

Hold on Cristo...is it not the truth. Why do i have to provide evidence to you about what you believe.
Help me out here.

Any more theories lately? coming up 10years now, i think its all hot air myself

the cia know all about it manx.........apparently

According to 9/11 Commission report page 181, and the DOJ IG report pages 238-239, Freeh had already gotten this very information from the NSA in December 1999 and the CIA in January 2000, and this information ended up right in Freeh's daily briefing papers for January 4, 2000. When FBI Director Louis Freeh told FBI Agent Ali Soufan that there was none of this information at the CIA he was not only lying, but criminally obstructing his own investigation into the murder of 17 US sailors, an obstruction that ultimately allowed the al Qaeda terrorists to carry out the attacks on 9/11.

The DOJ Inspector General knew who the lead FBI investigator was on the Cole bombing investigation, you would think, since the FBI is under the DOJ

This is not a small detail, but a horrific fact.

This was the very information being requested by the very FBI criminal investigating team that could have used it to prevent the attacks on 9/11, and saved the lives of almost 3000 people killed on 9/11.




At the September 20, 2002 Joint Inquiry public hearings on 9/11, Senator Carl Levin stated:

SEN. LEVIN: "From what I know of the information that was being sought, there is no barrier to that information being shared, that these persons were suspected of being terrorists -- that could have been shared with the FBI; the fact that they were suspected of being in the United States -- that could have been shared with the FBI. I don't know of any prohibition in law in terms of messing up criminal investigations for that information, just that information not to have been shared.

The reason that June meeting is so critical -- there are many reasons why it's critical, but one of them is, Mr. Chairman, that al- Midhar was out of the United States in June of 2001, he came back in, as I understand it, in July of 2001. If he had been put on the watch list then at that June meeting he could not presumably have come back into the United States and I think that there is -- you know, it's one thing to say that the dots weren't connected, and they weren't. Even when there was an effort made to connect them at a June meeting the effort to connect the dots was frustrated. It's another thing when the dots aren't even put into the file, when the dots aren't put into the watch list, when the information isn't even shared. That's even preliminary to connecting dots is simply to get the dots in place where someone can connect them. We didn't even see that, so we have failure piled upon failure here I believe. I hope there's going to be some accountability and some answers where there so far are none, but again I want to thank our witnesses, all of them, and I want to thank Ms. Hill and her staff for an extremely thorough report, which I hope will shake up some things."

I think Senator Levin’s statement is compelling, and makes a clear credible case that there was absolutely no restrictions on passing this information on known al Qaeda terrorists to the FBI criminal investigators on the Cole bombing particularly when the CIA, and later the FBI HQ knew that these al Qaeda terrorists had taken part in the planning of the Cole bombing.

To repeat from Senator Carl Levin’s statement:

From what I know of the information that was being sought, there is no barrier to that information being shared, that these persons were suspected of being terrorists -- that could have been shared with the FBI; the fact that they were suspected of being in the United States -- that could have been shared with the FBI. I don't know of any prohibition in law in terms of messing up criminal investigations for that information, just that information not to have been shared.


I don’t know how you can get any clearer than that, this is from a US senator who was on the Intelligence Committee, surly he would have known if there was in fact any law prohibiting the sharing of this information.

But also at this same hearing:

SEN. LEVIN: "That's the background. That's what happens when, in December of 1999, the CIA gets information from its own sources that two men -- the men we're following, al-Midhar and Alhazmi, are coming to Malaysia. That is not rumors. That is confirmed by the CIA's own people.

And then they come to Malaysia in January of 2000. And the CIA, we know, monitored the al Qaeda members there, including the two people at issue. They knew that these two people had, at least in one case, already had a visa to go to the United States. That information was not put into the watch list. It was not shared with the FBI. It knew that al-Midhar had a multiple-entry visa, as a matter of fact, and knew of his ties to al Qaeda. Two failures there -- not placed on the watch list, not shared with the FBI.

