Ironically, I can agree with donny,my knowledge of Islam is enough to support that comment, I have lived alongside many decent muslims who would be appalled at that treatment but the hardliners from the desert and backward areas are winning the hearts and minds battle for religious application,rather like the Rfeormation in our country in 16th century when the catholic leadership would burn people at the stake for heresy. Protestants then retaliated and,surprise,surpise we had a civil war. My point now is that we should not allow weakness and a need to be sympathetic and inclusive to allow us to get to that stage.All we need is firm but fair government and application of British law (secular) above religious law.

i dont see any irony in you seeing my point of view against a trio of bigots

the council of lawyers in this country tried to get aspects of sharia law established in english law until it was uncovered

they will chip away continually  until they get hegemony

accept it and convert

For heaven's sake, get off your high horse and relax bonny lad.Ironically, of course !

I think treetop is wrong to compare the civil war in 16c England to problems that the world faces today. In 16c England the people were English and believed in the same things and in the same culture and the same religion. That is very important, and it is more important than people may realise that the people were English. You see it is no accident that England became the greatest of all countries.

sometimes it is hard to find this stuff but this was relatively easy

have you ever looked up how many have written for the guardian

it is hundreds and hundreds 


Journalism and Media

    Aaqil Ahmed – Commissioning editor for Religion and Multicultural programming at Channel 4[21]
    Adil Ray – British radio and television presenter, for BBC Asian Network[22]
    Adnan Nawaz – A News and Sports presenter working for the BBC World Service[23]
    Ali Abbasi – Former Scottish TV presenter[24]
    Anila Baig – A columnist at The Sun[25]
    Mazher Mahmood[26]
    Mehdi Hasan – Senior politics editor at the New Statesman and a former news and current affairs editor at Channel 4[27]
    Mishal Husain – Currently an anchor for BBC World[28]
    Riz Lateef – A news reader and the BBC Deputy News Manager[29]
    Saira Khan – Was the runner-up on the first series of The Apprentice, and now a TV presenter on BBC's Temper Your Temper and Desi DNA[30]
    Sarfraz Manzoor – A British writer, journalist, documentary maker, and broadcaster. He writes regularly for The Guardian, presents documentaries on BBC Radio 4.[31]
    Shaf Rasul – A British Pakistani millionaire who is also a business column writer for The Scottish Sun newspaper[32]
    Shereen Nanjiani – A radio journalist with BBC Radio Scotland[33]
    Tazeen Ahmad – A British television and radio presenter and reporter[34]
    Waheed Khan – Documentary television director working in British television[35]
    Ajmal Masroor – Television presenter, politician, Imam,[36] and UK Parliamentary candidate for Bethnal Green and Bow constituency representing Liberal Democrats in 2010 General Election.[37] He is a television presenter on political and Islamic programmes on Islam Channel and Channel S.[38]
    Kanak 'Konnie' Huq – Television presenter, best known for being the longest-serving female Blue Peter presenter.[39][40]
    Lisa Aziz – News presenter, and journalist. Best known as the co-presenter of the Bristol-based ITV West Country nightly weekday news programme The West Country Tonight,[41] one of the first Asian presenters to be seen on television.[42] She won the Ethnic Multicultural Media Academy Best Television News Journalist Award.[43][44]
    Nina Hossain – Journalist, newscaster, and sole presenter of ITV London's regional news programme London Tonight.[45]
    Rizwan Hussain – Barrister, television presenter, philanthropist, international humanitarian worker, former Hindi music singer and producer. TV presenter for Islamic and charity shows on Channel S and Islam Channel.[46]
    Tasmin Lucia-Khan – Journalist, presenter, and producer.[47] Best known for delivering BBC Three's nightly hourly 'World News' bulletins on in 60 Seconds,[48] and presenting E24 on the rolling news channel BBC News.[49] Currently delivers news bulletins and breaking stories on ITV breakfast television programme Daybreak.[50]
    A. N. M. Serajur Rahman – Journalist, broadcaster, and Bangladeshi nationalist.[51]
    Faisal Islam – Economics editor and correspondent for Channel 4 News. He was named Young Journalist of the Year at the Royal Society of Television awards 2006.[52]
    Fareena Alam – Editor of British Muslim Magazine Q News.[53] She was named Media Professional of the Year by Islamic Relief in 2005 and at the Asian Women of Achievement Awards in 2006.[54]
    Nurul Islam – Broadcast journalist, radio producer, and presenter best remembered for his work with the BBC World Service.[55]
    Shamim Chowdhury – Television and print journalist for Al Jazeera English.[56]
    Kristiane Backer – a German television presenter, television journalist and author residing in London.[57]
    Tausif Malik – an Indian American Media personality, publisher, editor, creator of Muslim Spelling Bee Competitions, Muslim Hall of Fame, Shadi Made Easy, American Muslim TV, Global Muslim Observer, residing in Chicago. He has transformed community events into a Social Enterprise [58]
    Zeinab Badawi – BBC presenter of "Hard Talk"
    Shaman Butt – Producer/Correspondent Presstv, India
    Fareed Zakaria – Indian American journalist and author, host of CNN's Fareed Zakaria GPS

