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My suggestion deals with things the way they are presently. If the day arrived when there was no need for the message at all then my excitement at such a development would be akin to those East Germans on the day the wall came down!!
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Vital Spark
There is an acceptable reason why bets might be taken after a fall and that is to allow layers to trade out at 1000, release their funds and so help further liquidity. That's a service for which the transaction cost is neglible and is certainly a better deal than you get with currency exchange operators, for example, by way of comparison who can work to a 15% margin. |
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Sandown, the bookies are not entitled to set their own prices where the SP is concerned. Sharp practice is strongly suspected, with high-level complicity.
The SP is supposed to represent the price on-course, yet it is often shorter than prices which are widely available at the course. Admittedly the post re this is off-topic, but the poster isn't wrong to say that it is a serious issue. It is probably the biggest financial crime in British history. |
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Sandown with that in mind the layers @1000 of not only fallers but all markets awaiting settlement are taking free money for a 10 min wait (approx)for settlement in the case of horse racing.
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Vital A. Tha'ts true, but as time is money it might be worth it for some.
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Borrowed Time, I agree that issue needs looking at (I also agree about Big Mac). The man who implemented the new sp workings, Lord Haw Haw, is up there with Sir Fred and friends.
It would be good to be able to point out these anomalies to betting shop punters and invite them on to an exchange where they wouldn't meet with equally sharp practices. |
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Sandown
Thks for your reply. I disagree its apples and oranges .. especially as the Hight Str thieves, now purportedly bet-in-running. There practices re this, is even more skewed, towards theft. Here u have a case, where 9000 betting shops, are thieving 100's of thousands of pounds, and no-one gives it a second thght. feck et al, are campainging re a nonsense, that affects a few hundred people at most. Get real. |
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Moonlight
What you say is true, but there is nothing to say that BM's cannot influence SP's through hedging into markets whether they be on-course or on exchanges. Indeed, I presume that they are now big manipulators of the BF price and as the BF SP influences the on-course market they achieve the same end. In the instances quoted by VS perhaps the BM operatives were having a coffee break and forgot to play on BF. |
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Ah MIGHT.
Of course one MIGHT also lose |
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I also agree about Big Mac = as in he's the only one who raises the matter.
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feck et al, are campainging re a nonsense, that affects a few hundred people at most.
I disagree with that. Loss of customers affects us all. |
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UnVital spark-so you noticed bets being placed etc. Have you ever noticed bets being placed on withdrawn horses well into a race. How do you explain that?
At a guess, people are putting up offers to fool the bots w.r.t. overrounds. People unaware of the NR bet it or maybe bot owners are attempting to remove the misleading info with 1000 offers. More chicanery artie. |
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artie,you tell me as you appear to be a know all.
why do people trade non runners in running. |
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I know the answer Rab C. (pre programmed bots), but I don't think the UnVital zealot does.
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iIF YOU ARE OLD ENOUGH TO BET .................. FCUCKING NUMPTIES TRYING TO WIPE PEOPLES AR5ES ARE LAUGHABLE (OR SAD) ......... SAME PEOPLE WHO THINK U NEED TO DO A RISK ASSESMENT BEFORE U CLIMB A LADDER FFS
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Reuben
What stage are you at in your reading and writing, I wonder; still on capital letters, I see.Verbs,grammar and spelling next. Big step for you. |
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Never overestimate the intelligence of human beings. Some are so stupid that slightly less stupid people can make fortunes out of them.
Reuben claims to be one of the slightly less stupid and that he has a gardener and a range rover. I think he was a roofer before betfair. iIF YOU ARE OLD ENOUGH TO BET .................. FCUCKING NUMPTIES TRYING TO WIPE PEOPLES AR5ES ARE LAUGHABLE (OR SAD) ......... SAME PEOPLE WHO THINK U NEED TO DO A RISK ASSESMENT BEFORE U CLIMB A LADDER FFS Are you using the same argument to justify bookmakers manipulating sp's or bankers boosting their bonuses at the taxpayer's expense or does it only apply to instances where you're the one inflicting the damage Reubers. |
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artie who is Rab c
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He's referring to me VS and means Rab C. Nesbitt.
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well he should be ashamed of himself.
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FECK WANTS KETTLES SOLD WITH WARNING LABELS SAYING IF YOU TIP THE WATER ONTO YOUR HAND AFTER BOILING IT YOU WILL GET BURNT - DOUGH PEAK HUNT
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Like clouds, reasoned debate goes way over reubens head.
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Funny enough Reubers I gave my daughter the following safety tips when she was young
Never pour boiling water on the unprotected hand. Never stand naked next to a radiator in case the flesh sticks. Never place a hot iron against your cheek. If you run out of baking foil never use freezer bags instead. When you grow up never taint yourself with betfair sleeze. |
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I have an acquaintance in the west who was betting in running using the racetech feeds. He knew of them due to his job as a production man. He knew nothing of horseracing but made enough to retire until it was all stopped in 2,005. He was betting on everything after it had already happened.