Then in March of 2000, the CIA found out that Alhazmi had entered the United States at Los Angeles International Airport on January 15th, not shared with the FBI, even though they knew he entered the United States; not shared with the watch list.

Then another event occurs in October of 2000. This is a watershed event. This is the Cole being blown up. And by January of 2001, the CIA knows that the Cole planner was at that January 2000 meeting in Malaysia. They knew that a man named Khallad had been the center of that attack and a planner and that Khallad was at the January 2000 Malaysia meeting with the two people we're talking about, al-Midhar and Alhazmi.

CIA still did not place either individual on the watch list; still no notice of known visas -- and I emphasize that -- known visas to the FBI. They may or may not have shared with the FBI earlier that one of them had a passport. But in terms of visas to enter the United States, and the fact that one at least had entered the United States, still CIA doesn't place names on the watch list; still no notice to the FBI.

And now we have a direct link to the killer or the killers of Americans on the USS Cole, direct link between these two men, al- Midhar and Alhazmi, to the planner Khallad of the al Qaeda attack on the USS Cole.

I want to proceed now to the June 11th, 2001 meeting, because that's what I really want to focus on, and then the events after that. But that's a bit of the background. And if I'm wrong on any of that, I would assume that our witnesses would correct me.

On page nine, at the bottom of Ms. Hill's report, it stated the following: "On June 11th, 2001, FBI headquarters representatives and CIA representatives met with the New York FBI agents handling the Cole investigation. The New York agents were shown but not given copies of the photographs that they -- and told that they were taken in Malaysia." They weren't told that; still information being withheld. This is after the Cole; information withheld from the FBI.

One of the New York agents recalled that al-Midhar's name was being mentioned. He also recalled asking for more information on why the people in the photographs were being followed. So we had the FBI now asking the CIA, "Why are you following these folks?" He recalled asking for more information on why they were being followed and for access to that information. The New York agents were advised they could not be told why al-Midhar and the others were being followed.

This is truly unbelievable, I've got to tell you all. This is extraordinary. This has got nothing to do with information which can't cross a wall. This has to do with leads which are not shared with the FBI, just simple leads, information which is so critical. Now, an FBI headquarters representative told us in her interview that the FBI was never given specific information until it was provided after September 11th, 2001, and here's where I want to pick up with our witnesses.

The CIA analyst who attended the New York meeting acknowledged to the joint inquiry staff that he had seen the information regarding al- Midhar's U.S. visa and Alhazmi's travel to the U.S., but he stated that he would not share information outside of the CIA unless he had authority to do so and unless that was the purpose of the meeting.

Now, June 11th, New York: Now we've got the FBI asking the CIA, "Would you tell us why you're following these two guys?" And according to the CIA analyst to our staff, that information was denied because no authority to do so, unless that's the purpose of the meeting.

So I ask our CIA officer, as far as you know is our staff report correct?

CIA OFFICER [Tom Wilshire]: I would -- the whole staff report?

SEN. LEVIN: No. What I read to you.

CIA OFFICER [Tom Wilshire]: Could I just limit my comment to the June 11th meeting for right now?

SEN. LEVIN: Yes. Just on that.

CIA OFFICER [Tom Wilshire]: Okay.

SEN. LEVIN: Is that correct what I just read?

CIA OFFICER [Tom Wilshire]: First of all, I would distinguish between one CIA officer saying I don't feel comfortable with sharing this information with a particular FBI individual from the entire corporate body of the CIA and its policy.

The second thing I would say is that the CIA officer --

SEN. LEVIN: I'm just asking you if this happened.

CIA OFFICER [Tom Wilshire]: Not exactly that way.

SEN. LEVIN: Okay, then tell us how it happened.

CIA OFFICER [Tom Wilshire]: I wasn't there, but what I will say is that when the CIA officer said, "I'm not going to give you, Mr. FBI Agent, this information," he was in the company of an FBI headquarters analyst who had the information. The information was in the hands of the FBI."

