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Thank you very much Bill.
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pokermonster (or anyone else)
talking about this again today at the club. what happens if you put topspin/overspin/follow-through on the cue ball AS WELL AS sidespin? thinking about this has given me a headache - the white cannot roll and spin in two different directions can it? |
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Is this the phenomenon known as mass delusion?
Pokermonster 22 Jan 01:41 There is a simple test that proves this point: Start with the cueball on the brown spot and the blue on its own spot. These are the only two balls on the table. First shot: Send the white into the blue at an (almost) full on collision, sending the colour up over the pink and black spots and back to baulk, coming to rest within two inches the baulk cushion. If the blue bounces back into the white, start again. This first shot should be played plain ball. Note where the white finishes. Second shot: Replace the balls and try again using as much topspin as you can muster. You can even move it closer to the blue if you like. Keep trying until the blue finishes in the same place as before; this is your proof that you have not inadvertantly struck the white harder. Note where the white finishes. It will be in the same place as with the first plainly struck shot. Whilst this might be true at moderate speeds, try the same with a firmer struck shot - hitting the white in the centre will cause the ball to release forward slightly after striking the object ball; hitting the white with topspin will cause the white to release forward significantly more. Also, the comment about not being able to cause any sphere to rotate foward when struck, how about a snooker ball on ice or a marble surface? It would spin and skid on these surfaces far easier due to the lack of friction, which is the counteracting force to any topspin imparted. It is still true on baize albeit more difficult. Topspin can be applied when striking the white (NAP) |
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no it can't pun tang, thats the point. i tried that shot with the blue and it worked exactly as stated.
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do you know the answer to my question anyway mate? what happens if you hit with topspin AND sidespin? its doing my nut in trying to work out what happens there.
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The test wont work as described as the white will always hit the blue if you send the blue over the pink and black spots.
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i took it to mean they were supposed to just miss. which they did most of the time, but they did collide a few times so i started again. what about the topspin and sidespin though? what is happening to the white then?
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Dont know about that but i say if you hit it straight as described the balls will always hit.
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i doubt that many professionals could hit the blue "straight" from one end of the table and make it hit the cueball more than 2 times out of ten in a straight line...
the example is assuming that they just miss... which they usually will... |
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anybody?
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yes dealem thats what i took it to mean as well. mine just missed most of the time while i was trying to get the blue to land in the same spot, but they did collide a couple of times so i had to start over.
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if a prefessional coach was asking the same thing, but WANTED the collsion aliong the psot line, he would have his hands in the air of his pupil could do this more than not...
a major part of people bad play is due to not hitting the ball correctly, which this test will amplify. get this right consistently and you can focus on other parts of your game.... and get great comfort in the fact you are one of about 0.01 percent of snooker players... |
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if a professional coach was asking the same thing, but WANTED the collision aiong the spot line, he would have his hands in the air if his pupil could do this more than not...
a major part of peoples bad play is due to not hitting the ball correctly, which this test will amplify. get this right consistently and you can focus on other parts of your game.... and get great comfort in the fact you are one of about 0.01 percent of snooker players...*** |
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two identical posts except for three asterisks at the end of the second one? thats strange.
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lol, not really. i edited out most the typos...
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pokermonster (or anyone else)
talking about this again today at the club. what happens if you put topspin/overspin/follow-through on the cue ball AS WELL AS sidespin? thinking about this has given me a headache - the white cannot roll and spin in two different directions can it? |
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munch man
I've no idea what you're talking about but reading your forum name does make me want a bag of monster munch |
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although i'm big and fat and eat a lot, my forum name is due to the fact i am very good at getting a golf ball to spin back on the green. golfers call this munch hence i am known as munch man. this caused my interest in this thread because the action seemed it might be a bit similar.
anyway - pokermonster or anyone else please: what happens to the cue ball when you put topspin and sidespin on it? somebody must know surely. |
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Munch man .. hasn't there been a rule change regarding grooves or somesuchlike on the face of clubs, making the ball less munchable?
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i heard talk of that. has it been enforced already?
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Apparently so, was speaking to someone today who was saying the pros at the Qatar golf this week are all trying out new clubs
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ah right, thanks. won't affect the likes of me i suppose. i'm not a pro and certainly won't be shelling out for another set of clubs just yet!
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pokermonster (or anyone else)
talking about this again today at the club. what happens if you put topspin/overspin/follow-through on the cue ball AS WELL AS sidespin? thinking about this has given me a headache - the white cannot roll and spin in two different directions can it? |
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last chance, i'm playing again tomorrow.
can anyone answer my question in the post above? |
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Hit with side and topspin. Current theory on this thread is that the topspin element will expire and side spin will prevail. Forward rotation quickly equalises with rollling motion with no slip.
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thanks speedy. i still dont quite understand though mate. what happens to the white when you hit it with top AND side at the same time. does it roll forwards, slide, or spin sideways? Im having trouble understanding how it can do more than one thing at the same time.
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It is only a point contact with the cloth it can roll forwards and still have a sidespin momentum.
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so it would only roll forwards and NOT spin sideways, is that what you mean? it must spin sideways at some point though because when it bounces off the cushion you can see it come off at a wider angle than you would expect. when you say side spin momentum do you mean the white starts to spin sideways after it has hit the colour ball and thus has stopped rolling? if that is the case it is amazing to think it has side spin stored up in it but it only works after the white has stopped rolling!
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the white cannot roll and spin in two different directions can it?
yeah why not, the spin is a combination of top and side, ie ball will roll forwards but spin will be diagonal like / direction for top right, has tiny or no affect on cueball path to or off object ball but alters path from first cushion onwards... friction will take over time and convert to straight roll as ball slows, or ball will come to rest still spinning sideways, depending on the type of shot... B-) |
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Just reading it now.
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aha! you found it! well done.
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topical at the moment as well, with the snooker being on. watching sleby v hendry just now.
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Someone should have a word with all these pros on tv just now, why would they ever hit above centre, if not to apply topspin?
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it's no good me trying to answer that tbh, i'm pony at the game, but i think that was answered somewhere in the thread.
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what i want to know is what happens when you put on top and side together. i couldn't really understand the explanations of this.
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I think the whole thread is a question of semantics, tbh.
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i honestly believed that, like most on this thread at first, if you hit the cue ball above centre it caused the white to spin forwards in the same way it must spin backwards if you hit it low down. i don't believe this to be true any more though
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Yes, fair enough, i still would like to know the reason why anyone would ever strike above centre. (if not to impart topspin, then why?)
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to make sure there is no screw i suppose
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or stun
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