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THE CLIMATE CHANGE MYTH that Julia wants us all to pay for
THE CLIMATE CHANGE MYTH that Julia wants us all to pay for
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still waiting for my answer womble re the .0007% emmissions difference will make to the planet?
charging billions of dollars to achieve this does not make any sense , reducing pollution is a good thing womble but its how it is done thats the problem , juliars approach is wrong pure and simple , give the money back to arguably the worst offenders , the poor , who wont change if they dont have to , cant afford anything other than a 15yr old falcodore and will continue on their merry way because they wont be out of pocket , the toorak road latte set dont care about a few extra dollars but the people that WILL be gonski big time is middle australia with average to ok wages burdened already with exhorbitant water,rates and electricity cost and have already been doing the right thing implementing changes (government encouraged for years now)to negate rising electricity costs, turn things off at the wall , less air con use , change the light bulbs etc, and have nowhere to go to save anymore but now have the added carbon tax, these people are SCREWED big time and believe me middle australia has a HUGE SAY come voting time |
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womble?.....a little irritating you ask plenty but rarely answer, just spin spin spin to suit the party line without ever answering the direct question, how dare i expect any more secong
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Interesting electoral result in Ireland.
The Greens have been SMASHED to oblivion. Primarily because they continued to loft up a pathetic centre-left government. Are you listening Julia?  [;)] |
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Have'nt seen any media references linking "climate change" and the "Rainbow Coalition", thought it was a perfect fit.
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will be interesting to see how the Liberals here see this one - is he right or is "climate change c r a p"
from the SMH website Debate about tax not climate: Abbott AAP Federal Opposition Leader Tony Abbott says the carbon pricing debate is about tax, not the environment. Mr Abbott told MPs at the coalition joint party room meeting on Tuesday he was confident the Labor government's plan for a price on carbon from July 2012 can be defeated. He said Prime Minister Julia Gillard had lied to voters during last year's election campaign by saying there would be no carbon tax. Since then she had effectively handed her job over to Australian Greens leader Bob Brown, he said. Advertisement: Story continues below The coalition would have an "overwhelming mandate" at the next election to abolish the measure, he said. "This is a tax issue not an environmental issue," Mr Abbott said. He added that the coalition believed climate change was real and human activity influenced it. Opposition deputy leader Julie Bishop urged coalition MPs to mobilise community support for scrapping the tax. Opposition climate change spokesman Greg Hunt, who has argued a $26 a tonne carbon price would push up petrol and electricity prices, added a new argument to the coalition' arsenal - that average households' gas prices would rise $150 a year. A party room spokesman said there was no opposition to the shadow cabinet's decision on Monday to scrap the carbon tax laws. |
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secong - i'm not a scientist and i don't know what effect the carbon tax will have on climate change - i hope, as plenty others do, that it helps. I do know for certain though that it will be of more benefit than doing nothing
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the phrase 'climate change' only came about when the phrase 'global warming' was acknowledged as a 'false belief '
by the very people (including the #1 head honcho of US govt's climate assessment bureaus) that originally proposed the suggestion of 'let's get the hard-working people's money' .. cause we've run out and can't afford the 'world we want to live in' 'climate change due to carbon pollution' it it NOT a proven fact ... so to impose a tax based on a non-factual situation is quite clearly ... cycnical and money-grubbing these are interesting times though  |
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Looks like the pool of people following your line of thinking is shrinking Thebas - even Abbott is saying it's real now
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lol womble ... i of all people are not politically linked in any way ... i don't believe any of the rhetoric from either side ... and from a casual layperson's observation of events ... in comparison to all the past events i've lived through i will offer up this ...
