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Intermittent Fasting ? I've tried everything else.

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Replies: 101
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 07 Jul 17 23:29
it's hard to do this. second day and i waited to 4pm to eat. i had a six hour window and i ate a big meal. doctor on ytube says you must eat 2000 calories, otherwise your body will go into starvation mode. this is to be avoided. As it'll try and hang on to the weight.
felt stuffed and with the water you feel more stuffed. You actually feel like not eating anything at all as a way to alleviate the stuffed feeling. can't eat now to 4pm tomorrow.

if i counted all the weight I lost in past years i'd be in negative weight territory. it's not losing weight.. it's keeping it off. i went from 15st to 11st twenty years ago and used to run 5-10 k every other day. Lasted a few years. but it's a lot harder as you get older to lose the weight. unless you get ill. the trots.
By:
pxb
When: 08 Jul 17 01:33
it's not losing weight.. it's keeping it off.

That's the problem with dieting. We have evolved to live thru feast and famine cycles, and put on weight during the good (food available) times in preparation for the lean times.

While it takes time, preparing and cooking your own food is the way to go. Make big batches and freeze portion sizes. There is some evidence that cooking your own food signals to your body that food is plentiful and there is no need to put on weight in preparation for lean times.

Otherwise, there is an awful lot of faddy nonsense out there about diet. Good luck.
By:
bigmo
When: 08 Jul 17 06:11
Thanks Dr Crippen. I know I keep banging on about this low carb diet which is essentially what yourself and the others are saying but it's been brilliant for me.
The most pleasing thing is it's become so normal to eat this way I know I wont fail this time.I don't feel like I'm dieting.
Thanks Capt_F
Good luck zorrostrikes with watever you decide to do.
By:
bigmo
When: 08 Jul 17 06:13
Apologies didn't notice page 2 before I posted.
By:
Dr Crippen
When: 08 Jul 17 11:58
Yes bigmo,

Dr Berg on YouTube who has made many videos on the subject of diet, maintains that the explosion in diabetes was caused by guidelines concerning fat in our diets.
This meant that fat got taken out of our diets and was replaced by carbs and sugar.

As the Atkins diet maintains - eat fat grow slim. The Atkins diet eliminates carbs as its base.
By:
Dr Crippen
When: 08 Jul 17 12:01
When I say carbs I include sugar in that.
By:
pxb
When: 08 Jul 17 17:39
I must admit, I am not convinced about carbs. Grains have been a major part of our ancestors diet since the invention of farming. Whereas sugar is a relatively recent addition, from 200 to 300 years ago when sugar cane was started to be grown extensively in the Americas.

Thus we have had roughly 10 times longer (10X more generations) to adapt to grains in our diet than sugar.

There are places where grains (wheat, rice) form a much larger percentage of people's diet than in the West and I am not aware of high levels of diabetes in these places.
By:
Dr Crippen
When: 08 Jul 17 23:07
I am not aware of high levels of diabetes in these places.

Have you any information at all on these places and their incidents of diabetes?
By:
Mc Moonbeam
When: 08 Jul 17 23:37
zorro are you a muslim .. i've never heard of white guys fasting tbh

I've also put a bit of weight on this winter but never really eat all day , trouble is i do like to pig out every once in a while , like now i got a reduced indian banquet for 2 & a few drinks while it's cooking , will probably last me until tomorrow but i think it's more the drink than the food that does me , and lack of excercise i admit , but fasting does no good at all , imho!
By:
pxb
When: 09 Jul 17 00:10
Looking at a list of of coutries diabetes incidence, there does seem to be a link with wheat consumption, but not rice.

I know Egypt gets a very high proportion of calories from wheat and it also has a very high incidence of diabetes.

https://www.indexmundi.com/facts/indicators/SH.STA.DIAB.ZS/rankings
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 09 Jul 17 04:06
I really like Dr.Berg, I first saw his videos about two years ago.
I cut carbs and sugar out a year 18 months ago and kept to it for a year.
but I hit a wall. After losing two stones. It's very powerful but I felt
i'd went too far. I lost all appetite for chocolate and sweets and even now
after going back to eating everything in the last six months I'm no longer
interested in chocolate much? that want is gone. It's the carbs which I consider
the bigger enemy. I like bread and it's been adulterated by Soy/soya flour.
I've cut bread out again. (was getting rolls without soya).
Dr Berg opened my eyes to taking calcium supplements, how dangerous they were.
He advocated lemon juice/cider vinegar/coconut oil to be incorporated into your
diet. But the extreme amount of green stuff he was asking people to eat for
potassium was a bone of contention, i messaged him about Calcium oxalate Build up
and he made a video about it? First time I think a doctor ever listened to me..
Carbs damaging villi in the intestines - He's good at explaining the core problem, but like every doctor on the internet he's pushing a line of products you don't really need. a good variety of foods does the same job.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 09 Jul 17 04:22
Mr Moonbeam -
It's not really fasting? As a young man I always skipped breakfast and would work to lunchtime before I ate. It's a return to that pattern?
My younger atheist self was a smarter chap in some things.
I cannot eat the same stuff he ate anymore? Being fifty now, I cannot
eat the volume anymore. My stomach acid is getting weaker. It comes with age.
It's what causes arthritis in the aged. The loss of the ability to take calcium
out of foods anymore. Strong acid is needed. Dr.Berg explains it(ytube).
Silica is very importante! Porridge oats(raw)best source I could find.

