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Some porkies going on here. Is Boris dumb enough to buy it then watch her try to stop Brexit again from within the cabinet?
Hunt another ReMayner infiltrator.
Hunt another ReMayner infiltrator.
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wouldn't trust her an inch and in any case at the first hint of any funny business she'd be out straight away
If you want to be in the gang ......
Amber Rudd yesterday dropped her opposition to a No Deal Brexit in a move that could see her appointed as Boris Johnson’s foreign secretary.
The Work and Pensions Secretary – who led Cabinet opposition to leaving the EU without a deal earlier this year – said she now accepted it would be ‘part of the armoury’ in negotiations.
The dramatic shift lifts the bar to her serving in a Cabinet led by Mr Johnson, who has said he will only appoint ministers to his top team if they are ‘reconciled’ to the possibility of a No Deal Brexit this autumn.
Sources in Mr Johnson’s camp have suggested Miss Rudd could be rewarded with the post of foreign secretary if she softened her stance on No Deal.
Amber Rudd yesterday dropped her opposition to a No Deal Brexit in a move that could see her appointed as Boris Johnson’s foreign secretary.
The Work and Pensions Secretary – who led Cabinet opposition to leaving the EU without a deal earlier this year – said she now accepted it would be ‘part of the armoury’ in negotiations.
The dramatic shift lifts the bar to her serving in a Cabinet led by Mr Johnson, who has said he will only appoint ministers to his top team if they are ‘reconciled’ to the possibility of a No Deal Brexit this autumn.
Sources in Mr Johnson’s camp have suggested Miss Rudd could be rewarded with the post of foreign secretary if she softened her stance on No Deal.
boris is a bit dim but not even he,s dumb enough to give a top cabinet job to someone with a majority the size of the crowd in hastings weatherspoons on a tues afternoon, 
These tories just don't have any principles,how can she go from being adamant about there being no deal these people are so self srving it's unbelievable,never ever trust the tories..
Boris be very careful when you consider cabinet posts...
1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToBQ7weCBok
2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPuOiIZ3w1E
(1) is more worrying than (2).
But (2) is personal and completely and utterly unacceptable.
1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ToBQ7weCBok
2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPuOiIZ3w1E
(1) is more worrying than (2).
But (2) is personal and completely and utterly unacceptable.
I wonder how many of these will now drop by the wayside,no deal must be a cert now fall like a pack of cards..
It depends what you read into this, there is many diff possibilities here, especially as the headline isn't exactly what she said, albeit I think she knew what she was saying would get quoted like this.
Ie. She basically said she accepted that no deal was part of the armoury going forward in the Brexit discussions.
Is this just because the leadership challenge is going on and she doesn't want to undermine Hunt?
Is this just because she's desperate to keep her job in cabinet against her morals?
Is this like above but some kind of bluff to be an insider in cabinet?
Is this because she views no deal as preferable to a Corbyn government?
It's one of them, but who knows which.
Ie. She basically said she accepted that no deal was part of the armoury going forward in the Brexit discussions.
Is this just because the leadership challenge is going on and she doesn't want to undermine Hunt?
Is this just because she's desperate to keep her job in cabinet against her morals?
Is this like above but some kind of bluff to be an insider in cabinet?
Is this because she views no deal as preferable to a Corbyn government?
It's one of them, but who knows which.
There's also a very strange relationship between Boris and Rudd I don't quite get. One minute according to media they hate each other, and it's Rudd who leads the anyone but Boris brigade, the next it's talk of secret pacts between the two, and this keeps going round in circles, again not to the bottom of that either.
Jul 12, 2019 -- 10:02PM, thegiggilo wrote:
I wonder how many of these will now drop by the wayside,no deal must be a cert now fall like a pack of cards..
Well I assume all of Hammond, Gauke and Clark are defo gone under Boris, not really heard from Gauke recently, but the other two have said they won't drop their opposition to no deal just to stay in cabinet and will stick to their principles.
Then depends who their allies are.
hunt is now saying we should leave by christmas, more delay by another **** torie, can you imagine that silly grin of hunts in brussels, he would be a laughing stock, boris to shut down parl and leave by oct 31st
No chance parliament gets shut down, even Boris isn't that stupid.
if its the only way to get brexit thru by oct 31st so be it, we cant have even more delay, like boris said not leavin no deal or a deal would erode trust in all parties
No-one will be willing to pay that price even if you think anyone is willing to get the Queen involved in the first place.
You prorogue parliament, you cannot govern, you will desperately need to be able to govern in the event of a no deal or there will be chaos. No-one would be actually willing to go ahead with that knowing it will be their name attached to it.
You prorogue parliament, you cannot govern, you will desperately need to be able to govern in the event of a no deal or there will be chaos. No-one would be actually willing to go ahead with that knowing it will be their name attached to it.
Also that's just the tipping of the iceberg of the absolute crisis proroguing parliament would create. A constitutional crisis not seen before. Bercow is saying he would block it, though no-one seems to know what that actually means given it's the Queen ultimately with the power. The Queen has to actually grant it, does anyone really know if she will?
