If we left the EU they’d do f all in reality because we’re too much of an important market for Germany (leaders of the fourth Reich) and their cars. Therefore there’s no way they’d hit us with any restrictions or tariffs because we could just as easy reciprocate.

You’re right I am probably a bit detached these days but I did my time in the bottom 10% , I just didn’t stay there.

New Labours immigration policy was suicide for this country

It was far worse for the lowest paid, the sector that Labour is supposedly trying to represent. Why on earth the unions never spoke out against mass immigration is beyond me,it destroyed all the lower paid bargaining positions. Never mind,between now and next May, we will hear a succession of free lunches from each of the main parties all offering us strawberries and cream to buy votes.

Glad some people realise the damage that the labour party did with the get in free card, stitched up every low paid uk worker.

destroyed a generation, probably the biggest mistake ever made by an elected government.

There's so much naivety on this thread.

Like there was no immigration before New Labour started it!
Or the average wage is what we're all earning.

Ivor, pawras.
Not everyone can earn enough to be in the higher paid bracket. It isn't a sign of excellence to have or to earn more than someone else. quite often it is luck.

There are MILLIONS of low paid people.

This thread exposes the shiit attitude of those who look down on such people merely because they earn more money.
The same ones who blame 'New Labour' for everything bad that ever happens and who think that by being 'Right wing' they're somehow better than those who aren't.

The division in wealth in this country is nearly all due to a few people (and corporations) making and keeping most of the money whilst at the same time keeping the majority, who most need it and would spend it, from having any.

How about making the minimum wage £10 or more an hour? Think about it. The money would all be spent instead of locked into bank accounts and other wealthy assets. More circulation of money would help more businesses, VAT and other taxes could be reduced and because of the upturn in spending companies would have more money to afford the increased wage bill. People wouldn't need to do more than 1 job, freeing up some of the jobs for those who need one.

The only ones who really moan about the possibility of giving the less well-off the chance to be slightly better off are those who have plenty themselves.
Or the CBI, which represents the interests of the richest companies.

There is nothing wrong with making it a little fairer for everyone. Unless it's some sort of jealousy thing.

I seriously cannot understand why the same people appear on so many threads on so many topics and trot out the "It's Labour's fault" maxim.

btw, I am not a Labour member, I have never even voted for them. But, this never blaming the Tories for anything shows blinkered ignorance.

It's fortunate for all us clever dicks that the discussion is academic as we all (pretend ?) to make more from our betting every week than poor sods earning just the minimum wage.

Whilst some posters think Milliband unelectable (and I agree) that's not to say he wont be....and if he is God save this country from him,Balls,Harman and Mrs Balls (Cooper).

Labour this .. Labour that .. Blah Blah Blah !!!

anybody would think the kn0bs were actually in power

Oh, The "All low paid jobs" was a typo. I didn't realise.
And it's 'There', not 'Their'. The population increase (which I'm not for a second supporting) was not "All overseas cheap labour".
If you think less immigration would mean less need for a minimum wage which is enough to live on, then you are both confused and wrong.

For anyone prepared to read and consider what I wrote. It makes perfect sense - you don't have to agree with it, but it makes sense.

McMoonbeam. The UK existed before 1997.
Most of our problems emanate from the period before this. Not that all the entrenched unchanging views so prevalent on here will admit it.

I have no idea what a 'Leftie' wage is.
For some reason - many people on here use the word 'Leftie' as some sort of insult or derogatory term. A continuation of this "I'm a Tory so I'm better than you" attitude.

This country was fecked by the ****s who were in from 1979.

The ones who closed everything, cut everything, privatised what was left, bribed people who they knew would know no better with shares (the value of which was more than offset by the increase in everyone's bills), sold unsellable, often worthless properties to people who would still be stuck in them forever - whilst stopping councils from building any more. The ones who slaughtered the NHS, who gave fortunes to advertisers and bankers and the list could go on and on, not that you'll believe it.

You don't realise the IRREPARABLE, lasting damage Thatcher did and ruined the present for us and the future for our kids etc...
Blair (ex young-conservative and public school pupil) and his entourage, just continued where the previous government left off, and as the career politician he was/is got out just in time to let the (pretty ineffectual) Brown take the rap for his massive errors. Now Cameron/Osborne have just continued it further.
They've ALL treated us like mugs and filled their own boots at our expense. The need for a minimum wage shouldn't even be up for debate. It is, however the subject of this thread.

We haven't had a decent government since Atlee. We probably won't get one again.

I've had enough of this now and I'm going to bed. I really couldn't care less if you or anyone else agrees or wants to argue, ibrahima.
It's a waste of time and Cameron is probably at Blair's house or yacht or something sharing a brandy and some drugs whilst having a laugh about the Plebs. Which, btw includes you and me.

it's not about raising the minimum wage ,that's a simpleton idea - it's more about the standard of living  for that person in society -

if someone is bullied into a minimum wage job , at least allow that person some other form of rebate ,maybe council tax relief etc

1st time poster    21 Sep 14 19:31 
how olds call me a taxi,
if your think your worth more go ask for it you,ll probably get it,

I'm 63.

And I got it.

That's how non-union firms work.

any mention of labour ending zero hour contracts ?

£8 an hour must seem like a great incentive for the poles to stay,
as they have been heading home in their droves, to be replaced by
romanians

johnizere    22 Sep 14 09:21 
Some really good posts on this subject, especially the last 6 or so.
cmat.. I'm 65, and, like you, I asked and I got... but it doesn't work like that these days.

It worked up to 2002, that was the last time I did it.

Agree with Injera.  The cost of housing (buying or renting) is too high and is what makes the minimum wage appear so low.  Traditionally house prices going up has been a vote winner as the baby boomer generation felt they were rich but really all they were doing was fkin up the future chances of buying for their own children.

You think Cameron is going to give you anything, dream on

Tories since Thatcher want to detach government from society, government want to make laws and collect taxes that is all,

everything else is market forces
Tthis will not help anyone near the bottom

Controlling immigration is key, while there is a housing shortage, free markets will take prices
through the roof

Even if we have to come out of EU, immigration control is that important

How on earth can we ever build enough houses for everybody if we just let more people in????

There is another problem, the fact that the rent sector is booming, means it becomes profitable
to buy to rent, which makes it even harder fro people just to buy, because this forces house prices
up, because of the competition.

You watch 'Homes under the Hammer', people buy cheap, refurbish, then rent...good money to be made

The only thing that will stop this is more houses, including council houses, we may have to suspend people
buying them.

None of this is any good if we let more and more people in.

How on earth can we ever build enough houses for everybody if we just let more people in????

So obvious. Just too many people in the UK.
I've just got back from travelling in Denmark, Sweden, Germany and France and the moment you drive off the ferry back in the UK you realise how ridiculously overcrowded we are and now have a road system which struggles to cope with the sheer volume of traffic.
The Govts answer to this as with housing is to build more roads.
And then let even more people in ............

I'm sure small variations of this conversation took place in 1914, 1814, 1714, 1614 and back.. and will again in 2114 and forwards.

I took my id in the first 2 days as was told the copier was down , a guy who had been there a few month said its never on , after that i left it behind.So i could have been anyone an they didnt give a sh1t.I honestly didnt know that illegal work was still being carried out in major brand food factories.

You would think the original workers who have been there 20 years etc would have something to say about it though s it effects their wages.

We got told as at the interview/induction thing dont talk about anything in the factory , i thought they meant recipes etc

also if you want overtime forget it

overtime kicks in after 48 hours and goes up to a whopping £6.51 per hour


How much food did you manage to nick?

The First rule of Food Factory ...