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Any nutritionist in the house? - WHEAT
Any nutritionist in the house? - WHEAT
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GOT IN, having a trifle and a slice of cheesecake.
I would like to call it a binge, but its a normal sat night. wheat free tomorrow. |
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good man
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Flowermyth
I think you're over simplifying the carbs issue, The problem tends to lie with simple carbs whch are essentially sugar based and which tend to stimulate an area of the brain to actually crave more food. Reearch is tending to show that even specific sugars are worse for you than others. There isn't anything wrong with taking in complex carbs which are broken down much more slowly and which don't result in the peaks and troughs associated with simple carbs. Porridge is a good source of complex carbohydrates. It's damn fine stuff and stiffens yer sporran as well. |
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I wouldn’t dispute the fact that simple carbs are more a problem than complex ones, talking about diets in general. I have written about craving carbohydrates and leptin response before. If it were as simple as saying (and I know you are not saying) that complex carbohydrates are fine, then there’d be much less of a problem. For my part, wheat is a problem because of the gluten but also the sugars. Most of the complex carbohydrate in wheat is rapidly absorbed into the blood stream, and only a small amount wends its lonely way through to your bum. So it does raise your blood sugar significantly. And so do other complex carb containing foods, like bananas, for instance. And so do oats, though not as much as wheat or bananas, granted, but still not insignificantly. I don’t know if they contain gluten or not (some do), I don't think it is clear. They contain a gluten-like protein, but whether that has issues, I don't know, and they can be contaminated with gluten anyway, so I see no good reason to eat them. They do make me nostalgic for cold winter mornings and school though, which is odd because I don't remember eating them!
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The big three that you really want to try and avoid or at the very least limit are gluten, dairy and sugar. As mentioned before gluten is inflammatory and should be on of the first things to avoid if you have an auto-immune disease.
Dairy is no good either, it’s mucous forming and again something you should be looking to cut out if you suffer from any kind of eczema. But if you really think about it what is dairy. It’s a growth substance. It’s specifically designed to help baby creatures grow. Not only that but it’s specifically evolved for the purposes of a different species of animal. At least with sugar it doesn’t pretend to be good for you. Of course the other side to this is that they are rather tasty, and gluten is in most beer as well. If you do want to eat this stuff, then I would say for gluten try and eat spelt instead of normal wheat. It is an ancient form of wheat and has much much less gluten in it. If you have dairy go for goat and sheep rather than cow. If you want sweet stuff then go for maple syrup, xylitol or palm sugar rather than cane sugar. The thing I really don’t get is eating packaged cereal like weetabix for breakfast. Firstly (if you are having it with normal milk) you’ve got wheat, dairy and sugar. That’s the holy trinity of cr8pness in every mouthful. Secondly have you tasted it, it’s like eating cardboard. That’s why people put sugar on it, because it tastes so bland and cardboardy. So why would you eat it, it tastes horrible AND has no nutritional benefit. If you don’t care about the nutrition of what you eat, at least go for something tasty like croissants and jam, or toast with whatever you want on it and a snickers. If you want something nutritional in the morning then you are failing badly with weetabix and the like. I don’t understand this mentality that makes people believe that breakfast must be in a bowl and contain milk. If you think eating something like an omlette and a piece of meat, or soup for breakfast just sounds weird and wrong then you’ve been brainwashed and fooled by the advertising of Mr Kellogs and co. Unfortunately trying to be healthy isn’t cheap or easy. Organic is more expensive, eating things like activated almonds rather than normal almonds is more expensive but more nutritionally beneficial. If you eat oats you need to look to make sure they are gluten free as a lot of time oats are grown as a rotational crop alongside wheat and so can contain some of the wheaty goodness. Of course again gluten free oats are more expensive. Cooking things yourself from scratch rather than buying packaged stuff is more effort. If you have the time and money to do all this, you will definitely feel the difference. Finally if you buy anything packaged look at the ingredients in it. A while back I managed to get my brother to stop eating supermarket hotdogs buy showing him that one of the ingredients was mechanically recovered meat. |
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So you don't recommend eating yoghurt's then ?