Note the name of the CIA officer at the time of this public hearing was being kept secret. But we now know this CIA officer was the now famous Tom Wilshire, who seems to be right in the middle of this massive CIA, FBI HQ criminal conspiracy to withhold information from the FBI criminal investigators on the Cole bombing. Incredibly Wilshire says:

"I wasn't there, but what I will say is that when the CIA officer said, "I'm not going to give you, Mr. FBI Agent, this information," he was in the company of an FBI headquarters analyst who had the information. The information was in the hands of the FBI."

This FBI analyst would have been FBI HQ IOS Agent Dina Corsi. But how would Wilshire have known that Corsi had the same information that Clark Shannon, the CIA analyst had?:

That Nawaf al-Hazmi was inside of the US. In order to carry out yet another al Qaeda terrorist attack.

That Khalid al-Mihdhar had a multi-entry visas for the US, in order to entry the US to join up with al-Hazmi, to carry out a al Qaeda terrorists attack.

That Khallad had been identified at the Kuala Lumpur al Qaeda planning meeting, wi9th Mihdhar and Hazmi actually planning the Cole bombing.

It turns out that Tom Wilshire had given FBI Dina Corsi the three photos of Mihdhar taken at Kuala Lumpur, to show to the FBI Cole bombing investigators at the June 11, 2001 meeting, and had briefed her before this meeting, on the fact that Mihdhar had been at this meeting. We don’t know exactly what information he gave Corsi, but this implies that Corsi had the same information that Clark Shannon had, because it comes right from the CIA officer that had briefed Corsi right before the June 11, 2001 meeting. After Corsi had given Bongardt and his team these photos, CIA officer Clark Shannon asked Bongardt and the other investigators :

"Do you recognize anyone in these photos?"

Since one photo only had Mihdhar and Hazmi in it, it pretty obvious that the CIA only wanted to know if these investigators had uncovered the information that the CIA was desperately trying to keep secret, that Mihdhar and Hazmi had been at the Kuala Lumpur meeting planning the Cole bombing with Khallad.

How many people does it take to track just two known al Qaeda terrorists, when the CIA had their photographs, passports and even credit card numbers.

Not only did the CIA and FBI HQ know they were inside of the US on August 22, 2001, but even knew they were inside of the US in order to take part in a massive al Qaeda attack that would kill thousands of Americans. The DE #939 proves that the CIA had been warned on July 23, 2001 that Mihdhar would be found at the location of the next big al Qaeda attack, and that this information was sent by Tom Wilshire to Richard Earl Blee, Chief of the CIA bin Laden unit, his boss Cofer Black, head of the CIA CTC (Counter Terrorism unit), and to Cofer Black’s boss George Tenet, Director of the CIA.

Even FBI Agent Steve Bongardt knew that Midhar and Hazmi were inside of the US in order to take part in a massive al Qaeda attack, and wanted to investigate and search for them before they had time to carry out yet another al Qaeda terrorist attack. Bongardt knew from Corsi’s EC that Mihdhar and Hazmi were now connected to the east Africa bombings that had killed over 200 people and 12 Americans. When Corsi shut down his investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi, Bongardt said:

“Why do you think they are here. Do you think they are going to F****** Disneyland”

No one has ever explained why Corsi and Middleton, with the approval of Tom Wilshire and Wilshire’s CIA managers, Blee, Black and Tenet, shut down Bongardt’s investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi on August 28-29 2001 when they all knew the following:

From the NSA caveat, on the NSA information that this information was not in any way connected to any FISA warrant, since the tapped phone was located outside of the US, and involved overhearing persons located outside of the US. FISA warrants were only required for US based investigations. Absence of any FISA warrant meant that what was called “the wall” did not apply to this information.

There had already been substantial evidence of Federal crimes by both Mihdhar and Hazmi, the east Africa bombings and the planning of the Cole bombing, evidence that made “the wall” null and void.

The NSA general council had already approved on August 27, 2001 for her to transfer the very NSA information she had that she told Bongardt, he was forbidden to have, meaning there was no longer any possible excuse not to give the NSA information to Bongardt and his team of experienced investigators and let him immediately start an investigation for Mihdhar and Hazmi.

