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Ramruma
25 Feb 24 18:05
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Date Joined: 11 Dec 02
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Revealed: the racehorse owner fronting an illegal bookmaker with more than 1,000 customers
https://www.racingpost.com/news/britain/revealed-the-racehorse-owner-fronting-an-illegal-bookmaker-with-more-than-1000-customers-ahIpR9Y7BZWq/

A registered British racehorse owner is a senior figure in an illegal bookmaker that claims to have more than 1,000 customers, including others involved in racing, an undercover investigation has revealed.

Haydon Simcock, a former syndicate manager, said he acted as commercial manager for The Post Bookmakers, an unregulated firm taking bets through the messaging app WhatsApp whose advertising material has been circulating widely through the sport in recent months.

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Replies: 103
By:
Ramruma
When: 25 Feb 24 18:07
Match prices from Paddy Power, Skybet, William Hill or Bet365.
By:
mrcombustible
When: 25 Feb 24 18:12
A registered British racehorse owner is a senior figure in an illegal bookmaker that claims to have more than 1,000 customers, including others involved in racing, an undercover investigation has revealed.

Haydon Simcock, a former syndicate manager, said he acted as commercial manager for The Post Bookmakers, an unregulated firm taking bets through the messaging app WhatsApp whose advertising material has been circulating widely through the sport in recent months.

The BHA is now set to investigate the role of Simcock in The Post Bookmakers, which offers heavy deposit inducements and claims to offer a bespoke service to those who cannot or will not bet with regulated firms, citing affordability checks and account restrictions as key reasons customers choose to bet with them.

Believing he was speaking to a prospective customer, Simcock told an undercover reporter the firm employed ten people, had 1,300 customers and expected a "ridiculously busy" Cheltenham Festival. He recommended the customer deposit "as much as you can" to take advantage of a matched deposit scheme.

Listen to the full conversation
In part one, an undercover reporter for the Racing Post contacts Haydon Simcock, the commercial manager for 'The Post Bookmakers', an unlicensed bookmaker that claims to serve over 1,000 customers in Britain. Posing as a prospective customer, we ask him about their services. In the second part, our undercover reporter confronts Simcock about his involvement as an unlicensed bookmaker

Listen to part one
Listen to part two
Key excerpts: 'People don't want to provide bank statements. We've got so many people betting with us' 


Simcock said: "Let's just say you were putting in £2,000. We double it, so you've got £4,000 to bet with. You'll have a £2,000 cash balance and a £2,000 free bet balance. It's up to you how much you put in but, obviously, with Cheltenham coming up, if it was me, I would be making the best use of it and getting in as much as you can, just so you've got funds ready for Cheltenham.

"We do get ridiculously busy through Cheltenham. We are putting messages out shortly, just to make sure that you've loaded up your accounts ready for Cheltenham. We're offering matched deposits to all our existing customers as well with the festival coming up, just so we're not getting dragged down with people putting money in during the festival when we're really busy. We would rather people load up, have money in your accounts and then you're free to go and do whatever you want."

Simcock added: "A lot of our customers at the moment are owners and trainers and racing managers within horseracing, ultimately because everyone is struggling to get on and people don't want to provide bank statements and affordability checks."

Haydon Simcock: "Everyone is struggling to get on and people don't want to provide bank statements and affordability checks"
Haydon Simcock: "Everyone is struggling to get on and people don't want to provide bank statements and affordability checks"
Racing's leaders and betting industry representatives have repeatedly warned that black market betting activity has risen since bookmakers began implementing affordability checks, which will be debated by MPs in Westminster Hall on Monday after more than 100,000 people signed a position calling on the government to scrap their formal introduction.

The BHA has become increasingly concerned about the financial and integrity threats posed by the black market, with the governing body calculating that for every £10 million of gross betting win that moves outside of the licensed environment, racing loses £1.5m in media rights and £1m in levy funding.

The ease with which prospective customers can reach alternative black market bookmakers and the apparent impunity with which they function is illustrated by the fact Simcock is operating in his role openly and without using an alias, with his name and telephone number carried on the black market bookmaker's advertising material.