In the seventies,  I remember the Christians(the older generation) were fasting still. but they stopped it - some people fainted and it was discouraged.
In the bible the Pharisees reprimanded Jesus and his followers about not keeping to
the fasting day - Jesus told them to £$@* off , no , he told them nobody fasts while the bridegroom is at the wedding feast. that there was a time and place for fasting.
That they would return to fasting when he was gone.
By:
Dr Crippen
When: 09 Jul 17 13:20
Thanks pxb.

There's a Dr Fung on YouTube who uses intermittent fasting to reverse diabetes in patients.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1a2Fsfa8e4I

Everybody should be interested in their blood glucose levels for them to be in a position to avoid getting Type 2 diabetes.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 09 Jul 17 13:50
is type 2 diabetes real? Isn't it just a sugar overload? As soon as you stop
eating crap - the levels return to normal.

what i mean is if i ate five mars bars an hour before they draw blood - the levels might show type two. do the same next week with no food before the test - normal?
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 11 Jul 17 10:31
lost 4 lbs in 4 days.
no exercise.
good start.
By:
Dr Crippen
When: 11 Jul 17 16:29
zorro,

The standard test for blood glucose is done after fasting.
If for instance when you book an appointment and the test is to be done in the morning. They might tell you not to eat anything after 10pm the night before.

What they're measuring is your resistance to your own insulin.
A higher than normal reading means your insulin is not doing its job in bringing down the sugar in your blood, which if you carry on with your present lifestyle will get worse.
While a high enough reading means you're already diabetic.

Stage 1 diabetes is different, that's where you don't make insulin at all and you have to inject it or die.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 11 Jul 17 16:47
avoid it all - eat foods
with chromium and vanadium.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 11 Jul 17 17:35
just simplified it - wait six hours after you wake to eat.
eat 2000 calories, low carbs. eating window 5 hours.

no need to buy a book with that?
By:
Foinavon
When: 11 Jul 17 18:01
Good luck with your diet Zorro.
Losing 4lbs in 4 days is too rapid, you will lose muscle tissue and could develop other problems.
Two pounds a week is what you should aim for.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 12 Jul 17 08:54
It'll be water? I think the maximum you can lose is two pounds of fat a week?
I heard that somewhere? Whether that's true, I don't  know. People stranded
in boats or in prisons? lose a lot. I'll have to look it up?
I'm still eating protein and veg(amino acids), so muscle loss shouldn't come into it.
they said as long as you eat 2000 calories you'll avoid going into a catabolic
state. (As it relates to bodybuilding, catabolism is the breaking down of muscle tissue).
Only when you go into starvation mode will muscle wasting occur.
By:
Foinavon
When: 12 Jul 17 10:41
Perhaps taking more exercise at the same time as dieting will help protect muscle mass too.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 12 Jul 17 14:28
i need to lose muscle mass, i used to do aerobics, step treader for a year a half hour full pelt, jogging for ten years and a labouring job. I have legs like Stallone. I only swim now.
It's the smart exercise. I wish I'd learned earlier. All this hammering yourself on concrete is nuts. My local chippy's son died in the Manchester half marathon. he was like a rake. no fat on him. I think he was about 25? i'm done with extreme exercising. my joints are telling me to stop. swimming is super good. one hour constant swimming.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 13 Jul 17 13:12
send me some chocolate through the mail.
can't eat till 5.30pm. - over 4 hours to go?
By:
Jack Hacksaw
When: 13 Jul 17 13:15
Can't eat today till after 6.00.  Haven't had anything since 7.00 last night.

Bit peckish but will have a bottle of diet bitter lemon or tonic or tonic with elderflower.

No problem.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 13 Jul 17 13:24
same boat?

had lasagne and lettuce last night. about 7 - same as you.

are we room mates? do i have a bad memory?
By:
Jack Hacksaw
When: 13 Jul 17 14:42
Same boat today, maybe.

Tomorrow I will be on a cruise ship of excess, fuelled by real ale and burgers.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 13 Jul 17 15:50
just had a pint of bitter tea with lemon juice? yuck.