Sherry Sabol, the NSLU attorney Corsi had consulted at Bongardt’s request, had on August 28, 2001 told Corsi that since there had been no FISA warrant used to obtain the NSA information, Bongardt was allowed to have the NSA information and to take part in any investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi.

The fact that the NSA had already given Corsi permission to give this information to the FBI Cole bombing investigators, and that Corsi admitted she knew that Mihdhar and Hazmi had taken part in many al Qaeda crimes proves that Corsi and Middleton her supervisor, clearly understood that they had no absolutely legal right to block the NSA information from Bongardt and shut down his investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi.

The fact that she had been warned by Bongardt that these al Qaeda terrorists were in the US to take part in yet another al Qaeda attack proves that she and Middleton clearly knew when they shut down Bongardt’s investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi, that many Americans would be murdered in the attack that CIA and FBI HQ knew these al Qaeda terrorists were just about to take part in.

I think I have found every available bit of information on what people at both the CIA and FBI HQ knew in the period between January 2000 to September 2001.

I have built detailed time lines from several thousand pages of information, and from this information, created a very detailed time line and detailed record of what people knew, when did they get this information and then what did they do with the information they had. Did they act like a prudent person would have acted or were they involved in nefarious actions to hide material information from the FBI criminal investigators on the USS Cole bombing investigation.

This information came from the DOJ IG report, combined with the Joint Inquiry Report and the 9/11 Commission report, along with the book, State of Denial by Bob Woodward, and the Account of FBI Agent Ali Soufan, lead FBI investigator on the Cole bombing, along with the Moussaoui Defense Exhibits. Also used was an article in Harpers on Richard Blee, head of the CIA bin Laden unit and the CIA Rendition unit.

Time lines of this information show that almost all of the very highest level managers at the CIA, and many high level managers at FBI HQ knew a huge al Qaeda attack was about to take place inside of the US and knew it would kill thousands of Americans. The also knew on August 22-23 that both of these al Qaeda terrorists were inside of the US, and even knew they were here to take part in a massive al Qaeda attack that they had been warned about since April 2001.

Here is the time line of what was known by whom and when at the FBI HQ and the CIA.

July 5, 2001 - Tom Wilshire sends email to his CTC managers, Richard Earl Blee, Chief of the CIA Bin Laden unit and Wilshire's immediate supervisor, Cofer Black head of the CIA CTC, and Director of the CIA George Tenet, indicating that the people at Kuala Lumpur are connected to the warnings of huge al Qaeda attack. Wilshire was a former CIA officer, who by this time, was moved over to the FBI to be the Deputy Chief of the FBI ITOS unit, the unit in charge of all FBI terrorist investigations in the world, and is also the CIA liaison to the FBI. In his position of liaison to the FBI, he is suppose to give CIA information to the FBI to be exploited in FBI criminal investigations. Wilshire already knows that al Qaeda terrorist Nawaf al-Hazmi has already entered the US, in order to carry out an al Qaeda terrorist attack and also knows that Khalid al-Mihdhar has a multi-entry visa for the US, in order to join with Hazmi in this attack. Wilshire also knows that Mihdhar and Hazmi had taken part in the planning of the Cole bombing with Khallad. Wilshire tells DOJ IG investigators after the attacks on 9/11 that he thought at this time that the attack would take place in Malaysia. This is truly strange. So why was Hazmi already in the US and why did Mihdhar have a multi-entry visa for the US? Maybe Wilshire thought that they were coming to the US for a little R&R before going back to Malaysia to carry out their attack.