There would be certain legal challenges, as it's not remotely clear it's legal to use prorogation that way (to force something through against the will of parliament). There is just no-one that will be willing to pay that price, and it's hard to see how any PM doing it would last afterwards.
There would be certain legal challenges, as it's not remotely clear it's legal to use prorogation that way (to force something through against the will of parliament). There is just no-one that will be willing to pay that price, and it's hard to see how any PM doing it would last afterwards.
The next thing you know hammond will be doing a uturn,wonder what he thinks of rudd can't find any comments by him or any others against no deal..
any new leader would have sacked hammond. far too closely aligned with may. the two of them without question the worst pm and chancellor duo ever
Hammond is the most sensible person in the British Cabinet . One of the few able people in it doing a decent job given what is going on all around . That he is firmly convinced that a no deal Brexit would be inadvisable economically must irk the Brexiteers big time .The Chancellor has to know the figures , others in the Cabinet are not close to the figures on a daily basis . Do any of the Brexiteers believe he is completely wrong in his view ? He does seem to know what he is talking about , unlike a lot of his cabinet colleagues .
n88uk • July 13, 2019 12:44 AM BST
Also that's just the tipping of the iceberg of the absolute crisis proroguing parliament would create. A constitutional crisis not seen before. Bercow is saying he would block it, though no-one seems to know what that actually means given it's the Queen ultimately with the power. The Queen has to actually grant it, does anyone really know if she will?
You'd obviously do what the french did to their monarchs if they insist on seriously getting involved in sabotaging parliament.
Also that's just the tipping of the iceberg of the absolute crisis proroguing parliament would create. A constitutional crisis not seen before. Bercow is saying he would block it, though no-one seems to know what that actually means given it's the Queen ultimately with the power. The Queen has to actually grant it, does anyone really know if she will?
You'd obviously do what the french did to their monarchs if they insist on seriously getting involved in sabotaging parliament.
THe Brexit deal by Bojo will be carried by Labour MP's. Up to 40 will be at risk of losing their seats with Labour pushing for a 2nd referendum. Hammond has been the worst opposer of Brexit so when Bojo gets in he goes, big time.
The deal Bojo will put before the government. A deal will be negotiated. Both sides want it. It may be a bastardised version of May's deal but there will be a deal.
Jul 13, 2019 -- 12:22AM, lord skywalker wrote:
hunt is now saying we should leave by christmas, more delay by another **** torie, can you imagine that silly grin of hunts in brussels, he would be a laughing stock, boris to shut down parl and leave by oct 31st
It's gonna be so cool in a few years when Jeremy Corbyn shuts down parliament to force through far leftist policy
No he doesn't. He is just keeping everything on the table to focus minds. Look how his not dismissing proroguing the parliament has so many mp's running around like headless chickens. That is exactly what will be happening in the EU.
It's really not lad.
The EU are actually far more focused on Italy right now and coming to an agreement about their debt and structuring it.
Brexit for them has already been agreed. If you think Boris is going to come in, then go on his summer hols and then magically negotiate a new deal in about 6 weeks you are deluded. His only chance of leaving on Halloween is convincing parliament to agree May's deal. That's it. No Deal won't pass. And if he wants his own deal he'll need more time and will have to give the EU a Damon good reason to extend again.
But May's deal is it. He may be able to ds-1package it slightly but that's all. Question then is if enough MP's back it. Given Labour's position and the fact that opposition parties - from either side - can smell blood, I'd be doubtful.
The EU are actually far more focused on Italy right now and coming to an agreement about their debt and structuring it.
Brexit for them has already been agreed. If you think Boris is going to come in, then go on his summer hols and then magically negotiate a new deal in about 6 weeks you are deluded. His only chance of leaving on Halloween is convincing parliament to agree May's deal. That's it. No Deal won't pass. And if he wants his own deal he'll need more time and will have to give the EU a Damon good reason to extend again.
But May's deal is it. He may be able to ds-1package it slightly but that's all. Question then is if enough MP's back it. Given Labour's position and the fact that opposition parties - from either side - can smell blood, I'd be doubtful.
PorcupineorPineapple
13 Jul 19 10:23
Joined: 03 Dec 15
| Topic/replies: 8,099 | Blogger: PorcupineorPineapple's blog
It's really not lad.
The EU are actually far more focused on Italy right now and coming to an agreement about their debt and structuring it.
Brexit for them has already been agreed. If you think Boris is going to come in, then go on his summer hols and then magically negotiate a new deal in about 6 weeks you are deluded. His only chance of leaving on Halloween is convincing parliament to agree May's deal. That's it. No Deal won't pass. And if he wants his own deal he'll need more time and will have to give the EU a Damon good reason to extend again.
But May's deal is it. He may be able to ds-1package it slightly but that's all. Question then is if enough MP's back it. Given Labour's position and the fact that opposition parties - from either side - can smell blood, I'd be doubtful.
