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Cheltenham Festival

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These 143 comments are related to the topic:
toms champion hurdle pick!

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Replies: 143
By:
Stotsfold
When: 10 Jan 12 22:06
Picking holes/negatives in any 25/1 shot is easy. Segal isn't saying "this will win" ; he's saying it has more like a ~6% chance than a ~4% chance - and personally I'd agree. But he'd be well aware that there is still a 94% chance of being wrong, and then all the snipers can say "terrible selection" etc. But that's what 'value' punting is about. And at the end of the day Segal-types will do a lot better long-term that the "Hurricane Fly, Big Bucks, Sprinter Sacre - BANKERS"-types.
By:
GI MAC
When: 10 Jan 12 22:07
Cheers barnsey, he got the trainer bit right.
By:
barnesy
When: 10 Jan 12 22:09
Stotsfold, maybe he such advise in his column the minimum price to be taken also then. He is 16/1 best now and I imagine still being bet off the back of the tip
By:
Masterminded
When: 10 Jan 12 22:32
A horse that has never won over 2 miles is very unlikely to break his duck in the Champion Hurdle. Can someone give me an example? He is a 33's shot and ppl are going in at 16's. Up to them but just my opinion.
By:
FOYLESWAR
When: 10 Jan 12 22:33
from racing post pricewise today ........if hurricane fly gets to the race he probably wins ,but at 25s oscars well is no forlorn hope to give the fav a run for his money .
jessie harringtons 7 yold looks a 2 miler through and through and i dont think hes had a race run to suit him yet .
at last years festival he tanked along in the neptune and was still a length in front when smashing through the last hurdle and losing all chance .he probably wuld not have won that day but he had expended so much energy through the race that it is clear he needs a fast run 2 miles .
look at the record of neptune runners in the champion istabraq and hardy eustace won both and peddlers cross nearly won both , and those with longer memories will recall that french holly being placed in a champion having won the 2.5 mile contest the previous season . basically the race appears to be a much better trial than the supreme for the following years champion -and oscars well looked the best horses in the neptune .
he is a big price because has stuggled over 2 miles this season but he ran a blinder at leopardstown over christmass ,again tanking into a clear lead turning for home before tireing after the last . that was clear eviedence he has the pace for 2 miles and a strongly run race at cheltenham in march on better ground could easily bring about masses of improvement .
oscars well jumps quickly and his trainer has a very good record aty the festival ,so i expect him to be a real factor in the champion .beating hurricane fly will be tough but at 25/1 each way or 20s with ladds nrnb seems a decent bet .
henderson holds a strong hand but the fact he isnt aiming oscar whiskey at the race suggests he feels he has a big chance of beating hurricane fly with 1 of his 3 . of the 3 spirit son is the most interesting but he was beaten in the supreme last year and he is priced up on reputation rather than form ,and last years triumph winner zarkandar has more solid credentials . the form of the triumph could have not worked out better and nicholls has said he wants to win the race most and has been training zarkandar for the one prize all season he could be a major player but he has had a few niggling problems this season and with his form working out well thre is not much juice in his price .
By:
Howdi
When: 10 Jan 12 23:21
Wait til The Fly mullers him in the irish champion then take the 50s Tom Laugh
By:
Steamship
When: 11 Jan 12 12:40
Mullins interview on ATR pointing Thousand Stars to the Champion although stating the Aintree race will be the one that suits him. I have taken 38 on here, hoping Hurricane does not make the race.
By:
Howdi
When: 11 Jan 12 13:03
id rather do my conkers than wish HF didnt turn up
By:
strontium
When: 11 Jan 12 13:31
It's a huge price if HF doesn't show though, and for fear of reigniting a discussion I've had before, there's a fair chance Ruby would take the ride.
By:
sintonian
When: 11 Jan 12 13:37
Couldn't have TS at all tbh. 26 hurdle runs and 6 wins. Surely something will improve past him ?
By:
shockster
When: 11 Jan 12 13:40
I think TS will finish in front of Oscars Well if he turns up.
By:
Howdi
When: 11 Jan 12 13:59
^^^ i'm bloddy certain he will
By:
Howdi
When: 11 Jan 12 14:00
well gentlemen irish champion hurdle day will reveal all.
By:
Can't Catch Me
When: 11 Jan 12 14:22
I cant have the fact he hasnt won over 2m is a negative. He never even ran over 2m last season, so nobody can argue the trip didnt suit him. The Deloitte is only 2m2f and he p1ssed it.

