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How Many Other "Naughty Tories" Are Out There?

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By:
politicspunter
When: 02 Aug 20 17:16
From the Sunday Times...

In the latest case, a fellow Conservative MP first raised the woman’s allegation with Mark Spencer, the chief whip, and Jacob Rees-Mogg, the leader of the House of Commons, after speaking to the alleged victim a month ago.

The woman also spoke to Spencer directly. However, no action was taken. A spokesman for Spencer said: “The chief whip takes all allegations of harassment and abuse extremely seriously and has strongly encouraged anybody who has approached him to contact the appropriate authorities, including parliament’s independent complaints and grievance scheme.”

It is understood that Spencer does not believe a sexual assault was reported to him in his conversation with the complainant, but acknowledges that she reported abusive behaviour and threats.

If this report is correct, why was the MP concerned not immediately suspended/whip removed until these extremely serious allegations were thoroughly investigated? Why was this MP allowed to continue to work with other possible victims within Parliament? Why did Mark Spencer/JRM not report the case immediately to the police?
By:
Whisperingdeath
When: 02 Aug 20 17:24
Circumstantial evidence and only one side of the story. Would have thought though that the alleged incidents should have been reported to parliamentary authorities.

This is not a party political issue. I am sure there are axes to grind but they need to ascertain whatever facts there are and let the police or parliamentary authorities if offenses were committed in Parliament get on with their respective investigations.

Fact is we don't know anything and are just speculating over a serious crime.
By:
politicspunter
When: 02 Aug 20 17:26
From the bbc...

A Tory MP arrested on suspicion of rape will not be suspended from the party while investigations are ongoing, the party's whips' office has said.

A spokesman said the allegations were "serious" and "it is right that they are investigated fully".

The Sunday Times reported the allegations against the former minister had been made by an ex-parliamentary employee.

The MP, in his 50s, was arrested on Saturday and has since been bailed.

The Metropolitan Police said the allegations related to four separate incidents claimed to have taken place between July 2019 and January 2020.

A spokesman for the Conservative Party whips' office said: "The whip has not been suspended. This decision will be reviewed once the police investigation has been concluded."

This means he can continue to sit in the House of Commons as a Conservative.

Labour said this decision was "shocking" and sent a "terrible message from Westminster".

The Sunday Times, which first reported the story, said the complainant alleges that the MP assaulted her, forced her to have sex and left her so traumatised that she had to go to hospital.

The Metropolitan Police said it had launched an investigation into the allegations.

"On Friday, 31 July, the Metropolitan Police Service received allegations relating to four separate incidents involving allegations of sexual offences and assault," the force said in a statement.

"These offences are alleged to have occurred at addresses in Westminster, Lambeth and Hackney between July 2019 and January 2020.

"A man in his 50s was arrested on Saturday 1 August on suspicion of rape. He has been released on bail to return on a date in mid-August."

For Labour, shadow minister for domestic violence and safeguarding Jess Phillips told Times Radio the MP accused of rape should have the party whip withdrawn while investigations continued.

She said that not doing so was "sending a terrible message from Westminster".

Ms Phillips also said: "I find it shocking… that the Conservative Party has decided not to withdraw the whip in this case."

There are also reports that the Conservative Party's chief whip, Mark Spencer, had been aware of allegations - and previously spoke with the alleged victim.

According to sources, Mr Spencer had not known the "magnitude" of the allegations.

A spokesman for the chief whip said that he took all allegations of harassment and abuse extremely seriously and had strongly encouraged anybody who has approached him to contact the appropriate authorities.
By:
Whisperingdeath
When: 02 Aug 20 17:32
I think withdrawing the Whip when we don't know too much is dangerous. What if she is a fantasist or has an axe to grind? Listen I am not defending the MP, just we do regard innocence before guilt is proved as a human right.
By:
politicspunter
When: 02 Aug 20 17:35
Whispering, I am not saying anyone is guilty. However, the seriousness of the allegations suggests he should be removed from that place immediately. I wouldn't wish my daughter to be his new intern.
By:
politicspunter
When: 02 Aug 20 19:25
Sexual assault conviction
Party suspension
In November 2017, Elphicke was suspended from the Conservative Party after "serious allegations" made against him were referred to the police. Elphicke stated: "I am not aware of what the alleged claims are and deny any wrongdoing."[4]

