Politics
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There's some stiff competition!
Afghan War 2001 - 2021
This actually made perfect sense in 2001,and was very successful in achieving the initial goals: smashing the Al Qaeda camps and overthrowing the Taliban that was protecting them.
Now it remembered as a fiasco: 'taking 20 years to replace The Taliban with The Taliban'.
The big mistake was staying around to build democracy and human rights, which are nebulous things to the majority of Afghans. The Western forces should just have left the Afghans to it after putting Bin Laden on the run, as they have done since 2021.
People forget what the initial purpose of the war was. The terrorists who went through the Al Qaeda training were incredibly good at co ordinating mass fatality attacks. Obviously 9/11, but also Madrid 2004, London 2005...
By about 2010 the terrorists who went through that training were mostly dead, perhaps the Bataclan attack in 2015 was the last of them. Since then jihadi terrorists are not very sophisticated at all, blokes running around with kitchen knives.
Iraq War 2003
I'll be surprised if there is anyone still defending this one. Saddam was no threat to anyone outside Iraq. And if his regime had continued for 20 years he could never have got close to matching the death toll that the carnage of insurgency brought.
Certainly he wouldn't have been able to kill thousands of Western troops.
So this war was certainly dumber than the Afghan one, as it had no sensible justification in the first place. And then again, hanging around for decades trying to make a 3rd world tribal land into a liberal democracy.....
To be fair, the early 2000s was the peak of 'end of history' thinking, so the belief that only dictators were preventing women's lib and gay rights being established worldwide was maybe understandable.
Libyan War 2011
This was one of the stupidest things I've seen in my lifetime.
Despite all the lessons of Afghanistan and Iraq, America, Britain & France bomb Gadaffi until he is lynched by his enemies, and are then surprised when a liberal democracy does not emerge in the aftermath.
Iran War 2026
Now I'd be glad to see the Iranian regime fall but how is firing missiles at it going to bring it down? They can hardly surrender to foreign airforces. They certainly can't surrender to the protestors, and there is no armed opposition to them in the country.
So they rule out any negotiation but have no way of ending the regime, which will naturally continue to exist and threaten anything in the Straits of Hormuz.
The best hope seems to be that, as there is no coherent goal or strategy, Trump could at any point stop bombing and declare victory.
Afghan War 2001 - 2021
This actually made perfect sense in 2001,and was very successful in achieving the initial goals: smashing the Al Qaeda camps and overthrowing the Taliban that was protecting them.
Now it remembered as a fiasco: 'taking 20 years to replace The Taliban with The Taliban'.
The big mistake was staying around to build democracy and human rights, which are nebulous things to the majority of Afghans. The Western forces should just have left the Afghans to it after putting Bin Laden on the run, as they have done since 2021.
People forget what the initial purpose of the war was. The terrorists who went through the Al Qaeda training were incredibly good at co ordinating mass fatality attacks. Obviously 9/11, but also Madrid 2004, London 2005...
By about 2010 the terrorists who went through that training were mostly dead, perhaps the Bataclan attack in 2015 was the last of them. Since then jihadi terrorists are not very sophisticated at all, blokes running around with kitchen knives.
Iraq War 2003
I'll be surprised if there is anyone still defending this one. Saddam was no threat to anyone outside Iraq. And if his regime had continued for 20 years he could never have got close to matching the death toll that the carnage of insurgency brought.
Certainly he wouldn't have been able to kill thousands of Western troops.
So this war was certainly dumber than the Afghan one, as it had no sensible justification in the first place. And then again, hanging around for decades trying to make a 3rd world tribal land into a liberal democracy.....
To be fair, the early 2000s was the peak of 'end of history' thinking, so the belief that only dictators were preventing women's lib and gay rights being established worldwide was maybe understandable.
Libyan War 2011
This was one of the stupidest things I've seen in my lifetime.
Despite all the lessons of Afghanistan and Iraq, America, Britain & France bomb Gadaffi until he is lynched by his enemies, and are then surprised when a liberal democracy does not emerge in the aftermath.