have to rein back, getting too unfit. i feel like a muscle builder who
cant run because of sheer bulk. critical mass.
i wish i were one of those wirey dudes you see in old pop groups.
without taking heroin... of course.
stopping jogging was a mistake. council took away my running track to build a school.
By:
Facts
When: 13 Jul 17 17:51
Avoid sugar in foods, and anything with refined  wheat (white flour) as an ingredient. Eg white bread and majority of cereals.
By:
betting_masta
When: 13 Jul 17 19:34
I think it works but bottom line is this: in that 8 hour window or whatever if you eat cr^p its not going to help you. you have to eat healthier, salads, avocados, lean protein, cook everything yourself. eliminate wheat and sugar from your diet as much as you can.
By:
betting_masta
When: 13 Jul 17 19:35
find some "healthy" food that you actually enjoy. try out new stuff. you might be a big nut fan but you've never eaten nuts ;) (not you vicar)  nuts are very satiating and full of minerals. they are high in fat but people who eat nuts actually lose weight because they stop you eating sugars and the like. eat natural foods and you'll lose weight because the body wants to be lean and fit and healthy but you have to give it the right fuel to do so otherwise it will be fat & lazy.
By:
betting_masta
When: 13 Jul 17 19:38
zorro - i totally agree with you on marathon running. it kills the body. you're better off having a bit of muscle but you still need some cardio but those long distance runners are not healthy.
also agree road running is terrible for your joints. better to run through woods or on grass.
again find something that works for you. don't look outwards but look within for the answers.

when david blaine fasted for 45 days in that cube above the thames he lost 1lb per day and that was from eating nothing, but also no exercise , barely any movement.  i wouldn't advise extreme weight loss unless you are 30 stone but rather taper it back, make a few adjustments, once you see some improvement you'll be more motivated to keep going, but it all begins and ends with diet .  diet is 80%, exercise is 20%.
By:
betting_masta
When: 13 Jul 17 19:42
there are a few famous examples of people who claim and i say claim they only eat once per day. herschell walker is a former NFL player who says he only eats once a day or at least he used to and all he would eat was soup and i think a salad and maybe a small bit of meat. there was also a famous bodybuilder serge nubret who would eat once in the evening, a massive plate of rice and some horse meat.  so it can be done, this IF, intermittent fasting, or even just the 1-meal-a-day, but you've got to find what works for you and your lifestyle.
By:
Jack Hacksaw
When: 13 Jul 17 19:45
tesco weight watchers fish pie, loads of frozen beans and 2 x little microwave bags of mixed veg.

job done

roll on the weekend
By:
ufcdan
When: 13 Jul 17 20:08
Sweet potatoe and spinach curry for me tonight..........fat free Love
By:
Dr Crippen
When: 13 Jul 17 21:10
Why fat free ugdan?

I don't want to spoil your curry but if you're eating it on plate of rice that's a problem.
Also note the sugar content of the curry. 
You should be increasing healthy fat in your diet and eliminating sugar, while drastically reducing carbohydrates.
That's the way to lose weight for anyone who is interested.
By:
pablo-fanque
When: 13 Jul 17 23:40
to lose weight, you need to create a calorie deficit , either through exercise, eating less, or both .

aim for 1-2 pound a week loss

if you don't lift weights ( bodybuilding )  on a diet you will lose weight but you will also lose muscle .

low carb
low fat
intermittent fasting

they just create a calorie deficits in different ways

good luck

http://edition.cnn.com/2010/HEALTH/11/08/twinkie.diet.professor/index.html
By:
G Hall
When: 14 Jul 17 09:46
Well gents I have hit the big 50 not overweight but starting to develop a belly any suggestions on how to lose it.
By:
ufcdan
When: 14 Jul 17 12:31
Dr C part of the Slimming World program is free foods and speed foods. Free foods are pasta, spuds, pulses low fat meat eggs to name a few. The speed foods are basically most vegetables which you must have a third of your plate filled with this. I had a bit of a fall out with them over the carbs. If you tell a fat g1t like me I can eat all I want, I tend to take you at your word so ploughed into the pasta. Only after hearing that pasta turns to sugar on 5live radio did I stop as I was diagnosed pre diabetic. Knocked that on the head and blood sugars came down. Whether it's right on wrong weighed in this morning 2.5lb lighter. Lost a total of 3st 4lb. Plenty still to go Sad
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 14 Jul 17 21:37
i heard Fred Astaire ate one big meal a day?

lost 6 lbs this week, won't be fat though. okay for first week.
i once lost 11 lb in a week about ten years ago? diet and exercise?

no exercise this week.
you are basically eating in a four hour window 2000 calories.
you feel stuffed and borderline bloated. Famine and feast.
you get to a point you don't want to eat.
saving money on food bills.
By:
zorrostrikes
When: 19 Jul 17 16:47
enjoying the fast -

ten days in. Kept to it so far. had a weekend where I ate bread, which was naughty?
But kept to the four hour window of eating.
Yesterday I thought about not eating at all? but That's just nuts.
feel a lot better - my stomach is settled. I was getting pains, but it's went away.

Lasagna and lettuce makes a nice meal. Cheap too. add some mayo to the lettuce, with pepper.
it's meaty, creamy... under 800 calories.

The next level would be to avoid all carbs and sugars. But I think I'll just continue
with this level for a month. I think it's working.

the hard part is the countdown? If you wake at eight, you don't eat till 2pm. (six hours away) so you wait for the alarm bell at two to grab some food. Stop at six. eat 2000 calories. At least it's regimented. it's all decided in advance. With grazing and eating food all the time you scramble for more and more food. It gets out of hand. the structure this supplies is very good.
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