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I wouldn’t say that dairy is anywhere near as bad as gluten. We cannot naturally eat grains, this is a fact. Milk we can. I think you have it backwards, personally. It is not that milk is meant for babies (well obviously it is) but milk is all babies can naturally eat for very obvious reasons. It doesn’t follow that adults can’t consume milk it, is just that they don’t need to because they can both look for, chew and digest more complex energy-giving foods - imo.
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I don't drink milk nowadays simply because it seems unnatural - you feed an adult cow with human milk, so why do the opposite - it's just weird.
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* you wouldn't feed
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Is it weird? To me it is a bit nonsensical, assuming you're not a vegetarian. What you are saying is it is unnatural to eat milk (proteins, carbs and fats) from another species, but eating meat (proteins, carbs and fats) from that same other animal is good?
Personally I'm not completely sold on milk, I didn't drink it for years, but the alternatives are soya milk (milk-ish at its best but possibly carcinogenic), almond milk (too think and not milk enough for me) and sod-all, basically. I may well go the sod-all route in time, but there's nothing wrong with grass fed butter and cheese, imo. |
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What you are saying is it is unnatural to eat milk (proteins, carbs and fats) from another species, but eating meat (proteins, carbs and fats) from that same other animal is good?
No, I'm increasingly leaning towards vegetarianism as it happens, although I love meat, especially beef and lamb, but it seems at best unneccesary and at worst barbaric, particularly when you consider the methods used during "processing". Can't bring myself to make that leap just yet though...  |
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I've just stopped being vegetarian because we couldn't have been vegetarians for all but 10,000 of the quarter of a million years we've been around, because fruit and veg is seasonal and low in protein. Say you lived here prior to the iceage. Farming didn't exist, people were not farming and processing wheat, not to the extent that it was a main part of the diet. The country is covered in wildwood - where could you possibly get enough plants that are edible and nutritional enough to get you through the long months of winter? Meat must have been what we ate.
Having said all that, I'd like to go back to being a vegetarian eventually and also to alternate day fasting, which I gave up recently. |
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Historically milk was meant for just babies. In most species of mammal the activity of the enzyme lactase dramatically reduces after weaning. It's only in humans where it is evolving but the majority of people in the world remain lactase non-persistent and consequently are affected by lactose intolerance as adults.
Have a read of the following as an alternative viewpoint http://www.organichealthandbeauty.com/Dangers-of-Milk_ep_62-1.html There are a few alternatives to milk. Soy (steer clear of if possible) almond milk, rice milk, oat milk, coconut milk (i think you can get quinoa milk as well). I actually prefer the taste of coconut milk to normal milk. I have a family friend who is a nutrionist and she says that milk is basically rubbish and neither she nor her family drink it. |
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Secondly have you tasted it, it’s like eating cardboard. That’s why people put sugar on it, because it tastes so bland and cardboardy. So why would you eat it, it tastes horrible
No it bloody doesn't its luverly especially with full fat milk and it definately doesn't need sugar. |
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This is getting too deep.
I've already questioned the wisdom of taking stuff out of your diet without being sure that it is making you ill. but the alternatives are soya milk (milk-ish at its best but possibly carcinogenic), What's this possibly carcinogenic? I haven't heard than one before. |
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It’s all epigenetics, innit? If you’re European your chances of being lactose intolerant are in the regions of 2%.
Soy, it's controversial, soy has a large amount of phyto-oestrogens, which raised the incidence of cancer in labs rats. Yes yes, we are not lab rats, I said it was possibly carcinogenic, not that it defintely is. But I don't see why something inferior with a hint of danger about it and lacking in much history should be any more confidently consumed than cow's milk, which we've been consuming for a long time. Those other milks mentioned are full of chemicals and starchy thickeners. |
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so what have we learnt?
dont drink milk dont drink soya milk dont have sucrose dont have fructose dont eat bread and carbs. we already know eating red meat frquently is a no no eating processed meat is even worse. eggs are bad for ldl cholesterol. wtf can we eat  |
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jelly and minge
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thommo, my hero, doesnt care about carbs and sugar
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We cannot naturally eat grains, this is a fact.