^
'No Deal' won't pass what?
13 Jul 19 10:23
Joined: 03 Dec 15
| Topic/replies: 8,099 | Blogger: PorcupineorPineapple's blog
It's really not lad.
The EU are actually far more focused on Italy right now and coming to an agreement about their debt and structuring it.
Brexit for them has already been agreed. If you think Boris is going to come in, then go on his summer hols and then magically negotiate a new deal in about 6 weeks you are deluded. His only chance of leaving on Halloween is convincing parliament to agree May's deal. That's it. No Deal won't pass. And if he wants his own deal he'll need more time and will have to give the EU a Damon good reason to extend again.
But May's deal is it. He may be able to ds-1package it slightly but that's all. Question then is if enough MP's back it. Given Labour's position and the fact that opposition parties - from either side - can smell blood, I'd be doubtful.
^
'No Deal' won't pass what?
PoP probably means no deal won't pass by a vote and if that's what he means I agree.
Jul 13, 2019 -- 10:09AM, brigust1 wrote:
No he doesn't.
The EU are probably laughing their heads off at the shambles of a dead end we have backed ourselves into.
Yes, that's what I meant. It won't be allowed to be our official position, if that makes it clearer.
Parliament will never vote for it and will vote to block it at the appropriate time. That much is clear.
Parliament will never vote for it and will vote to block it at the appropriate time. That much is clear.
By the narrowest of margins, the House of Commons voted in favor of legislation which forces the UK government to request another extension to the Brexit process. The bill, which passed by 313 votes to 312, seeks to prevent Prime Minister Theresa May yanking the UK out of the European Union without an agreed deal.4 Apr 2019
With so many Labour MP's looking down the barrel of a Brexit gun and losing their seats the numbers may change to support a no-deal. But I think the witholding of funds to the EU unless a deal is agreed may sharpen the EU minds considering their current lack of financial growth in 2017.18 and 19 and the inability of other countries to replace our contributions.
With so many Labour MP's looking down the barrel of a Brexit gun and losing their seats the numbers may change to support a no-deal. But I think the witholding of funds to the EU unless a deal is agreed may sharpen the EU minds considering their current lack of financial growth in 2017.18 and 19 and the inability of other countries to replace our contributions.
So in effect you are saying that Conservatives in remain constituencies will oppose any deal?
Funnily enough, there are reports that many governments in the EU are quite chillaxed at the prospect of a no-deal because they, super arrogantly, expect the UK to come back begging within mere weeks.
Brig, if you've paid any attention in the last few months you'd realise the pressure on Labour seats is coming squarely from the remain side. That's where they're fighting their battles and where they are heading towards.
Jul 13, 2019 -- 12:07PM, edy wrote:
Funnily enough, there are reports that many governments in the EU are quite chillaxed at the prospect of a no-deal because they, super arrogantly, expect the UK to come back begging within mere weeks.
Wouldn't surprise me in the slightest.
PorcupineorPineapple
13 Jul 19 12:13
Joined: 03 Dec 15
| Topic/replies: 8,104 | Blogger: PorcupineorPineapple's blog
Brig, if you've paid any attention in the last few months you'd realise the pressure on Labour seats is coming squarely from the remain side. That's where they're fighting their battles and where they are heading towards.
^
Dozens of seats in the Labour heartlands in Wales, the Midlands and the North in trouble if Labour on not support Brexit and take our freedom back.
Labour patriots like Caroline Flint know this and will not stop us leaving the corporate EU.
13 Jul 19 12:13
Joined: 03 Dec 15
| Topic/replies: 8,104 | Blogger: PorcupineorPineapple's blog
Brig, if you've paid any attention in the last few months you'd realise the pressure on Labour seats is coming squarely from the remain side. That's where they're fighting their battles and where they are heading towards.
^
Dozens of seats in the Labour heartlands in Wales, the Midlands and the North in trouble if Labour on not support Brexit and take our freedom back.
Labour patriots like Caroline Flint know this and will not stop us leaving the corporate EU.
23rd June 2019 Caroline Flint - one of 26 MPs who signed a letter this week urging the Labour leader not to swing his party behind a second Brexit referendum - said the next Prime Minister should "reach out" across the political divide to get an agreement through the House of Commons.
And she revealed that she would prefer to see a no-deal Brexit than vote to revoke Article 50 and kill off plans to leave the European Union altogether
And she revealed that she would prefer to see a no-deal Brexit than vote to revoke Article 50 and kill off plans to leave the European Union altogether
What's that got to do with the plan you claim Boris has?
Labour patriots like Caroline Flint know this and will not stop us leaving the corporate EU.
Much unlike the unpatriotic traitor quisling ERG members that have stopped you leaving the corporate EU.
Much unlike the unpatriotic traitor quisling ERG members that have stopped you leaving the corporate EU.
Westminster has had numerous opportunities to vote for a deal, May's deal. They didn't mainly because of the ERG. The ERG won't support anything other than no deal. Most other MPs won't support no deal. We are at an impasse and an election is looking more likely by the day.
