"Mr Memory"

He got Adorable Cyril accepted.

LOL.
:-)

When I first came across Ted Sturman, he employed one of the best teams on the racecourse.....Jimmy Green, Johnny RAF & "Fat Ronnie" the clerk. Ronnie would only use a "Double H" pencil & I used to get him a supply from work.
Bill used to call ted a "handcuff merchant" because if you asked him for a larger than average bet, he would hold your hand with the money in before laying you.....in the meantime Jimmy was beating the price for him elsewhere...then the bet was called.
I believe that Ted was an erstwhile customer of "Denis the Chest"

Two more people whose funerals I went to ,namely Fat Ronnie Richards and Denis Stogden.You are absolutely right about Fat Ronnie and the 2H pencils.Years ago Fattie was clerking for John Kendrick from Coventry at Yarmouth one day and Kendrick looked over the book and said "Ron your writings getting worse I cant read your figures"Ronnie quick as a flash,replied John its not my writing getting worse the scotch your drinking is getting stronger! Kendrick like many bookies at the time would have a drink between every race.The Chest was Kendricks rep for many years,he liked a tot as well.Jackie Keeffe and Harry Allen were also on the firm.Kendrick,although betting at Midland and Northern course,loved**neys working for him.His son married Liverpool bookmaker Harry Marlows daughter.
As for the Binns firm dont forget Doodles(Jim the Scotsman on the bag).

"whitmarsh"................Both Tommy Turner & his namesake John were also known to have the odd drink between races.

whitmarsh & mr memory, Do you go back to the days of the `razor gangs`that worked the racecourses, years ago ?

Mr. Memory,The names you recollect are amazing,Tommy Turner was Wm.Hills drinking pal.My everlasting memory of Ted Sturman was at Cheltenham when an American trained steeplechaser won a top hurdle race at 50/1.It wasnt the big meeting and the crowd was thin.I remember Ted high up on his boxes,as usual,with bins up to his eyes start singing "The Star Spangled Banner"at the top of his voice as the Yank moved up at the top of the hill.Turning in it hit the frontand Ted sang every verse ,word for word,until it crossed the line the easy winner.The other bookies,workmen and even the crowd gave Ted such a cheer the American jockey must have thought he had won the Gold Cup.

Dennis The Chest suffered terrible through his life with asthma but was out in all weathers and never complained.I stayed away with him one time and he spent the night with his head out the window gasping for air.Dennis should have had a gents outfitters shop,he could look at you for the first time and say"151/2 round the bushel(bushel and peck)40reg(suit size) and the plates are a plumbers mate (size 8 shoes)99 tmes out of 100 he was spot on.The Chester Barries were his speciality.

One day at Epsom Ernie Deadbody was selling shoes.Charlie Levy,who had a reputation for being careful with his money,was a size 12.He tried a pair on but they were obviously too tight for him but Charlie loved a bargain and I remember him saying"Theyll give ,Theyll give in time".Two other Driscoll brothers, Teddy and Jerry,both shouted"Not on you they wont".There were a lot of Driscoll brothers-Patsy,Connie,Jerry,Johnny,Dannyand Teddy that I knew of.

One of the most interesting men I met racing was Ignatius Shakespeare or Nash as he was known.I stayed at his home in Wakefield for York races.In the twenties he was a useful professional boxer and after he retired boxed in the booths at fairs and various events.Nash used to make a book at Epsom on Derby day and also came down for "Ally Pally".With his trademark cauliflower ear Ive seen him swing his big buckled belt round above his head to form a tossing pit on Town Moor at the Leger meeting for the big pitch and toss games where hundreds changed hands.In later years he used to make the boxes the bookies stood on and he put them out on race days.This was the course North of the Trent.His brother,John Harold,won the Powderhall Sprint,a big gambling athletics event,one year.His son Peter was tic tac for John Joyce of Hartlepool.When Nash died he got a nice write up in The Boxing News.*courses

"whitmarsh"...............Talking of boxes & the improvements introduced by the new regime.......Sandown immediately got rid of the boxes & I then walked behind Stephen Little who was carrying his own yellow Schweppes tonic water crate to stand on............a bit ironic when the firm that he was representing had spent nearly £1 million sponsoring the "Eclipse" at Sandown over the years.
The bland monotony of the joints is something else that has devalued the atmosphere on the racecourse.........the last old fashioned joint with coloured fairground writing was Reagan (Teddy Bell)............it still carried the legend..."Pay On The Blue Flag"

Brilliant - keep em coming guys

"whitmarsh"....................The last time that I went to Sandown, I bumped into "Denis the Singer"...........there is only Robert Bruce Tellick left now.

Mr.Memory,Youve done me there,Ididnt knowBobbys middle name was Bruce.I chuckled about your post about the Blue Lamp.....100/30the seven dog,terrific.What about Crooks In Cloisters when reading The Sporting Life Bernard Cribbens said"My new dogs running in the first at White City tonight,he can win on his Irish"Micky Watts,a regular at Stamford Bridge,wrote the screenplay.The patter was bang right.Bernard Cribbens,Barbara Windsor(bikini),Melvyn Hayes,Ronald Fraser,Wilfred Bramble and all.

Mr Memory
Before my time, but apparently if the guvnor fancied one everything else was a big price.
Hence everybody round the pitch for the first show.
Don't know how "successful" it was. But it didnt last long ;-)
Not seen Bobby for a few years now.

I met Denis The Singer by chance,in Smithfield Market last year.He told me his wife, Edie,had died the year before.He had been to Ascot as a guest of Derek Smith,who had a box there,Derek has really reached the top as one of the Coolmore Triumvirate.
Mr.Memory,do you remember when Snouty Parker was the guvnor?

I saw Lionel at Huntingdon one day and he told me he doesnt go to the dogs at all any more which surprised me.I was also surprised when he told me he had moved up Northampton way.Is the brother,Alfie still alive,he used to have it on.
I was talking to Ballie Dias one night at Harringay and I asked him how come he traded in the name of T.W.Parker.He told me that one Derby day in the twenties he had a pitch on the downes at Epsom.The Dias family,at the time,lived near Wentworth St.market where one of the Parker family had a fruit barrow and Ballie asked if he could use the immitation grass blanket that fronted the barrow.At Epsom Ballie nailed it to the front of his Point to point type jointand the name T.W.Parker was on the grass blanket.He traded in that name from then on.I knew Henry,Moggo and Jackie Dias as well.Jackie made a book inside at Wimbledon for many years.One sister married Sam Harris,the tattersalls bookmaker.

Jack Swift closed my telephone account many years ago,along with the West Ham bookmaker Wally Margolis,of Margolis + Ridley,who had a slogan "You win when you lose with Margolis + Ridley."
Guntrip,from Catford,andGibson in Tottenham were two more that run up the white flag.It never worried me because it takes two to make a bet,I got worried when they sent me Xmas presents.

Regarding Snouty and Maxie Parker. I worked as a trainee settler for Maxie in a betting shop in Poland Street in the west end in the 60s. As for Snouty am I right in thinking that he was responsible for a on course scam known as the Knockout where the favourite's price would be continually knocked out and they would clean up at SP.

Mr Memory. I did not know that the you was referring to that scam as I did not know any of the horses concerned incidentally when I worked at Maxie's shop in Poland street I witnessed first hand the uproar following the notorious Dagenham Coup in 1967 I think it was. £987 for the forecast!