Iran War 2026
Now I'd be glad to see the Iranian regime fall but how is firing missiles at it going to bring it down? They can hardly surrender to foreign airforces. They certainly can't surrender to the protestors, and there is no armed opposition to them in the country.
So they rule out any negotiation but have no way of ending the regime, which will naturally continue to exist and threaten anything in the Straits of Hormuz.
The best hope seems to be that, as there is no coherent goal or strategy, Trump could at any point stop bombing and declare victory.
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The best hope seems to be that, as there is no coherent goal or strategy, Trump could at any point stop bombing and declare victory.
i think this is correct but it completely ignores what the iranians might do, at the moment they show no sign of stepping back even if the americans desist. trump cant save face so he seems likely to go further in, sending 5000 marines might just be the start of escalation. |
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There is a clear and obvious remedy.
If the supporters of the dictatorship/dictatorship believe they are martyrs when killed, at the will of their god…..then only those who believe this be in the main square at lunchtime. Everyone else, will be left free to have a reasonable country, and not be getting killed for opposing this dictatorship. |
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I think the point is the recent history as tobes neatly points out. Though you could also add Somalia to the list. But America has a history of sticking its nose in and telling other people that they know better and democracy and peace will magically appear if they just kill one person and then walk away. All you get is generations raised on resentment and hatred of those who destroyed their country and killed their families...And then you just go and do it again. And again. I know the west is desperate to control the supply of oil but surely someone has to ask if continually bombing people is the best way to go about it.
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Democracy works so well Trump wants his SAVE bill in place to stop millions of Americans voting in the midterm elections
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All Abrahamic religions feed off the belief that resembles the Rapture
The Book of Revelations Why live in constant innuendo? One side believe Trump is Satan incarnate and that the end of days occurs when given the chance to leave the world en-masse, and the rest don’t. Let’s just force it one way or the other. The alternative is illogical, one side makes spurious claims continually and kills innocents with impunity, and when they get tackled the handwringers have a fit. Why not bring it to its logical conclusion. It’s either true or it ain’t. |
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This forum is so much better when you don't see dusty's drivel.
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He doesn't even talk clear English and it's almost as if it fell mostly straight from a book he once read and got married to ...
He obviously feels it's ok to parade thoughts around like a born Zionist .. Shameful stuff really |
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Is this the dumbest war of the century?
Surely, the only way to truly answer that is what are the main objectives of going in ? Has anyone actually cleared that up yet cos it seems to change depending on which way the wind blows that moment |
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ezq-fVXM0uI
I think this guy is correct in that the War was a Trump vanity project. He thought the uprisings were the green light for him to declare himself the US President that ended the Iran problem and all it needed was a little push from Netanyahu. |
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CL
All Abrahamic religions believe in the same thing, just phrased differently Rapture=The Wind in Hadith Takes away the believers to leave behind non believers So if a believer thinks it’s gods hand controlling trump taking the lives of believers then that is the same If it were always going to happen, then it was destiny, if it were all false, then why do we have to keep apologising for it while allowing the continual killing of innocents in its name? |
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How can you start a thread on dumbest war of the century and fail to mention Russia’s endless war with Ukraine or Hamas starting a war with Israel then crying when they get womped back to the 16th century?
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The disparity arises from the uncomfortable truth that the handwringers don’t have an answer to either how you tackle the dictatorship’s belief they can kill those who want to live a free life, or that we can’t hasten the actual end if that is what believers believe.
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If Russia is making $150m a day from this war as reported, then there is every incentive for them continuing to give Iran all the drones they need to keep the war effort going.
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Ukraine War is more absurd ofc, as was Hamas. Ukraine War was more so one man's vanity project than this one.
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Serves as a warning not to give too much power to one person
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And ofc the Ukraine War has been going on for 4 years, this one for less than one month. So we don't know what the longer term outcome will be, but the decision does look pretty dumb as things stand.
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If Russia uses 10% of the amount it's allegedly making from oil to send drones to Iran, that's 600 drones a day (if that is logistically possible)
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The first 100 hours of the the US operation estimated to cost $3.7bn
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What you always have to remember is Trump has dementia and he hand picked all the idiots for his cabinet.