the western world has run out of cash to 'run the western world' ... it was always a deck of cards ready to collapse and the GFC in the US followed by Europe ... is now well and truly about to happen here govt needs cash ... but they can't just up the GST (even tho that is the logical way) because all it will do is stifle retail consumption ... when retail consumption collapses so will businesses ... when businesses collapse unemployment will proliferate .... mortgages will be handed back ... and a whole swathe of other demises will follow (let your imagination go wild) so the ONLY way to get revenue now is to take 'more money' from the working people (oh yes TAXATION) but that money MUST by definition be from what we call "essential services" because that is what people will just continue to 'pay up' on ... these essential servces are .... electricity gas water ... people will just pay the cost increases because you turn on a tap and you turn on the electricity etc ... it's got nothing to do with the environment lol ... all political parties know this is the truth and also WHERE the cash must come from petrol will of course follow ... and the people will pay ... (there was gonna be blood in the streets when it hit 1$ a litre lol) global warming is gone and disproved ... climate change .... LOL what a ripper ... the climate is changing and the people honest citizens are to blame LOL ... so the TAX is immenent ... even tho it's a lie ... because you can feed people anything ... and the followers will just believe so these are NOT good times ahead ... maybe the TAX has to come ... who knows but the reason behind it is total deception ... and maybe its best to have the sheep believe the deception .. rather than panic en masse at the truth that lies ahead for us all i can say is ... these are interesting times coming up ... on our side of the world |
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the government is actually doing just fine economically - as tomorrow's growth figure will show
kinda makes your post irrelevant |
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Your desperate wombleoz.
I've said it before and I'll say it again. Desperate. Since when you do you Tony Abbott as a pin-up boy for arguments. Fair dinkum mate. As again, on a political note, the Liberal Party is a party of broad views, ideas and opinions - thats not something new - though it may be new to someone with views and thinkings, such as yourself. And the most important note to make - Liberals unlike Laborites are able to cross the floor. Some will have different views just as MANY MEMBERS OF THE GOVERNMENT have varying views on climate change and a carbon tax - and many other issues - but you cross the floor within Labor - and your out. On the matter of climate change and this carbon tax - wombleoz will do anything and everything to steer discussion away from the ultimate betrayal that has been discussed at watercoolers across the nation in recent days. This is a Prime Minister caught out. A PM on the backfoot and a PM getting whipped by the white hot anger brewing within the community. People aren't happy - and rightly so. We're seeing the likes of Craig Emerson of Labor completely implode on Sky News this morning. I saw a Labor Senator this afternoon on ABC News24 trying to again push the point, that this is a carbon price not a tax...... This is just the beginning. Whatever your thinking on the THEORY of climate change - I'm all for a cleaner environment - but I disagree with a carbon tax. But right now the Australian people are after a please explain (and maybe some detail, which would be handy) from this PM and this government on this great big new tax on everything that SHE promised we wouldn't see under a government she led. |
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*Since when you do you use Tony Abbott as a pin-up boy for arguments.
PS - I'm going back to the Classic forum, this Beta version is fkd. Freezing up and all that sh1t. |
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baa baa baaa
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I'm with you all the way thebas.
Saw a graph last week of CO2 levels versus the temperature over a certain timeframe (which escapes me) and the CO2 has been incredibly higher at other times as the temperature has actually dropped. I mean the link between CO2 human activity and climate change is just fanciful - its complete nonsense. |
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I mean the link between CO2 human activity and climate change is just fanciful - its complete nonsense.
spot on jez ... the baaa baaa was for womble lol ... but he's a big boy and will see the fun i meant ... and this has been an amazing thread for the depth that it has gone |
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I mean the link between CO2 human activity and climate change is just fanciful - its complete nonsense.
It's exactly what Tony Abbott did today it's the Kewl Thebas, Baaa all you like - time will tell how all this unfolds |
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Good to see Thebas getting fairdinkum....
IMO it'd sad to hear that Womble says the Gov't is in good shape as it is at the expense of the people.I believe in financial prudence but when it comes to goughing tax...we must be the highest taxed nation on earth here in Oz... I was walking past a gov't retail office ( will remain nameless) and overheard a couple of staff talking about Gov't money....I stopped ...and said to them ..."it's the taxpayers cash ...not the Govt's ...be best you remind yourselves of that" and continued walking ...they looked at me like I was some nutter ...but hopefully they took it on board. |
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we're not over taxed AP - if we want to maintain the quality of life we have and continue to benefit from the services we do, we need to pay for it
not that we shouldn't have tax reform, we definitely should - but overall, as a whole, we need to at least maintain what we're paying now - question becomes who should pay i hope you were screaming about how we were over taxed under Howard and Costello with their massive surpluses - i.e. the EXTRA money they took from us but didn't need - you should either spend it on services / infrastructure or give it back |
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shame they had to pay off the bills firstly hey womble. then left a nice big surplus for kevvie to pi$$ up against the wall and THEN SOME
if we want to maintain the quality of life we have and continue to benefit from the services we do, we need to pay for it with a great big NEW TAX????? |
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Spot on secong.