Yes we can. When I was a kid I used to rub ears of wheat between my hands to separate the juicy raw grains then eat them. You can chew raw sweetcorn off the cob before it dries and many people eat raw rolled oats. I love weetabix too and eat it without sugar like Thin and Crispy although I usually prefer porridge for breakfast. Burton, you can't eat jelly as it's made from the extract of boiled bones sweetened with sugar. You know what's left, enjoy |
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And with that I'm done with this thread. Good luck to those that have given up wheat, keep us updated to how you are doing.
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If your british chances of being lactose intolerant are 5-15%
"But I don't see why something inferior with a hint of danger about it and lacking in much history should be any more confidently consumed than cow's milk, which we've been consuming for a long time. Those other milks mentioned are full of chemicals and starchy thickeners." Why is it inferior. Are you referring to taste, isn’t that subjective, after all some people find weetabix delicious. You say “lacking in much history” which is strange because you can make your own nut milk. Do you know what the ingredients are? They are water and nuts. I’m pretty sure that these have been consumed over a longer period of time than cow’s milk. You also mention a hint of danger which is interesting as you posted a link in an earlier post about a tescos cheese and you also mentioned you bought a similar version as well, which does not look organic. This invalidates your argument about having consumed it for a long time, because we have consumed pasture fed organic milk for a long time but certainly not the non-organic stuff. You mention about the chemicals and starchy thickeners. If you look at Oatly it’s ingredients are water, oats, rapeseed oil, salt vitamins (D2, riboflavin, folic acid and B12) and calcium. There are some milks out there that do use more in the way of thickeners like guar gum, but what about the chemicals in non-organic dairy products that you are buying. Firstly the cows will eat corn and other grain and soy( most of which is genetically engineered). Their feed will be contaminated with pesticides and herbicides. They may receive hormones including pituitary, steroid, hypothalamic and thyroid, to increase milk production and may also be fed antibiotics. Also 2/3 of all milk (organic and non-organic) comes from pregnant cows when the hormone content of oestrogen and progesterone are very high. Don’t forget that all cows release toxins through their milk as it is a natural exit for substances the body doesn’t use. I shall leave you with this. Jeffrey Holly (Professor of Clinical Sciences at the University of Bristol) states that his studies and those of others have consistently found that, of all the components of human diet, milk and dairy products have the greatest effects on IGF-1 levels. |
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so brits are either 2% or 5-15% to be affected by lactose?
was reading that the med countries are the most likely in europe. 33% of the world population are 33% affected in some way by fructose. any figures on wheat? |
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As a result of browsing this thread last week I got myself a copy of Novak Djokovic's book and went Gluten free from yesterday. I am going to give it a go for a fortnight and see if I notice a difference.
I am slightly overweight (11.5 stone at 5 foot 8). I was always slim/skinny until maybe 3-4 years ago, in which time I have put on about 3-4 stone, so I am looking to lose a few pounds, but my main motivation for giving it a go is a general lack of energy which I've had for a good few years now (effectively since piling on the weight). One thing pointed out in Djoko's book that I found interesting was the idea of having the majority your carbs during the day (up to lunchtime-ish) when you actually need/want the energy, and then eat foods high in protein in the evening; I am trying to follow this advice too. |
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any figures on wheat?
Who compiles these figures and how? They're only guesses. |
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the idea of having the majority your carbs during the day (up to lunchtime-ish)
So that's where I've been going wrong, I should be drinking beer in the morning. |
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Novak Djokovic is simply food combining.
There's nothing new about eating carbs for one meal and proteins for another, it stops indigestion happening for one thing. Not a lot of people know that. |
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The obsession with cereal for breakfast is a hard one to get over, the big food companies have been heavily marketing that for generations. But if you research the main claims on their health benefits, it comes down to fiber. But fiber has zero nutritional value and won't help you lose weight. I'm not saying you don't need fiber because you do, but don't get it from cereal/wheat etc, get it from vegetables.