Bing bing bong bong. |
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He appointed sycophants over aptitude and experience and it shows
The Cambridge Dictionary puts it perfectly .. A sycophant is a person who uses insincere, excessive flattery to win favor or advantage from influential, wealthy, or powerful people. They are often described as fawning, servile, and "yes men" who prioritize gaining favor over honesty, essentially acting as parasitic followers |
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Could someone please explain in the simplest of terms : what is/are the main objective/objectives of this strike and in particular - why now ?
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Dusty ?
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Why now?
Most likely reason is Trump thought or was persuaded to think by Netanyahu, that the Iran uprisings presented a brilliant opportunity for Trump himself to claim personal glory |
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To destroy the extremist regime’s ability inflict damage directly or indirectly on other countries, with the possibility of changing the regime entirely to a more agreeable one for all concerned.
Now because there is only 1 country who can realistically do that, and they have had a series of presidents who put the problem off until it became the problem it is now. The enriched uranium they have can’t be used for energy. |
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It was a reasonable thought to make if you did no due diligence
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Until the problem it is now ?
It's more of a problem now than any other time ? How so ? And with that myopic view, you are also stating that this has absolutely nothing to do with the rush for controlling resources ie Oil or indeed it also does not support the 'Greater Israel' theory/trade off Both points that really cannot be argued against given the huge amount of evidence in both areas since 19 hundred and blah |
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The American press were asking awkward questions about that 13-year-old.
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Everyone knows what Trump is like by now. Everything is driven by his ego.
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Looks as if Trump could possibly be sending those 5000 marines to Kharg Island?
If so he would intend to capture Iranian oil production and strangle them economically. Oil fields attacked everywhere? Seems as if Trump is thinking on the spur of the moment and the Iranians have been planning for years. |
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Why are you asking me if you already think you know the answer?
The IAEA said they have enriched uranium to 60%, it’s not whether they can create the material, it’s now the time it takes them to work out how to deploy it. The previous direction was to agree they would ultimately achieve a bomb, but it wouldn’t have been possible until those who agreed to it were out of office-somebody else’s problem This of a regime who have threatened numerous countries, tried to assassinate numerous figures and kept up a terrorist funding and training scheme while saying they would destroy America and Israel Now you can come to your half baked ideas, but they have no impact on the outcome so don’t really matter. |
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The draft dodger doesn't give a monkeys about anyone or anything else bar golf, himself or his family. I'm confident he thought it was a slam dunk.
Like he really cares about the brutal Iran regime and it's persecuted people? Ofc he doesn't. But if he can come across as their glorious saviour, that's the motivation he wants. |
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Perhaps more likely he's leading them into an humanitarian crisis, which might bring about a change of leadership or might not. His only care will be how his legacy looks.
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Likely^ but that won't work as history shows, maybe try it but how could the world watch on if a Gaza 2 situation arises.
This is an illegal war. |
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Oil... It's (always) about Oil.
When the dust settles, the Trump family will control 40% of the worlds oil. |
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What we can be pretty sure of is both sides are lying through their teeth. So difficult to draw any meaningful conclusions as to their thoughts, reserves and actual resolve. You can only rely on (independent US media if there is any AHEM) or mainstream European media as an outlet that might be insightful or objective.
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Why would you encourage a family member to go into the armed forces. At least if they went drug dealing, they would get a few quid before tehir death at a young age.
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I really don't think it's about oil Escapee. I think it's purely Trump's ego driving this (with a little help from Israel)
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What did that Venezuelan women do? Give Trump her NPP. Why? To satisfy his ego.
Why did Infantino invent the FIFA PP? To satisfy his ego. They recognise it. With Trump all decisions are driven by his personal ego. He does like golf and beautiful women, though fully denies any sexual impropriety. |
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Bing bing, bong bong.
Trump hadn't attacked Iran's oil exporting facilities so far because he was hoping to control who gets it control (and probably take a multi-billion dollar bribe) But by now he must realise Iran is not Venezuela and he's never going to get his baby hands on it. |