i didn't realise that Evans has now made a further public statement ...

---- Dr David Evans’ address to the Anti-Carbon-Tax rally, Perth Australia, 23 March 2011. ---

http://joannenova.com.au/2011/03/david-evans
-carbon-modeler-says-its-a-scam/#more-14022

hi womble - interesting audio link - i dont think anyone disagrees to halt or modify pollution - how we go
about it is the challenge ahead

Michael Grubb's profile can be found here
(He was formerly Chief Economist at the Carbon Trust, the £100m/yr body established to spearhead the UK’s transition to a low carbon economy, from which he stood down in Oct 2009 to write a book The Carbon Connection. )

http://www.climatestrategies.org/about-us/our-people.html


Full description for The Carbon Connection - Michael Grubb
The oil shock, the credit crunch and the near-collapse of global climate negotiations demand a radical rethink of current policies. Michael Grubb and his co-authors present a path to tackling climate change that can also enhance international and energy security, and help global financial and political adjustment to the rise of the emerging economies. Bringing together insights from contemporary development, management and behavioural sciences, this book develops a new planetary economics. As carbon becomes an increasingly limited and valuable global resource, it can also serve as an anchor point for adjusting global financial imbalances. This book shows that low carbon economies can have a longrun competitive advantage because of their higher efficiency and reduced exposure to oil instability. The key to making this transition lies in the integrated use of: innovation policy; carbon pricing; and, consumer empowerment. The triad of interlinked solutions presented in this book can create a tipping point towards energy and climate security. A coalition of countries that spearhead this agenda will benefit most from it - the powerful combination of benefits it offers will make it impossible, ultimately, for any country to stand aside.

Micaheal appears one of many in the UK/Euro thinktank who seem determined to re-distribute the wealth of existing nations.   That is such a fascinating topic.   I mean think about.    Take a portion of a countries wealth and move it around.    Who or which countries are the UN lining up to receive this welfare handout.    I can't find any
documentation naming one country ?    What is this really about.   Forget conspiracy, forget global warming, forget
climate change.    Just what are they proposing, for how long (i mean forever from now on etc)

read again the german economist and memeber of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) (Un founded)
and see what is really behind the "climate" change philosophy

just out of interest, as we now live in a global economy, why are people so scared of "one world government"???  not that it will ever happen

just out of interest, as we now live in a global economy, why are people so scared of "one world government"???  not that it will ever happen

That's wombleoz speak for "Bring it on"

about farking time - Greg Combet to outline some more details about the compensation package today - will be interesting to see how this changes the "Great big new tax" lines from Abbott - will the pensioners be out on the streets arguing they don't want the extra money in their pockets???

Climate Change Minister Greg Combet will today announce the general structure of proposed compensation for households under the carbon tax.

The Federal Government has maintained that all revenue from the carbon price scheme will be used to compensate households and sensitive industries, and support energy efficiency and new technologies



another labor lie : only 90% at best as 10% goes overseas

Wobleoz... Of course most folk are happy with the United Nations...

Simply making a point towards World Government and also Carbon Tax... they will both come in...

United Nations... the title gives a clue on its increasing role...
World Bank ... gives a clue on its increasing role...
United Nations Peacekeeping Force... (and I say this loosely, lol) is the largest most diverse army in the world...

It is 'their' policy to have a Global Carbon Tax ... hence, we will have one in Australia, just as every Western country will have on as the years pass...
The 'lesser' countries, once being monetary, milatry controlled and friendly government in place by the UN, will also be taxed accordingly, funded of course by the World Bank which is funded by Western Countries...

This sort of procedure has been going on for many decades... these are facts...

The Australian Government, no matter which party will be on 'control', will introduce one form or another of this Carbon Tax... and it matters not if folk agree or disagree, benefit or not benefit...

It has been already decided...

We all know what happens to subsidies... (other than the rorting) is that one day, they will gradually be removed with the same old words of, 'user pays' ... 'not fair on others', etc etc etc...

....................................................................................................................

NOT TRUE allthough the the deniers would like everyone to believe this.

Try the Medicare Levy and the subsidy of the Pharnacuticl Benefits Scheme.

A scheme that is perhaps on a similiar scale as the Carbon Tax.

The PBS and the Medicare Levy have worked well and the system is worlds best practice.