Did you need teaching about why some members of the ERG rejected May's new treaty again PP?
Or do you think you are capable of going back and doing your own research on this?
Or do you think you are capable of going back and doing your own research on this?
Too many Tories obsessed with wrecking the country to save the Tory party. Rudd is just one of an increasing number. She has been all talk and no action throughout the Brexit process.
I continue to question the numbers who would actually vote down no deal if it came to the crunch. Let's face it we have a potential Prime Minister who admits it is a rubbish idea but would still do it.
I continue to question the numbers who would actually vote down no deal if it came to the crunch. Let's face it we have a potential Prime Minister who admits it is a rubbish idea but would still do it.
Jul 13, 2019 -- 1:25PM, InsiderTrader wrote:
Did you need teaching about why some members of the ERG rejected May's new treaty again PP?Or do you think you are capable of going back and doing your own research on this?
It's entirely their choice to reject May's deal and stop us leaving. It wasn't my choice or the choice of the country. Now because of their actions we have become a laughing stock, a mere plaything for Trump and others like him to shaft us over a barrel as it is clear we cannot agree on anything amongst ourselves. Our only chance of saviour is a general election where the make up of the house may allow us to leave with some semblance of normality.
Jul 13, 2019 -- 1:25PM, InsiderTrader wrote:
Did you need teaching about why some members of the ERG rejected May's new treaty again PP?Or do you think you are capable of going back and doing your own research on this?
Incredible that the ERG has been able to manipulate the unthoughtful sheep like this.
politicspunter
13 Jul 19 13:38
Joined: 20 Mar 18
| Topic/replies: 5,508 | Blogger: politicspunter's blog
Jul 13, 2019 -- 1:25PM, InsiderTrader wrote:
Did you need teaching about why some members of the ERG rejected May's new treaty again PP?Or do you think you are capable of going back and doing your own research on this?
It's entirely their choice to reject May's deal and stop us leaving. It wasn't my choice or the choice of the country. Now because of their actions we have become a laughing stock, a mere plaything for Trump and others like him to shaft us over a barrel as it is clear we cannot agree on anything amongst ourselves. Our only chance of saviour is a general election where the make up of the house may allow us to leave with some semblance of normality.
^
If we had accepted May's new Treaty that lost by 230 votes (the largest in UK history) then we would have been a laughing stock as we would have signed up to something we could never leave (unlike the EU now).
We both know this.
I do not understand why you persist with this line argument after being schooled on it dozens of times.
13 Jul 19 13:38
Joined: 20 Mar 18
| Topic/replies: 5,508 | Blogger: politicspunter's blog
Jul 13, 2019 -- 1:25PM, InsiderTrader wrote:
Did you need teaching about why some members of the ERG rejected May's new treaty again PP?Or do you think you are capable of going back and doing your own research on this?
It's entirely their choice to reject May's deal and stop us leaving. It wasn't my choice or the choice of the country. Now because of their actions we have become a laughing stock, a mere plaything for Trump and others like him to shaft us over a barrel as it is clear we cannot agree on anything amongst ourselves. Our only chance of saviour is a general election where the make up of the house may allow us to leave with some semblance of normality.
^
If we had accepted May's new Treaty that lost by 230 votes (the largest in UK history) then we would have been a laughing stock as we would have signed up to something we could never leave (unlike the EU now).
We both know this.
I do not understand why you persist with this line argument after being schooled on it dozens of times.
You are not schooling anyone. You are blind to the mess we have found ourselves in by our own selfish actions.
Even Trump told May the deal she had was a bad one and we could have been a laughing stock had we taken it. It was a deal she arranged between herself and her husband she never took anyone with her and she sighed for the backstop. This is a new page.
politicspunter
13 Jul 19 13:50
Joined: 20 Mar 18
| Topic/replies: 5,512 | Blogger: politicspunter's blog
You are not schooling anyone. You are blind to the mess we have found ourselves in by our own selfish actions.
^
Nothing selfish about the 5th largest economy in the world refusing to sign up to a Treaty that it could never leave.
It would have been completely unacceptable as you well know.
13 Jul 19 13:50
Joined: 20 Mar 18
| Topic/replies: 5,512 | Blogger: politicspunter's blog
You are not schooling anyone. You are blind to the mess we have found ourselves in by our own selfish actions.
^
Nothing selfish about the 5th largest economy in the world refusing to sign up to a Treaty that it could never leave.
It would have been completely unacceptable as you well know.
Jul 13, 2019 -- 2:57PM, brigust1 wrote:
Even Trump told May the deal she had was a bad one and we could have been a laughing stock had we taken it. It was a deal she arranged between herself and her husband she never took anyone with her and she sighed for the backstop. This is a new page.
drivel
Jul 13, 2019 -- 3:01PM, InsiderTrader wrote:
politicspunter13 Jul 19 13:50Joined: 20 Mar 18| Topic/replies: 5,512 | Blogger: politicspunter's blogYou are not schooling anyone. You are blind to the mess we have found ourselves in by our own selfish actions.^Nothing selfish about the 5th largest economy in the world refusing to sign up to a Treaty that it could never leave.It would have been completely unacceptable as you well know.