too many votes in it

I did a search a - z   you would not believe - hundreds - I gave up at mid alphabet

Under Islamic law, rape can only be proven if the rapist confesses or if there are four male witnesses.  Women who allege rape without the benefit of the act having been witnessed by four men (who presumably develop a conscience afterwards) are actually confessing to having sex.  If they or the accused happens to be married, then it is considered to be adultery.



Quran (2:282) - Establishes that a woman's testimony is worth only half that of a man's in court (there is no "he said/she said" gridlock in Islam).
Quran (24:4) - "And those who accuse free women then do not bring four witnesses (to adultery), flog them..."  Strictly speaking, this verse addresses adultery (revealed at the very time that Muhammad's favorite wife was being accused of adultery on the basis of only three witnesses coincidentally enough).  However it is a part of the theological underpinning of the Sharia rule on rape, since if there are not four male witnesses, the rape "did not occur".
Quran (24:13) - "Why did they not bring four witnesses of it? But as they have not brought witnesses they are liars before Allah."
Quran (2:223) - "Your wives are as a tilth unto you; so approach your tilth when or how ye will..."  There is no such thing as rape in marriage, as a man is permitted unrestricted sexual access to his wives.

Unless 4 witness come forward she is knackered.

maleuk01.
Under Islamic law, rape can only be proven if the rapist confesses or if there are four male witnesses.  Women who allege rape without the benefit of the act having been witnessed by four men (who presumably develop a conscience afterwards) are actually confessing to having sex.  If they or the accused happens to be married, then it is considered to be adultery

The basis for that law is in their bible. Incredible that we allow followers of this evil cult into this country.

My friends tell me it is common knowledge among muslim world not to get involved with arab police. People should really do their homework when travelling to other countries. They treat muslims like ****(look at their nationality laws and working conditions for people from specific muslim countries) and you expect them to help you being a non-muslim woman! At least she has seen first hand why the refugees don't head to those countries.

Anyhow, She has got a hard task at hand. Proving rape is going to be difficult. If there is video evidence, then the men are fecked too as extra marital sex is illegal(but I see the men have already fled to the UK, so they are safe). She should consider herself lucky that she holds a british passport. Otherwise she'd be serving the men in their jails for the rest of her life without anyone knowing. I can see NGOs and charities working for her but the arabs don't give two fecks about that crap.

65 percent of 'moderate' muslims support the idea of sharia law in this country

This is a nonsense btw and a typical soundbite that underpins much of the uninformed bigotry that prevails.

Simply because Sharia law is hard to define.  There is a world of difference between the Saudi style extreme interpretation and application and the more common sense code for living a life that most survey respondents would have in mind.

gopgle interpretations and application of Sharia Law

Too dangerous to contemplate such a thing in England.

if it differs from English law in any way it is not acceptable, if it doesn't differ there is no need for it.

Let me try to re-explain it for you.

The point is what survey respondents (UK moderate Muslims) have in mind when they respond to a question about Sharia Law (a common sense code for living, fairly harmlesss).....and alternatively .....the image that is prevalent in the West and related to a Saudi  style hardcore interpretation and application...are  worlds apart..

So..."Sharia Law" can mean very many different things to different people.  the term 'Sharia Law' needs to be elaborated upon and defined...in order for the results of the survey to have any substance.

So Sharia law does NOT require 4 witnesses then Ozy?

BBC Radio (2015): 45% of British Muslims agree that clerics preaching violence against the West represent "mainstream Islam".
http://www.comres.co.uk/polls/bbc-radio-4-today-muslim-poll/

So like this split, nearly half of Muslims in the UK agree  that mainstream Islam is violence against the west and the other half disagree?

We (or at least I) am discusing what the term "Sharia Law" means to survey respondents in the UK.