But the deniers don't want the truth to get in the way of their refusal to believe that we should pay a price for all the pollution we pump into the atmosphere every day.

Abbott is really a tool. What a joke of a press conference he gave in response to Greg Combet today.

All he could do is continue his negative,negative,negative carping. Not a positive thought could have crossed his mind. He has none. [smiley:crazy]

Oh,  when asked what his plan without a Carbon Tax wouild do to achieve a reduction in our pollution he responded with,,,,,

We are going take a billion dollars from consolidated revenue through savings....... neglecting to call it (OUR TAXES) and plant more trees and clean our dirt ( or words to that effect)

and the Libs are going to strip the compensation from the pensioners/low and Middle Income earners as well if they get elected.

Electricity prices will rise with or without a Carbon Tax

He said that Electricity prices are going to rise because of the Carbon Tax, as if to say that Electricity Prices will not rise under a Liberal Gov't.

How bizzare............. he really is looking more like an idiot every day.

Doesn't give a stuff about what is good for the country.

Doesn't give a stuff about Pensioners or the Low and Middle income earners

Doesn't give a stuff about what is good for the enviornment

Doesn't give a stuff about anything except gaining power.

We know that over 50% of compensation will be directed to low/middle income households definetely during the first YEAR and then.....



I'm sure wombleoz thinks today's performance was just wonderful and dandy - and good for you - look on the bright side of life, and all that jazz.

But in reality it was a political blunder.

Labor are fighting battles on a number of fronts - and politically, they are seriously struggling to sell any message or put together a cohesive and legitimate argument.

To say Gillard has her work cut out for her - is a massive understatement.

Combet's let the cat out of the bag and its got NOTHING to do with "consultation" AFL...ffs.

The compensation is temporary.

Today raised more questions than answers - that my point AFL.

The Coalition Opposition is behaving like any Opposition should - applying scrutiny to government policies and actions and holding them ferociously to account.

To suggest the Coalition is deflecting - or to tell them off for critcising or for lack of policy is just farcical. 

Nonsense, and you know it.

No need for compensation when there is no carbon tax.

[smiley:crazy][smiley:crazy][smiley:crazy][smiley:crazy][smiley:crazy] 

You understand that AFL?  ROFLMAO

But the punchline, Combet has basically confirmed that the compensation will be temporary then fade away - so much for "low income earners will be BETTER OFF". 

Yeah for 12 months or so.

That is a downright lie. He was questioned at least twice regarding how long the compensation would be in place and he said permanately in place and cover any gaps that might occur between the level of any price rises and the level of compensation.

After Julia Gillard said:

"there will be no carbon tax under the government I lead"

Gillard Labor and the desperate supporters are squealing in desperation, "TRUST US, TRUST US, YOU'LL BE BETTER OFF"

First of all the deniers said that the compensation wouldn't happen.

Then they said well it will only be the pensioners that will be compensated, not the the average worker.

Now they cry that the compensation will stop in a few years.

As you’ll recall, Tony Abbott and Greg Hunt went through a phase of claiming that a $30 — not $40 — price on carbon would produce increased electricity costs of $1110 a year. This year, they quietly abandoned the $1100 figure and reverted to saying it would lift electricity prices by $300.

They’re in the ballpark — but for a $40 carbon price, not a $30 carbon price, which would raise electricity prices by less than $220 a year, even without the fuel rebate. Well done to John Quiggin, who suggested a $30 price would produce an electricity price rise of $200 a year back in early February when he demonstrated what rubbish Hunt was talking.

Or there’s Tony Abbott’s paid parental leave scheme, funded by a levy that, if passed through by businesses (the same way a carbon price would be), would have cost households on average $390 a year.

So ABBOTT has the gall to criticize Labor for a great big new tax.....when his TAX was going to cost nearly 50% more.

[smiley:crazy][smiley:crazy][smiley:crazy]

looking forward to more detail - good the pensioners, low and middle income earners can now relax - compensation coming their way

Combet, Gillard and Brown are trying to sell us a used tax Terry McCrann From: Herald Sun April 14, 2011 12:00AM

WOULD you buy a used tax from Greg Combet and his mates Bob Brown and Julia Gillard?
It's only been slightly used, only been driven so to speak on Sundays, by its former owner named Kevin - before his best mates Julia and Wayne persuaded him to garage it. And then, promptly 'locked' him in, or out, with it.