You mean WAS the 5th largest economy in the world.
Jul 13, 2019 -- 2:57PM, brigust1 wrote:
Even Trump told May the deal she had was a bad one and we could have been a laughing stock had we taken it. It was a deal she arranged between herself and her husband she never took anyone with her and she sighed for the backstop. This is a new page.
can't believe TM didn't take seriously the opinion of the guy who told her to sue the EU
politicspunter
13 Jul 19 15:11
Joined: 20 Mar 18
| Topic/replies: 5,514 | Blogger: politicspunter's blog
Jul 13, 2019 -- 3:01PM, InsiderTrader wrote:
politicspunter13 Jul 19 13:50Joined: 20 Mar 18| Topic/replies: 5,512 | Blogger: politicspunter's blogYou are not schooling anyone. You are blind to the mess we have found ourselves in by our own selfish actions.^Nothing selfish about the 5th largest economy in the world refusing to sign up to a Treaty that it could never leave.It would have been completely unacceptable as you well know.
You mean WAS the 5th largest economy in the world.
^
No I don't.
I see you ignore the main point.
Would you sign up for a Treaty we could never leave?
13 Jul 19 15:11
Joined: 20 Mar 18
| Topic/replies: 5,514 | Blogger: politicspunter's blog
Jul 13, 2019 -- 3:01PM, InsiderTrader wrote:
politicspunter13 Jul 19 13:50Joined: 20 Mar 18| Topic/replies: 5,512 | Blogger: politicspunter's blogYou are not schooling anyone. You are blind to the mess we have found ourselves in by our own selfish actions.^Nothing selfish about the 5th largest economy in the world refusing to sign up to a Treaty that it could never leave.It would have been completely unacceptable as you well know.
You mean WAS the 5th largest economy in the world.
^
No I don't.
I see you ignore the main point.
Would you sign up for a Treaty we could never leave?
I wonder why plenty of Conservative MPs voted for it? Perhaps they realised in order to pass the motion they had to accept a compromise?
They thought if they wanted to keep their job as a government minister they have to vote for it.
120 government ministers and 202 MPs (196 Tories) voted for it.
118 Tories voted against it.
So non-Minsters on the Tory side 118 against and 82 for.
I wish you would do your own research rather than come out with the same debunked arguments week after week.
120 government ministers and 202 MPs (196 Tories) voted for it.
118 Tories voted against it.
So non-Minsters on the Tory side 118 against and 82 for.
I wish you would do your own research rather than come out with the same debunked arguments week after week.
I wish you would do your own research rather than come out with the same debunked arguments week after week.
the lack of self awareness here is amazing
the lack of self awareness here is amazing
Jul 13, 2019 -- 6:41PM, InsiderTrader wrote:
They thought if they wanted to keep their job as a government minister they have to vote for it.120 government ministers and 202 MPs (196 Tories) voted for it.118 Tories voted against it. So non-Minsters on the Tory side 118 against and 82 for.I wish you would do your own research rather than come out with the same debunked arguments week after week.
You can't grasp that it is you who is in the vast minority of folks that wish no deal?
edy, i dont think any such negotiations will necessarily start quickly. for starters if uk exporters take the view that with so much uncertainty about customs arrangements, vat collection, etc, then they might not even try to export much after 31 october. hence the anticipated queues at dover may not happen or may be less severe than predicted. i could see the erg goons claiming its all going well, the trope project fear wheeled out ad infinitum. in such a scenario, what with economic data being lagging the full effects may take a while to become fully known.
even if that view is optimistic and things go belly up pretty quickly the recriminations will involve the tory lunatics blaming any thing that goes wrong on the eu so there will be much distrust on each side. even now some are trying to frame it as the eu forcing us to leave without a deal. the plumbs who want us to trade on wto alone will surely complain when the eu treats us it does any other third country that it doesnt have a deal with, as it must under wto.
even if that view is optimistic and things go belly up pretty quickly the recriminations will involve the tory lunatics blaming any thing that goes wrong on the eu so there will be much distrust on each side. even now some are trying to frame it as the eu forcing us to leave without a deal. the plumbs who want us to trade on wto alone will surely complain when the eu treats us it does any other third country that it doesnt have a deal with, as it must under wto.
there isn't currently a deal to vote on
no deal will be stopped
no time for boris unicorn deal to be agreed with eu
which leaves mays deal with a few tweaks a possibility with maybe 30/40 labour mp,s
but any version of mays deal getting through on labour votes means erg dispense with boris ,within days
no deal will be stopped
no time for boris unicorn deal to be agreed with eu
which leaves mays deal with a few tweaks a possibility with maybe 30/40 labour mp,s
but any version of mays deal getting through on labour votes means erg dispense with boris ,within days
how do they stop no deal 1st timer? surely all he has to do is run down the clock if he so desires.
i agree eu may allow some change of wording in the political declaration for him to claim its a different deal but its still not guaranteed to get through.
i agree eu may allow some change of wording in the political declaration for him to claim its a different deal but its still not guaranteed to get through.