Please tell me what's different regarding the case of Elphicke and this new case? Why was Elphicke suspended and not the MP in this case?
By:
----you-have-to-laugh---
When: 02 Aug 20 19:27
Maybe he has more money?
By:
politicspunter
When: 02 Aug 20 19:31
Or maybe the PM at the time of Elphickes case had far higher moral standards?
By:
----you-have-to-laugh---
When: 02 Aug 20 19:45
Maybe they doubt credibility of evidence?

He's innocent until proven guilty?


These things can come back to bite if a guilty verdict is reached
or a guilty plea is entered.
By:
politicspunter
When: 02 Aug 20 19:52
The case alleges four separate allegations in different locations over a six month period including at least one rape. The alleged victim had to go to hospital. That surely is good enough for any organisation to suspend the person in question until the matter is resolved?
By:
JML
When: 02 Aug 20 20:08
Would they have to reveal his identity if they suspended him?
By:
----you-have-to-laugh---
When: 02 Aug 20 20:09
You would think so, but they have the advantage over us of having heard both sides.

It's their decision to not suspend him.
By:
JML
When: 02 Aug 20 20:20
The reason why they name people is to encourage other victims to come foward.

I think in this case they have narrowed the field enough without having to name him.

BTW --how many ex cabinet ministers in their 50s are there?

I'm sure someone will have checked the runners.
By:
----you-have-to-laugh---
When: 02 Aug 20 20:32
I think there are 4
By:
mafeking
When: 02 Aug 20 20:45
elphicke had the whip restored just so he could vote for may's hopeless deal
By:
politicspunter
When: 02 Aug 20 21:03
Graham Brady

Mel Stride
By:
Shanelee1966
When: 02 Aug 20 21:28
What price is CG?
By:
JML
When: 02 Aug 20 21:43
These offences are alleged to have occurred at addresses in Westminster, Lambeth and Hackney between July 2019 and January 2020.

Any help in choosing your favourite?
By:
cryoftruth
When: 02 Aug 20 22:30

elphicke had the whip restored


Oh dear. Oh dear.
By:
Capt__F
When: 03 Aug 20 00:03
is he a free man ?
By:
mafeking
When: 03 Aug 20 00:41
whip was restored so he could vote for may in the no confidence vote
By:
Richie_Burnett
When: 03 Aug 20 01:02

Aug 2, 2020 -- 9:28PM, Shanelee1966 wrote:


What price is CG?


He'd probably spend £100 billion at a brothel with no prostitutes.

By:
salmon spray
When: 03 Aug 20 09:17
I think Richie is correct,Grayling wouldn't be capable.
As it's a woman Fox is a bit of a long-shot as well.
By:
Whisperingdeath
When: 03 Aug 20 09:26
Why would the Whip need to be restored for him to vote for the Government even if he was a Naughty Tory? Strange decision. He could still vote for the Government without the Whip!

I understand what you are getting at btw PP and have heard in a similar circumstance a Policeman would be stood down on full pay but for me this is different because of the public profile. Sheite sticks. Anyone could make an allegation then withdraw it.
By:
1st time poster
When: 03 Aug 20 09:41
didnt no francois was ever a minister
not certain but probably someone who lost his job in reshuffle but could have been a minister years ago,
and as he,s been protected its a nap he,s a rabid brexiteer, Wink
i,ll have 50p ew on MH ,ew only because i always had him down as more inclined to chase dr fox around the room
By:
1st time poster
When: 03 Aug 20 09:41
which name has twitter put in the frame, Wink
By:
politicspunter
When: 03 Aug 20 10:42
The Sunday Times reported that the allegations against the former minister had been made by an ex-parliamentary employee.