The Stoke-based Simcock has owned five horses in Britain since 2018, one registered in his own name and four under the banner of Dark Horse Partnership, a syndicate he fronted that had five winners. Sirius White became the last Dark Horse Partnership runner in January, having won a Chelmsford handicap in November last year. Simcock currently has no horses in training and the firm behind his syndicate was dissolved in 2022.

During the Racing Post's undercover conversation, Simcock said he had worked for The Post for eight months having previously been a punter with an outfit he asserted had been trading since 2017. He also provided reassurance that the firm offered discretion and that punters would have their identities and funds protected.

"We are the same as any other bookmaker, in a sense," he said. "You get your bet on and you get paid. Nobody will know that you're betting with us. We only take ID from you when we're paying you out."

Confirming his own involvement in the sport, Simcock said: "I'm in the racing industry. I've run a syndicate for the past five years and had horses in Newmarket."

According to Simcock, The Post, whose name and logo appear to falsely imply a connection to the Racing Post, offers customers the best odds available from a pool of four major bookmakers – bet365, Paddy Power, Sky Bet or William Hill – and prefers to accept bets via screenshots of online betting slips. This is believed to be the standard practice of WhatsApp layers, some of whom are understood to employ established and seemingly reputable racing figures as agents likely to be trusted by potential customers.


The Racing Post made contact for a second time with Simcock on Thursday, this time using the mobile phone number shown on the Dark Horse Partnership Facebook page. When confronted with questions about his connection to The Post Bookmakers, Simcock this time said he did not "work directly for the business" and asked that inquiries were instead directed towards a man called David he had referred to as The Post's owner during the first telephone call.

"You need to speak to the owner of the business because I'm just a friend of the owner," said Simcock. When it was pointed out he had previously explained he worked as the "commercial manager", a title also given to him on the advertisement seen by the Racing Post, Simcock replied: "Technically, no. Like I say, you would be better speaking to the owner."

He subsequently stated he did not know the owner's surname and at no stage disputed The Post being described as a bookmaker that is not regulated and pays nothing to racing or the exchequer.

"I don't work directly for the business," he then said before acknowledging his name was on the promotional material. "Yeah, that's correct," he said, adding: "You need to speak to David. It's his business. I'm only a friend of David and do little bits for him."

Simcock said he would ask the business owner to make contact with the Racing Post. No such contact has been received. Running an unregulated bookmaker is a crime under the Gambling Act 2005.

Responding to the Racing Post's findings, a BHA spokesperson said: "We would not tolerate anyone who is found to be acting as an illegal betting operator being licensed or registered to take part in our sport. Should any such individual be identified we would look to investigate and take the appropriate action, as well as working with authorities such as the Gambling Commission, who have responsibility for regulation of the gambling industry."

A Gambling Commission spokesperson confirmed The Post is not regulated by the organisation and said: "We don’t comment on specific cases but we always investigate allegations of unlicensed gambling."
By:
Manoleeds
When: 25 Feb 24 18:31
Is that for real? Deposit £2000 and get £2000 in free bets?
By:
stu
When: 25 Feb 24 18:32
what's the difference there's plenty licensed ones around who are basically criminal in their operations...
By:
GEORGE.B
When: 25 Feb 24 18:47
Simcock said: "Let's just say you were putting in £2,000. We double it, so you've got £4,000 to bet with. You'll have a £2,000 cash balance and a £2,000 free bet balance. It's up to you how much you put in but, obviously, with Cheltenham coming up, if it was me, I would be making the best use of it and getting in as much as you can, just so you've got funds ready for Cheltenham.

Where do I send the cheque to?
By:
mrcombustible
When: 25 Feb 24 18:49
Put in 2 get 2. Must be a money laundering operation
Could only happen to Mottershead
By:
GEORGE.B
When: 25 Feb 24 18:50
If something sounds too good to be true...
By:
Tiger Tiger
When: 25 Feb 24 18:51
Try withdrawing and see what happens................
By:
the dealer
When: 25 Feb 24 18:54

Feb 25, 2024 -- 6:50PM, GEORGE.B wrote:


If something sounds too good to be true...


