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Any umpire worth their salt should boycott any match Williams is playing in. I would hope if this had happened at Wimbledon the LTA would have given her a life ban from the tournament. Making this a sexist thing is low even for her, you do not belittle an umpire this way and to prolong it in a press conference afterwards is unforgivable, because of who she is she will get away with it, not so if it was a minor player. She said I have a daughter! so what? What an example to set her in the future. The woman has lost the plot. She should be made to make a profuse apology and stop making up agendas to defend her awful behaviour.
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Ten minutes of farce. Only the guy who said the umpire got nothing wrong made a reasonable question. Why are they so scared? Perhaps someone should have read out the definition of 'gracious' because it as far removed from Williams as you could get.
She was the sole reason last night played out as it did. Not the umpire, not the crowd, she was totally responsible. |
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Ramos umpire association should be vocal and back him to the hilt, and sue her sorry @rse, what she said was libellous.
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Serena shud have told him to suck her dick ...
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are you saying she was more of a man than Ramos ![]() |
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The debate seems to be moving pretty quickly into 'are women and men treated differently' today. Mouratoglou's actual point was that both he and Sascha were coaching extensively but that the rule is wrong, Billie Jean king has also contended the rule is wrong and has weighed in on Serena's side.
'When a woman is emotional, she’s “hysterical” and she’s penalized for it. When a man does the same, he’s “outspoken” & and there are no repercussions. Thank you, @serenawilliams, for calling out this double standard. More voices are needed to do the same.' Billie Jean King on twitter 9-9-18 |
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Osaka should have sounded Williams out for upstaging her victory, Williams is not adverse to a bit of gamesmanship, very hypocritical of her.
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Journeyman... Sisters doing it for themselves eh!
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I would imagine if BJK had been playing, Ramos would have been homophobic, absolutely ridiculous politicising a tennis match.
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Plenty of women have said worse to umpires than Serena and not been penalised.
Anyone defending her is missing a number of points. She has massive previous of unloading on officials when she's struggling in big matches. Stosur and Clijsters being the two obvious examples. So umpires are particularly strict with her, as they should be. Secondly she was on 2 code violations already. Thirdly the hectoring of Ramos went on for three different breaks. She called him a thief, a liar and implied he was misogynist. He, on the other hand, was just doing his job. And like the previous encounters of bad behaviour, Serena has not and will not apologise, playing every victim card under the sun to pretend that she did nothing wrong. |
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What is particulary galling is none of the Tennis associations will stand up to her, she should not escape unpunished for this. She continued the tirade at the press conference, this goes beyond her code violations.
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Yes the cards already lined up Race, Sexism, no doubt she will say because she had a baby there will be a card for that too.
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and lets not forget this little outburst..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YRcP92f7K2Q ![]() ![]() |
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Race, Sexism, no doubt she will say because she had a baby there will be a card for that too.
Oh she used that one too. Arguing that because she's a mother she wouldn't cheat. "I have never cheated in my life. I have a daughter! You owe me an apology. You owe me an apology.” yep. squeeze out some crotch-spawn and your character becomes unquestionable. |
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The deluge of SJWs rushing to defend her are going after Johnny Mac in their what-aboutery hysteria
Don't you need a time machine to play that old card ? ![]() |
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If he was just doing his job he should have warned her about being penalised a game for verbal abuse before doing so?
The only warning she got was for the coaching. |
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is that so? I don't think he has to do that does he? I see nothing in the Grand Slam rulebook that suggests he has to follow this.
P. VERBAL ABUSE Players shall not at any time directly or indirectly verbally abuse any official, opponent, sponsor, spectator or other person within the precincts of the tournament site. Violation of this section shall subject a player to a fine up to $20,000 for each violation. In addition, if such violation occurs during a match (including the warmup), the player shall be penalised in accordance with the Point Penalty Schedule hereinafter set forth. In circumstances that are flagrant and particularly injurious to the success of a tournament, or are singularly egregious, a single violation of this 46 Section shall also constitute the Major Offence of “Aggravated Behaviour” and shall be subject to the additional penalties hereinafter set forth. For the purposes of this Rule, verbal abuse is defined as a statement about an official, opponent, sponsor, spectator or other person that implies dishonesty or is derogatory, insulting or otherwise abusive. |
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Journeyman. once a warning for any offense has been issued the next offense is a point, the next a game and finally default.
The Umpire cannot give another warning. She knows the rules . In my opinion the umpire waited far longer to penalise her than he should have. He gave her more than enough time to simmer down. |
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What about the racket abuse, that was two code violations before the thief quote.
Platini i thought at first SJW was something to do with Jehova's Witnesses, which ironically she is until i saw it was Social Justice Warrior ![]() ![]() |
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DStyle, so that's at least a $20k fine then, funny they haven't enforced that, special treatment ...again.
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and the other interesting point about that rule is that there is some scope for the umpire to decide what he personally finds "derogatory, insulting or otherwise abusive".
to call him a liar and a thief can only be interpreted as implying that he is dishonest |
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the apologists are making a big deal about women not being allowed to behave the same way as men (i.e badly) on court.