Some of these taxes wouldn't be necessary had Labor not wasted billions and billions and billions of OUR money. But this carbon tax and the great big lie takes the cake. Remember, when you wake up in the middle of the night and roll over and see the red light of your clock radio - you can remember that Julia is taxing you..............[>o] CO2 levels will NOT be affected by this great big new tax on everything. Climate change will continue. But YOU continue to pay. And wombleoz sits back on Toorak Road sipping on his latte and pondering the spoils of this governments socialist agenda. |
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Remember, when you wake up in the middle of the night and roll over and see the red light of your clock radio - you can remember that Julia is taxing you..............
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will we be allowed to have one anyway....maybe the green army will do a door to door compulsory acquisition
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global warming hysteria ... stable for over a decade ... and dropped by the 'taxation' proponents
then came climate change ... well the climate has been changing for eons and now carbon pollution ... that we need to TAX on ******** Professor Happer is a former director of Energy Research at the Department of Energy he was suggesting 2 years agao our children should not be force-fed propaganda, masquerading as science **** the full exerpt is available for reading below ... and is another point of view could well be considered http://www.thenewamerican.com/tech-mainmenu-30/environment/835 |
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Ray Hadley now referring to Bob Brown as the Prime Minister on his morning show
Spot on I reakon. It's a joke. Gillard Labor is an absolute disgrace. It'd be funny if it wasn't so damaging to the national interest. |
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All of these scientists get zero media air time thebas.
They're kept nice and quiet by government. |
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Totally concur Womble : My issue is with every govt the last 16 years...the fkers keep tapping the well ffs. Im sure I read a report that we are the highest or one of taxed countries on the planet.(Ex failed states - Zimbabwe etc)
Howard years pumped it into the middle class to help pay for all the plasmas and two cars- keep both parents working to gain the impossible dream-- house of cards as explained in previous posts Cheers AP |
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And yes Womble- Infrastructure investment a shambles and has to be caught up but IMO most utilities are half privatised ... so the end user gets fkd again
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spot on AP - we need major reforms but we also need taxes
interesting, but not surprising, to hear their is a $20 billion hole in the Liberals "direct action" plan to deal with climate change - which now believe in again - yes folks that's right, the ones with the $11 billion hole in their election costings are at it again and where will the $20 billion come from??? that's right, your tax dollars once again |
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It wasn't a hole in the budget costings wombleoz - pretty sure you'd be aware of that you sneak, but never get the truth get in the way of a good LIE;
Such is the Labor way, "Whatever it takes". It was a question mark from Treasury over the SURPLUS amount from the independent costings obtained by the Coalition. And at it again? You've got gall. Coming from the chief supporter of a party (Labor) that insists on submitting ITS policies for costing at 10:30pm on Election Eve in 2007, when it was in Opposition. You croak the same pathetic lines wombleoz, you fool no one - but maybe it reassures you with such a shambolic Labor government in play right now. AP, interesting to note that wombleoz will do absolutely anything to talk about the Liberals (Opposition) at a time when the government should be hitting its straps - but insteads its a ship thats hit an iceberg and is slowly going down - this carbon tax will be its last hurrah. They don't want to about JuLIAR, the great big new tax on everything and the great big lie - you know, the ultimate betrayal of the Australian people. Not only that, but wheres the detail? Desperate times call for desperate measures - and wombleoz, you've got that cliche all wrapped up pal. |
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so what is your view of the alternative policy Jez? i.e the one that we get if we don't get a carbon tax - Liberal policy so you probably love it but surely you have some doubts?? and how will it be paid for???