It usually is, Grin

By:
Tiger Tiger
When: 25 Feb 24 18:54
https://www.racingpost.com/news/features/revealed-the-tactics-black-market-bookies-use-to-coax-punters-to-offshore-sites-avZsc8C48sRB/
By:
screaming from beneaththewaves
When: 25 Feb 24 19:17
That's the bit that the Racing Post's report doesn't state, but should: that such an operation could only be a scam. That only the most vulnerable or desperate would be sending money to such an outfit, and that affordability checks are the very thing which sends punters there.

Affordability checks are the best thing to happen for scammers ever.
By:
leif
When: 25 Feb 24 19:18
What's David's surname? David is David

So Haydn, you're listed as commercial manager on the flyer but now you say you're not employed by DavidCrazy

dodgy barstewards
By:
revs
When: 25 Feb 24 19:18

Feb 25, 2024 -- 6:51PM, Tiger Tiger wrote:


Try withdrawing and see what happens................


Applies to most bookmakers now...don't forget the licensed bookies offer worst odds guaranteed and max liability of £5 too.  They shouldn't have licenses, they're some of the biggest criminals out there!

By:
Tiger Tiger
When: 25 Feb 24 19:20
I agree revs, but at least with licensed bookies you will get your money out at some stage, with the black market bookies you simply lose your money.
By:
leif
When: 25 Feb 24 19:23
1,300 customers yet he says they are a small team of 10. That includes 'David' and this simcock chap.

Punters are reuired to take a screen shot of their bet [using Hills,Bet 3s6d, and two others] and then fire that off via whatsapp before the race so that it can be confirmed as being laid.
a handful of people getting mullered with screenshots at Chelters.
If you don't get a confirmed reply , you're not on [presumably if it wins but you'd definitely be on if the mule got stuffedSad
By:
Andriy
When: 25 Feb 24 19:30
So are they just backing it back here on the exchange :-~
By:
impossible123
When: 25 Feb 24 19:35
It seems only the Racing Post finds this shocking. The biggest "illegal" bookmakers are those with "licences" to trade in the UK, and online; they robbed the problem gamblers (regular mega losers) and fobt addicts for over 2 decades with impunity. They also "fleeced" the recreational punters by restricting and closing their accounts and withholding funds from these punters after account closures.
By:
revs
When: 25 Feb 24 19:45

Feb 25, 2024 -- 7:20PM, Tiger Tiger wrote:


I agree revs, but at least with licensed bookies you will get your money out at some stage, with the black market bookies you simply lose your money.


true, there has to be a better way, punters simply want a decent size bet at a competitive price.  The only solution is the exchanges but putting in a sizeable order usually pushes the market against you so you're left nibbling at prices until you're fully matched.  I used to have some serious antepost bets going into the big meetings but its not worth even looking at the prices as they're laughable now.  They want mug punters who gamble at terrible odds.  The game doesn't interest me anymore, they can stick it!

By:
casemoney
When: 25 Feb 24 19:48
We're offering matched deposits to all our existing customers as well

We would rather people load up, have money in your accounts and then you're free to go and do whatever you want

Load up ! Load Up !
By:
steerforth
When: 25 Feb 24 19:52
The only thing missing is the Indian accent.
By:
dave1357
When: 25 Feb 24 20:11
screaming from beneaththewaves • February 25, 2024 7:17 PM GMT

Affordability checks are the best thing to happen for scammers ever.


I made that point in the consultation and I doubt I was alone. It will be interesting to see if they ignore it.
By:
casemoney
When: 25 Feb 24 20:16
Maybe many who are betting with them cannot have a bet on the Exchange or any where for that matter ?
By:
impossible123
When: 25 Feb 24 20:20
Or Nigerian accent. I always say to any unsolicited mobile contract or bank info request from a strong foreign accent individual to pass an English proficiency test prior to calling again. This usually loses their "professional" coolness.

Imagine loading up with £500 (not greedy), and the dodgy firm topping up with another £500 = £1000; chucks the lot on Constitution Hill and the beast wins with Nico waving to the crowd with one hurdle to jump.

Will the dodgy firm pay up, and also facilitate an immediate withdrawal? Replicating this several times the liability will be humongous.