July 10, 2001 - Blee, Black, and Tenet contact Condoleezza Rice while driving to the White House to request an emergency meeting with her and Richard Clarke. They indicate that the US is about to be attacked by the al Qaeda terrorists in a massive attack that will kill thousands of Americans. The fact that this meeting took place is kept secret by all of the investigations on 9/11 even the 9/11 Commission investigation and only becomes widely known when the facts of this meeting are brought out by Bob Woodward in his book, State of Denial. What is more telling however is the fact that Tenet had described this meeting in the White House to Richard Bin Venista, and Philip Zelicow, yet his information never gets into the 9/11 Commission report. Rice tells Tenet in this White House meeting, to give this information to Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld and Attorney General Ashcroft, which he does on or about July 17, 2001. On July 26, 2001 CBS news reports that Ashcroft is now only flying on private jet aircraft for the remainder of his term as AJ. His office releases a press release that says he is flying on private aircraft due to an unspecified threat given to him by the FBI. At the April 14, 2004 public hearings, Bin Venista asked Ashcroft to explain why he flew only on private aircraft in the summer of 2001. Ashcroft says that he did fly on commercial aircraft, when he went on vacations out of the country with his wife, trips the US government would never have reimbursed him for had they been on private aircraft. In spite of the fact that Bin Venista knew that Ashcroft been given this warning by George Tenet, both Venista and Ashcroft keep this July 17, 2001 meeting with Tenet a secret.

July 13, 2001 - Tom Wilshire sends email to his CTC managers, Blee and Black, and [Tenet] indicating that Khallad is a major league killer [who was at the Kuala Lumpur with Mihdhar and Hazmi, planning the Cole], and asks for permission to pass the information on Kuala Lumpur meeting to the FBI. Blee, Black and Tenet refuse to give Wilshire permission to transfer the CIA information over to the FBI even though they just had a meeting at the White House describing a huge al Qaeda attack that they have told Rice will take place inside of the US, that will kill thousands of Americans.

July 23, 2001 - Wilshire sends another email to his CTC managers, Blee, Black and [Tenet] asking what has happened to his request for permission to send the Kuala Lumpur information to the FBI, and says he thinks that Khalid al-Mihdhar should be of “high interest” with respect to the next big al Qaeda terrorist attack, and his connection to Khallad, a major league killer (of Americans). Blee, Black and Tenet again refuse to give Wilshire permission to transfer the CIA Kuala Lumpur information over to the FBI.

August 21, 2001 – Margaret Gillespie a FBI agent working at the CIA, finds the cable that said an al Qaeda terrorist, Nawaf al-Hazmi, had entered the US on January 15, 2000. She contacts the INS who tells her that another al Qaeda terrorist, Khalid al-Mihdhar, had also entered the US on the same date, and flight, left in June 2000, and had just reentered the US again on July 4, 2001. Gillespie immediately realizes how horrific this information is.

August 22, 2001 - Margaret Gillespie gives this information that Mihdhar and Hazmi are inside of the US to FBI HQ Agent Dina Corsi and Deputy Chief of the FBI ITOS unit, Tom Wilshire. Wilshire knows immediately that they are here to take part in the massive al Qaeda attack that he and the CIA had been warned about since April 2001.

In the DOJ IG report, page 302, Corsi admits that she knows , by this date, that the CIA has a photo of Khallad at the Kuala Lumpur meeting, knows that they have been keeping this secret from the FBI Cole investigators so these FBI criminal investigators will not have the evidence they need to open any investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi. [NOTE: It would appear that the CIA thought that if Bongardt continued with any investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi and then found the Kuala Lumpur photo of Khallad, he would have known that the June 11, 2001 meeting between the CIA, FBI HQ agents and the FBI Cole bombing investigators had been nothing but a sting on the FBI, a criminal conspiracy to find out what the Cole investigators had found out about the Kuala Lumpur meeting.]

At this meeting set up by Tom Wilshire, Corsi had presented three photos of Mihdhar from Kuala Lumpur that Wilshire had gotten from the CIA and CIA officer Clark Shannon asked Bongardt and his team if they recognizes anyone in these photos. Since one photo only had Mihdhar and Hazmi in it, it was clear that the CIA only wanted to know if the FBI Cole investigators had found out the information that the CIA had been trying to keep secret, that Mihdhar and Hazmi had taken part in the planning of the Cole bombing at this meeting. The CIA was concerned that if this information went to the FBI investigators, it might end up in the papers, and would show that the CIA was culpable in the Cole bombing for having photographed all of the al Qaeda terrorists at the Kuala Lumpur meeting and then letting them walk away to carry out the attacks on the USS Cole.