Bercow not allowing 2 attempts to stop no deal and tory remainers confident they,ll stop it,tells me Bercow,grieve,letwin have at least one ace up their sleeves,
if all else fails boris will bottle it,boris might want to try no deal under mrs may but not on his watch,all far to much work and decisions to make for him
the goalposts have moved theres a deal around mays deal with labour support,kinnock,nandy,snell etc have already said they want mays deal bringing back,but boris needs a deal supported bu erg who will be propping him up
if all else fails boris will bottle it,boris might want to try no deal under mrs may but not on his watch,all far to much work and decisions to make for him
the goalposts have moved theres a deal around mays deal with labour support,kinnock,nandy,snell etc have already said they want mays deal bringing back,but boris needs a deal supported bu erg who will be propping him up
This country has been taken hostage by the ERG. They won't compromise with anyone. We are heading for an economic catastrophe.
I suspect Boris will make it clear to all his MPs that they either back him or risk losing their seat in an election before Christmas. Should focus a few minds and some in the Labour party who are in the same boat. We shall soon see if it works. In the meantime, I encourage the usual suspects to keep seething, it's most delightful to see, the more foaming the better.
If Rudd is in his cabinet we know we will definitely not be leaving on October 31st with a leavers deal or no deal. Boris will have shown his hand.
Theresa May's successor faces a "very serious reality check" when it comes to Brexit, Ireland's prime minister has warned.
Leo Varadkar also said the backstop - a controversial insurance policy designed to avoid the return of a hard border on the island of Ireland - was still the best compromise.
He also rejected a claim from Boris Johnson, the frontrunner to succeed Mrs May, that the border issue could be sorted out in a transition phase - saying this was "incorrect".
Knowing he runs a country that is a net recipient of EU funds and knowing how much the EU is reliant on the UK contribution there is no limit on what this geezer will do and say to stop Brexit. The Irish border problem is the result.
Leo Varadkar also said the backstop - a controversial insurance policy designed to avoid the return of a hard border on the island of Ireland - was still the best compromise.
He also rejected a claim from Boris Johnson, the frontrunner to succeed Mrs May, that the border issue could be sorted out in a transition phase - saying this was "incorrect".
Knowing he runs a country that is a net recipient of EU funds and knowing how much the EU is reliant on the UK contribution there is no limit on what this geezer will do and say to stop Brexit. The Irish border problem is the result.
politicspunter
13 Jul 19 20:23
Joined: 20 Mar 18
| Topic/replies: 5,519 | Blogger: politicspunter's blog
This country has been taken hostage by the ERG. They won't compromise with anyone. We are heading for an economic catastrophe.
^
Still not done your research and banging the same drum hoping if you type the same thing often enough it will become true.
Do you know anything about the ERG? For instance how did the leader of the ERG vote on MV3?
13 Jul 19 20:23
Joined: 20 Mar 18
| Topic/replies: 5,519 | Blogger: politicspunter's blog
This country has been taken hostage by the ERG. They won't compromise with anyone. We are heading for an economic catastrophe.
^
Still not done your research and banging the same drum hoping if you type the same thing often enough it will become true.
Do you know anything about the ERG? For instance how did the leader of the ERG vote on MV3?
If it's so super unacceptable, as the ERG tried to initially and in bad faith manipulate their sheepish disciples to believe, why did Boris, JRM and Raab suddenly vote 'yes' on MV3?
Sent to me today.
WHY IS NOBODY TALKING ABOUT THE LISBON TREATY, THE TREATY THAT COMES INTO FORCE 2020, ITS WORSE THAN THE SO CALLED DEAL, IF 99% OF THE BRITISH THINK TERESA MAYS DEAL IS BAD, JUST LOOK AT THE LISBON TREATY. PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW, LEAVERS AND REMAIN
..“What will actually happen if we stay in the EU” is a question no remainer will ever answer but here it is warts and all.
Check it out if you wish ——>>
1: The UK along with all existing members of the EU lose their abstention veto in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon Treaty when the system changes to that of majority acceptance with no abstentions or veto’s being allowed.
2: All member nations will become states of the new federal nation of the EU by 2022 as clearly laid out in the Lisbon treaty with no exceptions or veto’s.
3: All member states must adopt the Euro by 2022 and any new member state must do so within 2 years of joining the EU as laid down in the Lisbon treaty.
4: The London stock exchange will move to Frankfurt in 2020 and be integrated into the EU stock exchange resulting in a loss of 200,000 plus jobs in the UK because of the relocation. (This has already been pre-agreed and is only on a holding pattern due to the Brexit negotiations, which if Brexit does happen, the move is fully cancelled - but if not and the UK remains a member it’s full steam ahead for the move.)