A spokesman for the chief whip said that he took all accusations of harassment and abuse extremely seriously and had strongly encouraged anybody who has approached him to contact the appropriate authorities.

According to sources, Mr Spencer had not known the "magnitude" of the allegations.

But a report in the Daily Telegraph suggested the woman became frustrated after they spoke that nothing was done.

What sort of "magnitude" does multiple alleged serious sexual assaults come under?
By:
1st time poster
When: 03 Aug 20 11:02
SHE WOULDNT take hush money for an answer, Wink,
or a woman scorned after an affair etc,etc
By:
politicspunter
When: 03 Aug 20 11:05
If she wanted money she would have gone to the press long before she went to the police.
By:
salmon spray
When: 03 Aug 20 11:46
If there are over 20 possibles it could be argued that they are all in danger of being besmirched.
As has been said it does look like there is one rule for Tory MPs (or some of them) and another for the rest of us. Poor old Cliff was named and shamed and if I remember rightly he wasn't even arrested.
By:
1st time poster
When: 03 Aug 20 11:56
thats why he,ll be outed shortly by fellow tory,s as their implicated on social media etc in guessing game
By:
politicspunter
When: 03 Aug 20 12:02
Yep, you can bet that multiple news organisations will be contacting each mp/family/friends/neighbours to try and find some dirt.
By:
1st time poster
When: 03 Aug 20 12:55
person getting a lot of attention on twatter seems to be the holy grail and to much to hope for , maybe she didnt actually read the 518 page withhdrawl agreement in full, Wink,so was punished
By:
Akak
When: 03 Aug 20 13:20
I would have thought some Labour MP would use parliamentary privilege to name him by now.
By:
1st time poster
When: 03 Aug 20 13:27
daily mail have spoken to his local party members,oifficials,soits ok for trhe media,tory party,and local constituents to keep their wives ,daughters away ftrom him if they choose,but the plebs dont get that choice,absolutely shocking,if the police dont go ahead the ladies going to go to media anyway so any normal innocent bloke would out himself and get his version of evrents out there,and not hope they wake up and its all gone away,its already turned in  to a huge tory party conspiracy
so obvious its a high profile,public face of brexit, would explain why a certain name has been mentioned on this forum of been missing in action since the election as compared to before the election
By:
politicspunter
When: 03 Aug 20 13:37

Aug 3, 2020 -- 1:20PM, Akak wrote:


I would have thought some Labour MP would use parliamentary privilege to name him by now.


Westminster in in recess right now.

By:
politicspunter
When: 03 Aug 20 13:38

Aug 3, 2020 -- 1:27PM, 1st time poster wrote:


daily mail have spoken to his local party members,oifficials,soits ok for trhe media,tory party,and local constituents to keep their wives ,daughters away ftrom him if they choose,but the plebs dont get that choice,absolutely shocking,if the police dont go ahead the ladies going to go to media anyway so any normal innocent bloke would out himself and get his version of evrents out there,and not hope they wake up and its all gone away,its already turned in  to a huge tory party conspiracyso obvious its a high profile,public face of brexit, would explain why a certain name has been mentioned on this forum of been missing in action since the election as compared to before the election


Nothing is obvious.

By:
1st time poster
When: 03 Aug 20 14:29
the chief whip new of a sexual relationship between the two,
his local party have known him for 25 years and believe his version of events

so his local tory party and chief whip are quite happoy for a 50 odd year old mp to have a sexual relationship with a fellow worker and aid,FFS in this day and age what planet s=are these tory,s on,
elphick who fellow tory mp,s and ministers lobbied johnson to help out,
damien green
fallon,
wheres loathsome all over media if bercow drops a sweetie wrapper
By:
politicspunter
When: 03 Aug 20 17:32
Under Boris, 21 MPs had the whip withdrawn for voting against the Brexit bill. Also under Boris, one of his former minister MPs is allegedly accused of multiple sexual offences including rape but doesn't have the whip removed.
By:
1st time poster
When: 03 Aug 20 18:20
doris removes party whip for suspected rapist for getting caught LaughLaugh
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