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Nothing quite like watching a comrade under pressure.
Its ok wombleoz, Gillard Labor are in a strong and stable majority government that will certainly run the full term - oh and she's got plenty of political capital and goodwill in the bag as well. |
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Look, I have sincerely question and would LOVE to see the documents, this so called review on the Liberals direct action policy.
Sounds as if its the product of a goverment desperate for a breather, after being under sustained attack. It's a good line "$20bn black hole" - but I question its accuracy. Look, lets be honest and I'll be apolitical for a moment, its difficult for either side to genuinely cost policies even with independent assistance when in Opposition - nothing can match the broad analysis and resources of Treasury and there associated modelings, assessments and future forecasting, etc. Both try to avoid submittion for costings and fair enough. The Coalition did well considering the circumstances last year - the only thing they were pinged on was the complete surplus figure, which Treasury questioned, as according to there calculations would be about $7bn less than forecast. They paid the price. Back to the Liberal policy. I'm a Liberal, so therefore I'm for smaller government and less taxes. I disagree fundamentally with this flawed carbon tax scheme. I am outcome driven - and this has no outcomes - all it delivers is pain, it delivers pain to all Australian's who are at the moment, really bloody stretched. They really can't cop this one sweet. We're taking action (that does FA for the environment) whilst the big polluters continue on there merry way and we continue shoveling coal across to China, I mean - is this fair dinkum? Forget the climate change theory. I am all for a greener environment. And as I've said, I'm outcome driven, as are many Liberals. So thats why I'm all for the Direct Action plan. There's more to be done - and lets face it, it is earlyish in the cycle (though these are new circumstance) and an Opposition always plays its policy cards close to its chest - both LABOR and LIBERAL. However, I think the Direct Action plan hits the right note - not sure if you have ACTUALLY read it - I'm not going to spell it out, but here it is: http://liberal.org.au/~/media/Files/Policies%20and%20Media/Environment/The%20Coalitions%20Direct%20Action%20Plan%20Policy.ashx/ Plenty of public forums and community engagement involved in this process - and I'm sure the Coalition will be out and about seeking further feedback, ideas and opinions on this policy. But yeah, I like it, there's more to add, but its an honest policy. |
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*Look, I have sincerely questioned
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and how is your Direct Action plan going to be paid for???
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What gets me is ...and changing the topic a bit ...with all this media attention on this useless tax( I would happily pay a Murray Darling levy to save it, for example) is that agricultural land is being destroyed by the coal seam gas grab for cash....money being cut to fight agricultural issues... Woolies and Coles selling Milk for peanuts ( which must be really jamming up the producers)importation of food from China which is really fkn questionable , streaming in.I could go on : Banana's etc , agricultural land been bought up by foreign gov't buisness arms( ffs no one in this country can tell what is owned by who ) basically unchecked....Kiwi's had this problem and put a stop to it.
And the minute somebody questions this they are either called Racist or against free markets. This country is a laughing stock from sectors around the world for what is happening , this free trade stuff. And yes ...tap the miners for more royalties but don't go to hard at it.When it's gone ..they will fk off and dig a hole elsewhere leaving us with what. Imo Libs should support the mining tax but oppose Carbon tax. All sides of politics should be fkn ashamed this is happening on their watch. But as Jez points out ...Labour is the Gov't at present so deflecting attacks on the Coalition only is to protect their own deficencies. I am drunk but you guys get my drift[;)][smiley:crazy] |
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Not a bad post after a few drinks AP - wrong thread maybe but not bad [;)]
there's something to lots of what you say but the 24hr media cycle means much of it is ignored or just pops up on the radar briefly and vanishes to be replaced by something more catchy - it's frustrating |
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Really important point AP about Labor being the government.
The comrades are getting increasingly desperate as the party is strained by polling numbers and leadership murmurs. |
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Cheers Lads....that's why Ive got a bit of time for Bob Katter. They spin him off as a nutter ....but I am yet to see somebody beat /debate him on his facts
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Try this one that proved what a fool he is...................."There's no gays in my electorate."
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lol AFL - a technicality [;)]
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