5: The EU Parliament and ECJ become supreme over all legislative bodies of the UK.
6: The UK will adopt 100% of whatever the EU Parliament and ECJ lays down without any means of abstention or veto, negating the need for the UK to have the Lords or even the Commons as we know it today.
7: The UK will NOT be able to make its own trade deals.
8: The UK will NOT be able to set its own trade tariffs.
9 The UK will NOT be able to set its own trade quotas.
10: The UK loses control of its fishing rights
11: The UK loses control of its oil and gas rights
12: The UK loses control of its borders and enters the Schengen region by 2022 - as clearly laid down in the Lisbon treaty
13: The UK loses control of its planning legislation
14: The UK loses control of its armed forces including its nuclear deterrent
15: The UK loses full control of its taxation policy
16: The UK loses the ability to create its own laws and to implement them
17: The UK loses its standing in the Commonwealths
18: The UK loses control of any provinces or affiliated nations e.g.: Falklands, Cayman Islands, Gibraltar etc
19: The UK loses control of its judicial system
20: The UK loses control of its international policy
21: The UK loses full control of its national policy
22: The UK loses its right to call itself a nation in its own right.
23: The UK loses control of its space exploration program
24: The UK loses control of its Aviation and Sea lane jurisdiction
25: The UK loses its rebate in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon treaty
26: The UK’s contribution to the EU is set to increase by an average of 1.2bn pa and by 2.3bn pa by 2020
This is the future that the youths of today think we stole from them?
They should be on their knees thanking us for saving them from being turned into Orwellian automatons!
Forget Deals no deals its time for remainers and brexiteers to unite and see what's coming before it is too late. This is the whole reason they are dragging brexit out. So we can get to 2020 then we have no choices anymore.
WHY IS NOBODY TALKING ABOUT THE LISBON TREATY, THE TREATY THAT COMES INTO FORCE 2020, ITS WORSE THAN THE SO CALLED DEAL, IF 99% OF THE BRITISH THINK TERESA MAYS DEAL IS BAD, JUST LOOK AT THE LISBON TREATY. PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW, LEAVERS AND REMAIN
..“What will actually happen if we stay in the EU” is a question no remainer will ever answer but here it is warts and all.
Check it out if you wish ——>>
1: The UK along with all existing members of the EU lose their abstention veto in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon Treaty when the system changes to that of majority acceptance with no abstentions or veto’s being allowed.
2: All member nations will become states of the new federal nation of the EU by 2022 as clearly laid out in the Lisbon treaty with no exceptions or veto’s.
3: All member states must adopt the Euro by 2022 and any new member state must do so within 2 years of joining the EU as laid down in the Lisbon treaty.
4: The London stock exchange will move to Frankfurt in 2020 and be integrated into the EU stock exchange resulting in a loss of 200,000 plus jobs in the UK because of the relocation. (This has already been pre-agreed and is only on a holding pattern due to the Brexit negotiations, which if Brexit does happen, the move is fully cancelled - but if not and the UK remains a member it’s full steam ahead for the move.)
5: The EU Parliament and ECJ become supreme over all legislative bodies of the UK.
6: The UK will adopt 100% of whatever the EU Parliament and ECJ lays down without any means of abstention or veto, negating the need for the UK to have the Lords or even the Commons as we know it today.
7: The UK will NOT be able to make its own trade deals.
8: The UK will NOT be able to set its own trade tariffs.
9 The UK will NOT be able to set its own trade quotas.
10: The UK loses control of its fishing rights
11: The UK loses control of its oil and gas rights
12: The UK loses control of its borders and enters the Schengen region by 2022 - as clearly laid down in the Lisbon treaty
13: The UK loses control of its planning legislation
14: The UK loses control of its armed forces including its nuclear deterrent
15: The UK loses full control of its taxation policy
16: The UK loses the ability to create its own laws and to implement them
17: The UK loses its standing in the Commonwealths
18: The UK loses control of any provinces or affiliated nations e.g.: Falklands, Cayman Islands, Gibraltar etc
19: The UK loses control of its judicial system
20: The UK loses control of its international policy
21: The UK loses full control of its national policy
22: The UK loses its right to call itself a nation in its own right.
23: The UK loses control of its space exploration program
24: The UK loses control of its Aviation and Sea lane jurisdiction
25: The UK loses its rebate in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon treaty
26: The UK’s contribution to the EU is set to increase by an average of 1.2bn pa and by 2.3bn pa by 2020
This is the future that the youths of today think we stole from them?
They should be on their knees thanking us for saving them from being turned into Orwellian automatons!