August 23, 2001 - Corsi contacts FBI intelligence Agent Craig Donnachie by phone at the New York office of the FBI and tells him that it is urgent that he start an intelligence investigation for Mihdhar and Hazmi right away. In spite of Donnachie’s feeling this should be given to the FBI criminal Cole bombing investigators, he reluctantly agrees to start this investigation. Corsi emails Wilshire immediately and says; “Craig will open an intelligence investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi.”

Well known at the time at FBI HQ, the FBI office of the OIPR rarely allowed an intelligence investigation and criminal investigation of the same persons at the same time. The intelligence investigation will make it much harder for FBI agent Steve Bongardt and his team to start any criminal investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi, in spite of the fact that Corsi, Wilshire and the CIA knows Mihdhar and Hazmi had taken part in the planning of the Cole bombing.

Margaret Gillespie forces the CIA Bin Laden unit to issue a worldwide alert for Mihdhar and Hazmi that indicates both Mihdhar and Hazmi are inside of the US, an alert that goes right to Blee, Black and Tenet. Since these CIA managers had already been given Wilshire’s warnings that Mihdhar would be found at the location of the next big al Qaeda attack, they clearly knew that these terrorists were inside of the US to take part in this al Qaeda attack. Yet none of the many people at the even the highest levels of the CIA or FBI HQ who are aware of this information on Mihdhar and Hazmi warn Bongardt and his criminal investigators that these terrorist are in the US to take part in a horrific al Qaeda attack

August 27, 2001 - On or about this date, both Tom Wilshire and Rod Middleton review and approve the EC that Corsi has written up to start an intelligence investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi.

Corsi is approved in writing by the general counsel for the NSA, to give the NSA Kuala Lumpur information to the FBI criminal investigators on the Cole in New York City, FBI Steve Bongardt and his team,

August 28, 2001 – Corsi’s EC comes over to the New York office of the FBI to Craig Donnachie, who sends it to John Liguori, his supervisor. Liguori thinks this connects both Mihdhar and Hazmi to the planning of the Cole bombing and sends this EC to FBI Agent Steve Bongardt.

Bongardt immediately calls Corsi and requests that this investigation be given to him and his team, since he now thinks these terrorists are inside of the US in order to carry out yet another horrific al Qaeda attack, and he has an experienced team already in place that can find these terrorists before they carry out this attack.

Corsi tells Bongardt that he and any of his team are not even allowed to look at the NSA information in her EC, in spite of the fact that she had already received the release from the NSA to give this very information to him, that he must destroy this EC and that he will not be allowed to take part in any investigation for Mihdhar and Hazmi.

Bongardt requests that Corsi get an opinion from the NSLU, the FBI legal people to see if he can start an investigation for Mihdhar and Hazmi since he does not see any connection between the NSA information and a FISA warrant, the only reason he would be denied this information.

August 29, 2001 - Corsi tells Bongardt that the NSLU had ruled he could not take part in any investigation for Midhar and Hazmi. Bongardt tells Corsi that because of this ruling someday [many] Americans will die. But according to the 9/11 Commission report the attorney Corsi had consulted NSLU Attorney Sherry Sabol tells DOJ IG investigators on November 7, 2002 that she told Corsi that since the NSA information had no connection to any FISA warrant, Bongardt could talked part in any investigation for Mihdhar and Hazmi and if Corsi was still confused she could go to the NSA and get a release herself unaware that Corsi had already been given this release two days earlier.