He just hasnt been right this season. It has nothing do with the fact he's been runing over 2m. Had he run in three 2m4f races this season he wouldnt have won any of them either. I think its a bizarre point tbh.
By:
shockster
When: 11 Jan 12 15:22
CCM it's hardly a positive that he hasn't yet won over 2m is it? When he won over 2m2f it was heavy yet we are lead to believe he wants good, bit hard to swallow if you ask me.  More chance taking on Big Bucks if you ask me.
By:
Can't Catch Me
When: 11 Jan 12 15:26
Shockster. Agree, its clearly not a positive! I just dont think its a negative. The way races are run in Ireland means thaat even some of the 2 1/2 mile races on heavy ground arent as much of a stamina test as a CH.

I havent seen anything to suggest he would get 3m tbh.

To clarify, I dont fancy the horse in the CH at all, but I do think it will bring out the best in him. He proved he handled the track and ground in the Neptune. I cant see how anyone who watched that race doesnt think he will like the ground?
By:
shockster
When: 11 Jan 12 15:30
I am not saying he won't like the ground, however I don't believe the slower ground in Ireland he has encountered this season is the reason for his defeats, as he has previously proved he acts on it.
By:
Can't Catch Me
When: 11 Jan 12 15:37
I dont either. I think the reason he has been beaten is that he hasnt been right. If he gets to the race 100% he'll run a big race. But that is obvioualy a big if.

I was also going to add that he showed more speed than Rock on Ruby in the neptune imo. More speed than probably any other horse in the race. he tanked along all the way around and wanted to go faster if anything. And probably didnt get home. Even if he had jumped the last, I think ROR may well have outstatyed him.
By:
rogerthebutler
When: 11 Jan 12 15:47
I disagree 100% CCM and his breeding shows more stamina than speed influence

.....but there we go!

Happy
By:
buddeliea
When: 11 Jan 12 16:15
oh he wanted to go faster alright,just watch him during the race,jockey had a bit of a fight with him at times.
He aint short of speed and he does stay further than 2m,not a bad cocktail for a Churdle.
He may not win the race,but it wont be the distance or good/soft ground that will be the reason,other horses simply being better on the day will be.
I aint got a problem with taking 20,s on the chance that he will be in the right form in March,if he is its a good price imo.
By:
Can't Catch Me
When: 11 Jan 12 16:18
Disagree with which bit rog?!
By:
rogerthebutler
When: 11 Jan 12 16:34
Mo Farrah 'travels easily' in the 5k - no one suggests he should go back to the 800m.

The horses breeding is more stamina oriented than speed, and wasn't (IMO) stopping at the end of the Neptune (last hurdle error notwithstanding.

The question for connections still should be: do we have a crack at Big Bucks in the World Hurdle and get place money and maybe, if Big Bucks has an off day, get the win or stick with the plan, go for the Champion despite (IMO) there being 4 or 5 (at least) more legitimate candidates to finish ahead of OW, who he keeps failing to beat over 2 miles, a distance, dress it up how you like, he has never won at.

But there we go, opinions are like rsoles etc and, for trading purposes, I have backed him for the CH, when it became obvious he was going to be the Pricewise pick - so the damned beast is doing my head in every which way at present!

:)
By:
Can't Catch Me
When: 11 Jan 12 16:42
Grin

Fair enough. As you say, each to their own. I dont really have a strong feeling on whether or not he would stay 3m. And whilst I agree the World Hurdle is a softer option, purely based on which race wil be run to suit OW best, I think the CH is the right pick.

But agree he has very little chnace of getting placed. So in that sense, I can see whay anyone would say its the not the right choice! Still cant forgive him for last year, costs me a small fortune Sad
By:
rogerthebutler
When: 11 Jan 12 17:18
Me too!

That's probably why I'm so fixated about getting at least somethin back from this beast!

Grin
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