He tells me that everyone kept deathly quiet about this until they had the feeds blacked out when all hell let loose. |
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FECK WANTS KETTLES SOLD WITH WARNING LABELS SAYING IF YOU TIP THE WATER ONTO YOUR HAND AFTER BOILING IT YOU WILL GET BURNT - DOUGH PEAK HUNT
The most entertaining instructions I ever saw read: "Setting the VCR clock to a date in the past will not enable the recording of programmes already broadcast." I'm sure there's a similarity in there somewhere for Betfair. |
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In the instances quoted by VS perhaps the BM operatives were having a coffee break and forgot to play on BF.
Normally the on-course books would offload liability on here, bringing the ISP and BSP prices together. There are rumours that the offices are now merely "threatening to bet" on-course, and offering not to if the on-course man shortens his price. If they do this in the last few seconds before the off, he may fear not having enough time to offload his excess liability on here, so complies with the threat, but has no time (or need) to adjust his other prices, so producing huge overrounds. This rumour originated with a Forumite who is known to be an on-course book of long standing and high rep. The fundamental issue is that the "new" SP system involves fewer on-course men reporting, which has made manipulation far easier. The scandalous instances mentioned are ones in which the offices failed to cover their tracks as well as usual. |
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I'm sure they would put such a warning on kettles if there was that many people doing it that pr1cks like Reuben could get a start as a 'doctor'.
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Where there's money, there's muck.
Nothing in life is fair, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't strive to perfection. Allowing people to steal by using fast pictures is criminal, imho. |
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To the Rothschilds, [England's] chief financial agents, Waterloo brought a many million pound scoop.
... a Rothschild agent ... jumped into a boat at Ostend ... Nathan Rothschild ... let his eye fly over the lead paragraphs. A moment later he was on his way to London (beating Wellington's envoy by many hours) to tell the government that Napoleon had been crushed: but his news was not believed, because the government had just heard of the English defeat at Quatre Bras. Then he proceeded to the Stock Exchange. Another man in his position would have sunk his work into consols, already weak because of Quatre Bra. But this was Nathan Rothschild. He leaned against "his" pillar. He did not invest. He sold. He dumped consols. ...Consols dropped still more. "Rothschild knows," the whisper rippled through the 'Change. "Waterloo is lost." Nathan kept on selling ... consols plummeted |
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Just for a little bit of balance, that fast pic merchants always get the money :
3.10 Huntingdon Canni Thinker, 1.8 pre-race. Made a blunder, at 2nd hurdle .. laid 5.8 for 1687 quid laid 55 for 33 quid laid 32 for 566 quid The horse went on to win ... but obviously, u never get to hear about these ... |
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Blunder by the jolly in the 3-10 before it went on to win.
Look at the price it went to in seconds Never seen a horse and jockey recover from a jump like that in 40 years of race watching. 9.80 £40 10.00 £1,228 11.00 £200 12.50 £42 13.00 £431 15.00 £32 16.00 £400 18.00 £200 20.00 £4 25.00 £40 27.00 £7 32.00 £320 34.00 £730 55.00 £269 80.00 £12 100.00 £40 Canny Thinker I've never seen a horse and jockey recover from a jump like that and go on to win. |
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Well betfair did tell us that people were paying money to go into trading shops and make accurate prices for the stay at homes. It seems now that some of these sainted individuals are paying even more money to go courtside and give us these fair deal prices even sooner. STAY AT HOME MUGS HAVE NEVER HAD IT SO GOOD. They should be paying betfair an extra 20% of their losses.
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Never seen a horse and jockey recover from a jump like that in 40 years of race watching.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you're right (and why not) that's that for another 40 years then. Won't weigh too much in the balance of argument, will it? |
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In the last race at hereford, a horses saddle slipped.
Are punters allowed to lay that ? or do they need a special certificate from the feck authority ? |
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IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT YOU COULD ALWAYS NOT BET IN RUNNING AND TAKE YOUR 50P TRIXIE BETS TO LAD BROKES
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Moonlight
the bookies are not entitled to set their own prices where the SP is concerned Ithink you will find that course bookies can set whatever price they like - the SP is actually 'entitled' to be what the course bookies dictate - hence these massive, unfair overrounds I cannot see why any race cannot be 'capped' at 120%, by the SP executive, increasing bookie prices pro rata, until the minimum is achieved, for the rest of the industry to settle, FAIRLY. The massive amont of time the Donoghue enquiry took over this, and then decided on the phrase 'to good money' is a catastrophic mistake - leading the big 3 being able to create140+ overrounds, whenever they choose (+ the last race AW thieves) |
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birch2, I was quoting from Sandown's earlier post where he refers to High St bookmakers.
I agree that there is no reason why the SP shouldn't have a maximum overround, other than the fact that the racing authorities are now remunerated from the gross profits of the High St bookies! Fundmentally all on-course books should be taken into consideration by an honest SP system. The will is lacking now more than ever though. |
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Reubers, please give us some mare tales from Castle Reuben to give us mere mortals something to aspire to.
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LOUIS ROEDERER CRISTAL IS TASTING GOOD TONIGHT FECK ;)
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THE BUTLER HAS DONE WELL WITH THIS 2002 VINTAGE CHAMPAGNE - MUST REVISE HIS SALARY SOON :)
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