Forget Deals no deals its time for remainers and brexiteers to unite and see what's coming before it is too late. This is the whole reason they are dragging brexit out. So we can get to 2020 then we have no choices anymore.
uhm...brigust...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Lisbon
https://fullfact.org/europe/viral-list-about-lisbon-treaty-wrong/
have a read
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Lisbon
https://fullfact.org/europe/viral-list-about-lisbon-treaty-wrong/
have a read
looks like that list is the kind of thing your grumpy dad or uncle shares on Facebook when they aren't sharing terrible memes
My grumpy dad would never in his life share such a list full of alternative facts.
rees mogg,boris,davis, even baker and erg only have themselves to blame for their lack of understanding of the backstop
if someone can put back up threads from 2017 on here, the backstop was agreed with very little fanfare and the likes of me and plenty of others on here couldn't believe rees mogg and co wernt on the airwaves within seconds renouncing it as complete no no,instead they had nothing to say went into a bunker for 10 days, I don't even think the erg were speaking as a group at the time
they were either to dim to understand what it meant us loons on here new within seconds or to dim to no mrs may had hoodwinked them
its not a myth the threads are on here from derc 2017 1000,s of posts asking why the ERG are standing for this
if someone can put back up threads from 2017 on here, the backstop was agreed with very little fanfare and the likes of me and plenty of others on here couldn't believe rees mogg and co wernt on the airwaves within seconds renouncing it as complete no no,instead they had nothing to say went into a bunker for 10 days, I don't even think the erg were speaking as a group at the time
they were either to dim to understand what it meant us loons on here new within seconds or to dim to no mrs may had hoodwinked them
its not a myth the threads are on here from derc 2017 1000,s of posts asking why the ERG are standing for this
There won't be any negotiations. If Boris brings a deal to the table it will be May's deal, something he's repeatedly said he won't do, but that's the only deal that will come back.
The idea of the EU buckling doesn't really make sense at any level. Firstly you have to remember this is just the first stages of negotiations, the easy party so to speak, it would set terrible precedent for them to cower at the last. Secondly they aren't blind, they can see the absolute mess in the UK atm, they can see a government on the verge of collapse, there's no guarantee that them giving something won't just be rejected anyway, another terrible precedent. Finally what Edy said is what I've said for a long time anyway that in the event of no deal the UK will be desperate and back to the table in weeks in a weaker position than it is now, again the EU know this.
Boris has boxed himself into a horrible position and isn't even in the job yet.
The idea of the EU buckling doesn't really make sense at any level. Firstly you have to remember this is just the first stages of negotiations, the easy party so to speak, it would set terrible precedent for them to cower at the last. Secondly they aren't blind, they can see the absolute mess in the UK atm, they can see a government on the verge of collapse, there's no guarantee that them giving something won't just be rejected anyway, another terrible precedent. Finally what Edy said is what I've said for a long time anyway that in the event of no deal the UK will be desperate and back to the table in weeks in a weaker position than it is now, again the EU know this.
Boris has boxed himself into a horrible position and isn't even in the job yet.
I remember that 1tp. The funny thing was when agreed in 2017 the likes of the Mail sold the backstop as a great victory for Theresa May, it showed we could do a deal with the EU and that Brexit was going to be great. It just goes to show how much the media really looks into things when the backstop now has in effect become the major sticking point to why Brexit hasn't happened.
Disappointing to see Amber Rudd squirming to be find favour with the new PM.
n88uk
wish someone could find the threads from dec 17 regards backstop and re post them,plenty on here will look that intelligent and well informed as compared to ERG,REES MOGG,DAVIS BORIS AND CO,we may well seconded by the uk government to represent them in talks with junker,
amazing what seemed so obvious at the time to lots on here didn't even register with so called well informed,well educated brexiteers such as rees mogg,baker,ids,boris, in reality their response to backstop in dec 17 should have precluded them from any say in talks since then
wish someone could find the threads from dec 17 regards backstop and re post them,plenty on here will look that intelligent and well informed as compared to ERG,REES MOGG,DAVIS BORIS AND CO,we may well seconded by the uk government to represent them in talks with junker,
amazing what seemed so obvious at the time to lots on here didn't even register with so called well informed,well educated brexiteers such as rees mogg,baker,ids,boris, in reality their response to backstop in dec 17 should have precluded them from any say in talks since then
i see the Lisbon treaty myth is out again. oh dear you think if it was true farage would be waving it in everyone's face
Amber Rudd is feathering her own nest just like some of the former political "friends" of PM May; she wants a top job with the new PM even (probably) Bojo the clown. The MPs that were conniving and kniveing PM May in the back are now jockeying for position for a top job in Cabinet with the new PM eg Rudd, the spinless Hancock (noticed how he bent over backwards to facilitate the Treasury regards fobt), etc. Thank goodness the former Defence Secretary Mr Gavin Williamson has sunk into political oblivion for breaking the "code of silence" regards subject matter discussed at a National Security Council meeting, but that has not stopped him from supporting Bojo as leader of his Party.
The gist of the 'Brexit' deal has not changed a dot, but the people peddling it have; structure and foundation remain, cosmetic and representation/interpretation have - the idealogy of Bojo.
The gist of the 'Brexit' deal has not changed a dot, but the people peddling it have; structure and foundation remain, cosmetic and representation/interpretation have - the idealogy of Bojo.
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