FBI Agent Robert Fuller, an inexperienced FBI agent, who had never done any intelligence investigation, is given the intelligence investigation for Mihdhar and Hazmi. The EC to start this intelligence investigation is marked "Routine", the absolute lowest level of precedence in spite of the fact that Corsi had been told by FBI Agent Bongardt that it is obvious that these terrorists are inside of the US for no other reason than to carry out a horrific al Qaeda terrorist attack

August 30, 2001 - CIA sends the photograph of Walid Bin Attash, aka Khallad, to the FBI HQ and requests that it be given to Rod Middleton, Corsi’s supervisor. In spite of the fact that Middleton had been on the phone in a conference call with Corsi to Bongardt shutting down his investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi, and had been at the meeting with Sherry Sabol, where Sabol told Corsi and Middleton that Bongardt could take part in any investigation for Mihdhar and Hazmi, and now had photographic proof that both Mihdhar and Hazmi had taken part in the planning of the Cole bombing, Middleton, he never calls Bongardt back to allow him to start any investigation for Mihdhar and Hazmi.

September 5, 2001 - Robert Fuller calls FBI Agent Dina Corsi and tells him that he has gotten nowhere in his investigation to locate Mihdhar and Hazmi, and that he has failed to find any information in the FBI data base “Choicepoint” on Mihdhar or Hazmi. He requests that she give him permission to contact Saudi Arabian Airlines to get Mihdhar’s credit card number so he will have more to go on in the FBI data base. Corsi refuses to give Fuller permission even though she knows this will likely make his investigation fail to locate Mihdhar and Hazmi.

September 11, 2001 - Fuller had gotten nowhere by the time the attacks on the WTC towers take place. He and Bongardt are told shortly after this attack that both Mihdhar and Hazmi were on AA 77 that hit the Pentagon.

It is clear that Richard Blee, Cofer Black and George Tenet knew that the al Qaeda terrorists were just about to attack the US in the July 2001, knew this attack would kill thousands of Americans and still refused to give Tom Wilshire permission to give the Kula Lumpur information to the FBI. It is clear that Tom Wilshire was overseeing Corsi’s request to ask Donnachie for an intelligence investigation to head off any investigation by Steve Bongardt and his team, and had overseen Corsi’s work on her EC, even knowing that it specified “Routine” when both Corsi and Wilshire knew that these terrorists were inside of the US in order to carry out another al Qaeda attack that would kill thousands of Americans. It is also clear that Middleton had photographic proof that Mihdhar and Hazmi had taken part in the planning of the Cole bombing and still refused to give the FBI Cole bombing investigators permission to start a criminal investigation for these terrorists.

These actions taken together demonstrate that managers at the highest levels of the CIA and many FBI mangers, even high level managers at the FBI conspired to shut down FBI Agent Bongardt’s investigation of Mihdhar and Hazmi when they knew it would result in allowing the al Qaeda terrorists to murder thousands of Americans. This is further confirmed by the massive number of out and out lies given to the Joint Inquiry Committee investigation and even their public hearings, the 9/11 Commission investigation and their public hearings and even the DOJ IG investigators by these managers. Secrecy, concealment and lying are always prima facie proof in a court of law of nefarious motives.


They knew Mihdhar and Hazmi were inside of the US on August 22, 2001, and even knew they were here to take part in a massive al Qaeda attack that would kill thousands of Americans. But instead of providing this information to the FBI criminal investigators on the Cole bombing, and the information that these terrorists had taken part in the planning of the Cole bombing, which by law they were required to do, they deliberately hid this information from these investigators, to hide the fact that they had criminally obstructed their investigation numerous times, to stay out of prison.

But what is more horrific is that they shut this investigation down on August 28, 2001, when they knew that the result would be that this would allow the al Qaeda terrorists to carry out the attacks that the CIA and FBI HQ had been warned about, the attacks that took place on 9/11. To stay out of prison they traded the lives of almost 3000 people, and then made sure this was all covered over by the several government investigations, by keeping secret much of their nefarious actions. But when you examine the information these investigations had in detail, it is impossible to believe that these investigations who were task with telling the American people the reasons the attacks on 9/11 took place, did not also actively participate to make sure the intentional and deliberate actions at the CIA and FBI HQ to allow these attacks was kept secret.