But women don't. They just don't. I can only think of one that does, and has done many, many times - Serena Williams. ![]() |
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DStyle I assume you agree that his decision to penalise her a game for verbal abuse was a massive one, with the obvious potential to strike a deathblow to what was the headline match of a flagship tournament.
I'm not sure it's at all reasonable to expect her to believe that this was likely to happen based on precedent, in fact I'm struggling to find a precedent to it at that level? Granted the rule you're referring to could be used to justify what he did but surely an element of common sense kicks in there. A simple clarification to Williams that this action was on the cards would have been the common sense approach here, and could have headed off a lot of the fallout at the pass. If Layhani can get down with Nick and give him a full on-the-couch head shrinking session then the umpire of a slam final can at least simply tell a player in a hightened emotional state what he is considering. |
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I beleive she will have just argues on and on which would have resulted in here defaulting the match.... apply what you have said and the poor guy was on a hiding to nothing whatever he did or said.
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She is like a petulant child, pushing the buttons to see how she can take it , then acting the victim when there is a reaction back.
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Kyrgios thing was a first informal warning prior to Leyhani being forced to issue a code violation for lack of best effort.
I believe all umpires should follow common sense up to the first violation. After that the umpires don't have much leeway. he also tolerated serena's outburst for a whole changeover without issuing a violation. It was only the third rant that brought it. |
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Journeyman. He tried to talk to her and she basically wouldn't let him get a word in edgeways. In fact, at one point she said 'If you're not
going to apologise then don't talk to me'. Also she went on and on and on. In my view her remarks warranted a match default. Even in football such behaviour would have resulted in a red card. I hope she receives a lengthy ban for the sake of the sport. |
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DStyle I assume you agree that his decision to penalise her a game for verbal abuse was a massive one, with the obvious potential to strike a deathblow to what was the headline match of a flagship tournament.
I do. But i think it's right. And I also think it's telling that serena's bad behaviour only happens when she's getting beaten in tournaments she cares about. |
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Serena goes on about the mens behaviour, i bit of unsportsmanship from the ladies too, unfortunately she's a Brit.... what do you think... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPhiBazkhMU
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Check out from 14:00 is that Ramos again... apparently she said "L'll kill you" to the line judge for a foot fault https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPhiBazkhMU
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US Open 2009: Serena Williams unrepentant for rant after Kim Clijsters defeat
Serena Williams was unrepentant and unapologetic after an ugly outburst towards a lineswoman sealed her defeat in the semi-finals at the U.S. Open against Kim Clijsters. The American was beaten 6-4, 7-5 by the Belgian in a match that finished in controversy when she was given a point penalty at match point down after turning on a lineswoman. The title-holder and tournament favourite was 6-4, 6-5 and 15-30 down when the sanction was called against her on her second serve, setting up match point for Clijsters. Gesturing at her with her racket outstretched, Williams - who had earlier been given a code violation for racquet abuse - hurled a volley of abuse towards her, resulting in the point penalty and the loss of the match. The lineswoman then ran up to umpire Louise Engzell to report the incident which brought tournament referee Brian Earley on to the court. It was never confirmed what Williams had said to the lineswoman, but the on-court microphones picked up her saying to the official in an argument: "I never said I would kill you, are you serious?" So once again, a victim... nasty piece of work more like. |
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apologies it was Brian Earley, that looked like Ramos.
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Telegraph 2009:
US Open 2009: Serena Williams loses to Kim Clijsters after 'foul-mouthed' outburst Serena Williams was at the centre of extraordinary scenes at the US Open in the early hours of Sunday when she lost her crown after hurling threatening abuse at a line judge. With the American football season starting over the weekend, it was always going to take something extraordinary for women's tennis to go to the top of the sporting agenda in the United States. On a night of fury and f-words, Williams managed just that, when she received a point penalty at match point down in her semi-final against Kim Clijsters for intimidating a line judge by allegedly telling her: "I swear to God, I'm f------ going to take this f------ ball and shove it down your f------ throat, you hear that? I swear to God." Officials at Flushing Meadows were on Sunday assessing the television footage from the night before, prior to deciding whether to fine the Californian for her alleged language and behaviour. This was the evening in the Arthur Ashe Stadium when the women's defending champion's language had everyone reaching for the asterisks and the bleeping machines, and when even John McEnroe, who in his playing days used to be as proficient at f-words as he was at forehands, was saying that "all hell broke loose". It meant that Clijsters, who came to New York trying to become the first mother for 29 years to win a grand slam, went through to Sunday night's final, where she played Caroline Wozniacki, a teenager from Denmark. To borrow from the Americanese, Williams allegedly started 'dropping the f-bombs' after she was called for a foot-fault when she was serving to stay in the match, when she was a set down, and trailing 5-6, 15-30 in the second set. Williams missed with her first serve, and her second serve was called a foot-fault by a line judge, which meant that the world No 2 was suddenly match point down against Clijsters, a Belgian wild card who gave birth to her daughter Jada last year, and who has been competing at her first slam for two years. An emotional Williams strode over to the