Because if you do, I've got a certain bridge in a city on the harbour to sell you. Newly painted and all.

Just how stupid does the prime minister and her climate minister think you are? Pretty damn stupid has to be the answer.

There they both were yesterday, saying we want to hit you with a $10 billion tax, to pretty quickly grow to a $20 billion or $30 billion one. And we promise to give you back half of it.

They actually think this is the trump card! Climate Change Minister Combet: "I can assure you ... that more than 50 per cent of the carbon price revenue will be used to assist households."

While earlier in the day, the prime minister herself even more emphatically: "I can guarantee that more than 50 per cent ... of the revenue raised will go to assisting households."

She then managed to say with a straight face: "That means millions of Australian households will be better off under a carbon price."

How persuasive can you get? We hand over $10 billion, they give us $5 billion back. And it just gets "better" as the tax rises. We hand over $20 billion, they give us back $10 billion. We hand over $40 billion, they give us back $20 billion.

So this is what Ms Gillard means when she claims that people will be "better off". Just focus on the $5 billion or $10 billion or more that you are "getting back".

You don't need to worry about the $10 billion or $20 billion or more flowing to Canberra, because as Gillard and Combet keep claiming, you won't be paying it.

No, only the big so-called polluters will be paying the tax. Believe that and I have an opera house to throw in with the bridge I've got to sell you.

Further, the promise only appears to apply specifically to half of what's raised with the initial level at which the tax starts. When the tax is up to $30 billion a year, how much of that will be given back?
The give-back only flows to some taxpayers. Perhaps half of personal taxpayers will get zero, zip, nada from the get-go, and so also all business taxpayers. They're going to have to raise their prices or go broke or both.

Just to really make you feel enthusiastic, Gillard and Combet promise to hand the other half that is raised to climate change spivs and mainchancers - by splashing the money on useless wind farms and solar power(less) plants.

Combet seems well suited to this. I don't think I've seen any previous minister who has managed to so seamlessly combine the most basic stupidity and the most shameless dishonesty. While at the same time demonstrating he actually doesn't have a clue that's what he is doing!

In his speech yesterday he used the word 'pollution' or a variant a total of 48 times, either directly or indirectly linked to the word carbon.

In every case he was of course talking about carbon dioxide - not simply harmless but utterly necessary plant food.

You'd have to conclude that he does know just how dishonest he was being to so repeatedly talk about carbon pollution - deliberately promoting an image of dirty bits of grit.

But you'd also have to conclude that at some level he actually doesn't.

The stupidity and dishonesty is also captured and projected in the claim that on the one hand "only" the so-called big polluters will pay. But about half of you will be "compensated", indeed over-compensated.

Compensated for what? If only the polluters are paying?

Further Combet - and Gillard - continue to tell lies about China. They must know they are lying. But again incredibly, they also appear to believe what they say - having a bizarre ability to "not see" all the new coal-fired power stations that China is opening.

There is a very clear bottom line. This is a huge tax. It will grow to be at least half the size of the GST, perhaps even more.

You all got fully compensated for the GST with the personal tax cuts. The Gillard-Brown government isn't even promising that with this tax.

Just think about that. Imagine a prime minister standing up and promising to raise the GST from 10 to 15 per cent - and not providing any offset by way of tax cuts or other rebates to half of all taxpayers and all, repeat all, of business.

Indeed, that it is entirely possible it could end up being the equivalent of doubling the GST to 20 per cent.

A tax that's exactly opposite to the reform of the GST and the price-cutting impact of tariff reductions, will very seriously damage the economy.

That a government could be so inept in both political and policy terms is almost beyond belief.
Except it is happening, right out there before your eyes in plain view, personified and projected by Gillard and Combet.

They are starting to make Bob Brown look like the voice of reason and sanity.

in 2007 - both major parties went to the election promising to put a price on carbon

in 2010 - Labor campaigned to introduce a price on Carbon through a price on carbon

throughout this time the Greens have constantly campaigned to put a price on carbon

we voted for a hung parliament and gave the BOP in the senate at the 2010 election - therefore we voted to put a price on carbon

we could keep pushing it back further and further but the sooner we act the better and not only to make the planet a cleaner place, business wants / needs certainty