BTW Ted Brogan just hit the nail on the head, it's not just what you eat, it's when you eat. If you limit your carbs to daytime, you will find it much easier to lose weight. Ditch those big evening meals - we can't burn fat when we're sleeping. |
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How are you getting on Ted? Any benefits so far?
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One week in and I've dropped 5lb.
I should point out that as well as going gluten free, I have limited my daily calorie intake to 2000, as well as avoided the heavy carbs (rice, pasta, spuds) with my evening meal. I have also started exercising (walking/jogging a few miles a day) so it would be wrong to put it all down to the gluten-free option. I can't say I feel too much different. I don't, for example feel ready to leap out of bed ready for the day ahead of me in the morning, nor do I feel that a 'mind-fog' has lifted (Two things Djoko claims he was feeling within a few days). I haven't felt bloated or as if I've over-eaten after I've eaten my meals though, but as I wasn't previously monitoring my ingredients or portion sizes, again I can't say that's just down to no gluten. However, I have noticed one fairly significant change; by having a gluten-free, protein-heavy evening meal, I have not found myself having the carb-crash which used to cause me to be hungry again around 9/10pm, so I have effectively stopped my evening snacking/grazing which was always a bad habit I had. I will be continuing for another week before trying some gluten (as suggested by Novak), so will see if that has a significant effect. |
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I can tell you straight away that Novak Djokovic has never suffered from food intolerances.
You don't achieve the fitness levels of an athlete if you are burdened with food intolerances. Or feel better two days after eliminating stuff from your diet. Nevertheless he claims that his magic diet has put an extra edge on his performances. More likely the book was written to put an extra edge on his bank account. There are far more books about written by doctors who know about food intolerances and the best way to identify them. Which is the only thing you really need to know. |
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Two massive differences in the last 50 years: out-of-season food via imports; and widespread adoption of cars and office work.
We are the first generation to be able to stick rigidly to a few types of food, regardless of time of year or weather. Let's look at grains, as wheat is the subject of this thread. Wheat requires hot, dry summers to grow. In the past if the summer was lousy, your flour came from rye, barley or oats, which thrive in cool, wet conditions (hence the traditional popularity of porridge oats in Scotland). If your wheat failed, you might plant buckwheat as a fast-growing catch crop to ensure you have something to harvest (despite its name buckwheat is a grass rather than a cereal, so nutritionally different). Now, however, you simply import wheat after a poor summer and your diet is unvarying. Bodies adapted by millennia of evolution to thrive on a bit of everything, are suddenly restricted to a tiny number of unvarying foodstuffs. The point I'm trying to make is that very, very few of the food items on which people try to lay the sole blame for feeling lousy or looking tubby are inherently bad unless consumed in isolation. They're almost all valuable parts of a healthy, VARIED diet, where they have the opportunity to combine and react and make use of each other's properties within our bodies. It's the VARIED part which has suddenly gone missing. A bit of everything is the answer imo. Mind you, if you also happen to be a motorist and/or an office "worker", then worrying about your intake of wheat or milk is surely ducking the issue. |
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cut out milk and lowered fructose quite a bit and upped wholemeal bread.
dropped 15kg in 5 months. |
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Interesting article about big food and sugar, as mentioned previously on this thread:
http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2014/aug/24/robert-lustig-sugar-poison?CMP=EMCNEWEML6619I2 |
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so had the fructose test this morning and failed it.
well done you silly american c***s for silently adding fructose to near enough everything....... |
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carbs are best avoided unless you intend burning them off - apparently they turn to fat if not used - maybe that's how spuds got a bad name
maybe the best idea is not to eat too much late at night |
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yes the the sugars that carbs are made up of are turned into and stored as fat if you don't burn off the calories fairly quickly, called lipogenesis process
The only carbs you should avoid refined carbs not complex ones |
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The only carbs you should avoid refined carbs not complex ones
can you give examples of each? |
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refined = pizza's, pies, pasta, bread
complex = fruit and veg, kidney beans, some yougurts |
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apparently they turn to fat if not used
sugar does too..... |