lineswoman, who was seated by the side of the court, to wave her racket and a ball, and to let the official know what allegedly she wanted to do with the "f------ ball". The line judge walked to the umpire, Louise Engzell, to report what Williams had said to her. The tournament referee, Brian Earley, and the tournament supervisor, Donna Kelso, then walked on court and became involved, and, during a four-way discussion, Williams was heard saying to the lineswoman: "I never said I would kill you, are you serious? I never said that." Since Williams had earlier received a warning for her conduct, for trashing a racket during the opening set, she was automatically given a point penalty, which meant that the match was over and Clijsters was into the final. Afterwards, Williams was reluctant to repeat what she had said to the official, the United States Tennis Association declined to release the lineswoman's name, and Williams did not sound as though she was about to apologise for what she had said. "An apology from me? How many people yell at linespeople? Players, athletes get frustrated. I don't know how many times I've seen that happen," Williams said. "All year I've never been foot-faulted, and then suddenly in this tournament they keep calling foot faults. "I said something that I guess they gave me a point penalty for. Unfortunately it was on match point. I used to have a real temper, and I've got a lot better. So I know you don't believe me, but I used to be worse. Yes, yes, indeed." The referee later confirmed that it had been a point penalty rather than a default. "It was not a default, it was a point penalty that happened to be given on match point," Earley said. "There was an earlier warning for racket abuse and she was called for a foot fault and she said something to a line umpire and it was reported to the chair and then resulted in a point penalty. It was a code violation for unsportsmanlike conduct." This was not the way that Clijsters had wanted to reach the US Open final, at only her third tournament since she started what she has called her "second career". When the umpire announced that the match was over, Williams walked around the net to shake hands with Clijsters. The way that Clijsters had been striking the ball, it appeared as though she would have reached the final anyway, without Williams's profanities. Wozniacki reached her first grand slam final with a controversy-free, 6-3, 6-3 victory over Belgium's Yanina Wickmayer. Three years ago, when Wozniacki was playing in the juniors here, she was defaulted from a match for making abusive comments towards a line judge, also using the f-word. |
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Serena being hypocritically (reverse)sexist feminist ...and she must feel pissed off that she woz unable to play the joker accusatory racist card she probably keeps tucked up her sleeve to use in such instances ...for obvious african american reasons ...
![]() a dime for Beyoncé's thoughts ... |
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oopsi ... just seen D-style's comments ...
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BARNEY15C 09 Sep 18 12:27
I beleive she will have just argues on and on which would have resulted in here defaulting the match.... apply what you have said and the poor guy was on a hiding to nothing whatever he did or said. But you can't assume that. There's no way of knowing her reaction for sure but I think you have to give one of the most successful athletes in history the benefit of the doubt that if the umpire had made it clear he was considering taking the action she would realigned in the context of exactly what she was potentially forfeiting. So it then goes to what the guys are saying about lack of leeway. But as he was considering an action that he must be understood to be both pivotal and unprecedented (and there's no way he's thinking of a precedent in the heat of that situation in real time)then I'm sorry but he can find a way to exercise discretion and common sense unless he is fast-tracking to take the action because he is making the exact assumption about her emotional state that you have outlined. And that is where this gets very murky imo. I'm trying to picture a situation where an umpire would hit Fed or Nadal or Novak with the loss of a vital game for verbal abuse without clarifying that this decision was being considered, based on the context and on the fact that the decison was I'm pretty sure unprecedented in that context. I can't picture it. |
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Some people like playing devil's advocate don't they? I suppose it is a bit of a challenge. Bit sad if they sad if they actually believe what they are writing because they are effectively arguing for the game turning into a total shambles.
No surprise the comments from King. Then you have Sue Barker who should have been pensioned off years ago saying 'she has a point'. What point? Is she saying because men get away with similar it is fine for Williams to do the same? That is no argument whatsoever. When has Sue ever argued for stronger umpiring of men's matches? She is actually arguing for anything goes. |
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I'm trying to picture a situation where an umpire would hit Fed or Nadal or Novak with the loss of a vital game for verbal abuse without clarifying that this decision was being considered, based on the context and on the fact that the decison was I'm pretty sure unprecedented in that context. I can't picture it. It's very hard to imagine. But there isn't the previous bad behaviour to think about. Nadal is watched like a hawk for time between points in big matches. Rightly so. Davydenko's lack of best effort in his match against cilic in 2007 is a good example of where previous behaviour influenced a decision. |
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I think all decisions were correct. In regard to the game penalty and whether it was fair to give Osaka a free game, that is irrelevant. The penalty is set in stone. The issue is was it a code violation and it clearly was, calling the umpire a liar and a thief.
There are very few comparable cases because there are very few occasions where a player gets to a third code violation. Most of the people I've seen commenting are either completely unaware or completely ignore that the penalties for code violations get progressively worse with each violation and that this was the third violation. It is stupid to compare it to a case where a player hasn't already had two code violations. I remember Gulbis got a game penalty awarded against him v Monaco before. He smashed a racquet, then kicked a ball into the stands, then hit the umpire's chair with his racquet for his third code violation and got a game penalty. |