Repeat the above with Lossiemouth or El Fabiola or Sir Gino, etc? It could be a better and quicker return than anything in the City of London.
By:
Rico-Dangleflaps
When: 25 Feb 24 20:36
walofs..

so put 2k in and have 4k on an evens chance...returns 2/1.
By:
racing6699
When: 25 Feb 24 20:37
How do people pay them or get paid?
By:
Rico-Dangleflaps
When: 25 Feb 24 20:38
ned
By:
racing6699
When: 25 Feb 24 20:45
The methodology seems bizarre. Surely you would just say we will lay you show price or sp. Matching best early price of a list of bookies is totally unsustainable and reminds me of that bet broker or bet butler (if I remember name correctly) which went under..
By:
casemoney
When: 25 Feb 24 20:45
Do they lay all bets ?

Or if they cant get rid on here , refuse
By:
racing6699
When: 25 Feb 24 20:47
Casemoney i doubt they could hedge bets in the 1000s on here especially if they offer early prices. I doubt they could even 1 min before race
By:
dave1357
When: 25 Feb 24 20:47
they would be quizzed about source of funds etc here
By:
casemoney
When: 25 Feb 24 20:49
Thats What I was thinking Racing
By:
casemoney
When: 25 Feb 24 20:52
Yes Dave that's True , Didnt think of that

Yes it Looks Like LOAD UP for Cheltenham


Dave and Haydon Load out at at 6 oclock on the Friday
By:
casemoney
When: 25 Feb 24 20:56
We need someone on here who is a Millionaire , Sign up and Stick a oner in , Let us know how they get on

Steve ? Grin
By:
racing6699
When: 25 Feb 24 20:57
Nothing really adds up about their operation imo. It feels very amateur and not real. Considering its a Headline Scoop there are very few details. In fact there is no proof of anything really. I think RP a bit out of comfort zone with investigation pieces….
By:
impossible123
When: 25 Feb 24 21:00
The Racing Post is virtue-signalling. The Racing Post is sensationalising another "bookie" for their paymasters.
By:
racing6699
When: 25 Feb 24 21:05
I dont even know why bookies advertise on rp. They dont want any customers im sure who even dare to click on form
By:
sparrow
When: 25 Feb 24 21:07
How can The Post afford to match customer deposits? Simcock explains and claims the firm has numerous clients within racing

"Listen, we can afford to do it. That's why we do it. A lot of our customers at the moment are owners and trainers and racing managers within horseracing, ultimately because everyone is struggling to get on and people don't want to provide bank statements and affordability checks.

"I know what it's like as well, trying to get a bet on. Obviously I don't bet with The Post. I have to go and use what I can. They are restricting everybody nowadays. It's hard to get on and we are taking them bets. That's why we're busy. We've got so many people betting with us.

"We've been going since 2017. It isn't as if we've just started up and we're not going anywhere any time soon. We are trying to grow the business, although we are a relatively small bookmaker. We've got 1,300 customers and we don't really want to go any further than 1,500, just because of our infrastructure.

"We've got a small team of around ten people, so we can't overload the team. We want to make sure everyone is getting a decent service, so we're capping it at 1,500. I imagine there is going to be quite a big influx of players coming in before the festival, with our matched deposit, but we are going to cap it, so we've time for everybody and everybody can get a decent service."
By:
Rico-Dangleflaps
When: 25 Feb 24 21:19
i can understand deposit 5k and you have 10 to bet with..ie 5k on credit..impossible to match 5k with a free 5k.
By:
mrcombustible
When: 25 Feb 24 21:43
Simcock's company Dark Horse Racing Racing Partnership was struck off 17 months after incorporation. He never filed a set of accounts

https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/13015253/filing-history


19 Apr 2022    Final Gazette dissolved via compulsory strike-off   
View PDF Final Gazette dissolved via compulsory strike-off - link opens in a new window - 1 page(1 page)
01 Feb 2022    First Gazette notice for compulsory strike-off   
View PDF First Gazette notice for compulsory strike-off - link opens in a new window - 1 page(1 page)
13 Nov 2020    Incorporation
Statement of capital on 2020-11-13
GBP 1




This article is very short on detail. Poor journalism
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