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Has Channel 4 killed racing?
Has Channel 4 killed racing?
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Replies: 75
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...I am sure you have been "jousting" with yourself most of your life homefortea.......
 enjoy it. |
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- And now we have Mick talking with the winner of the X race, Mick ?
- "I certainly aaaam" you definitely are yea oh boy you are we can see you on tele, you certainly are :-)) - And now our very own Mick Fitz interviewing the winning trainer - "I certainly am... "  |
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charisma long gone, ch4 6 seconds behind ruk in running.
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hft
I hope so but the viewing figures will drop even more in the years to come when the older traditional horse racing enthusiasts go to meet The Great Bookie in the sky with their Saturday lucky 15's etc with the younger ones either not bothered and not coming through or more interested in football betting and Geoff Stelling and Sky Sports. More people watched Come Dine With Me on a Monday afternoon than The Derby this year with another 28 programmes on Ch4 alone beating it's viewing figures. There were about seven presenters on this week with about .7m watching them, Pasport To Pimlico from 1949 would pull in at least double that and cost Thripence to put on.. |
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In current and ever lasting depression that we now live in , I believe those with less, get not much out of watching those with more parade their wares, the climate of aspiration is no more, and the powers do not realize it. Can't afford it ignore it.
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That ever so polite fella fella fella chappie if they don't put racing on they will put some numpty minority sport on like basket weaving. Probably more excitement about it that the racing which you must admit you can only watch on mute. Claire has jumped and can you honestly see this lot retaining the contract. If Sunset and V can lose it so can these. Somebody always wants to make a few quid and has got a new angle. Viewing figures no matter what spin or how you manipulate are shocking.
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Certainly, the problem with racing is much greater than just C4 coverage. Society has changed. Racing itself is not really popular. The drivel doesn't help but, more importantly, nor do the results.
We had days of success for frankie and the rich arabs. We had days of sentimental stuff about jockeys and trainers - most of whom didn't figure much in the important results. I loved the game - bad as it is - for decades, yet I can hardly raise any enthusiasm for what we get nowadays. Who the fk does it appeal to now? My guess is rich, pretentious, holiday-makers. Does this make good television? I don't know, but I doubt it. |
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Hi sean rua, you and me both love racing, but I detest the bollox that they talk about greatness of jockeys etc, that kind of bullshit is so dated, you might be the most talented trainer jockey etc, but if the pharaohs don't put horses in ya stable you are not going very far, everyone understands this , why try too create the artificial lie of talent??? so many families in the game control the jockeys, you are disadvantage outside of this inbred circle. People in work are currently having too work 50 -60 hours just too pay the bills,(who is not at work who can turn on?), 24 hour greed is killing every trade,and the greed of the power companies and bankers is obvious to all. I continue from habit a big enthusiast but I understand the sentiment of the many.
Sunday racing a must for viewing figures(less work on sundays), but what do you expect of greedy feckers that can't add up or keep a honest balance sheet? |
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If your soap box ever breaks Metro I`ve got an old bookie`s crate you can have.
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Can anyone tell me why we're all supposed to care whether racing is popular or not - it will still happen just as it does now whether it's on C4 or not.
The only people that should worry are the legions of gravy slurpers and the bookmakers, which is why it's always presented to us as so vitally important. The truth is, if racing did lose its profile, the sport, and the woeful media that exploit it, would have to start working a lot harder to meet the needs of those who actually do want to follow racing, instead of seeking to exploit and deceive us at every possible turn. The idea that somehow we're all in this together is an absolute nonsense, imo - less gravy would be great news for all punters... |
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@millhouse -- Can anyone tell me why we're all supposed to care whether racing is popular or not - it will still happen just as it does now whether it's on C4 or not.
No it wouldn't -- though it might stagger on for a few years. If racing fell off the telly, a funding crisis would develop and spin out of control. Sponsors would leave the game because they can't get their names on telly. Newspapers would reduce their coverage because their readers could not watch, and perhaps stop it all together. More sponsors would leave the game because they can't get their names in the paper. Prize money would drop so there'd be fewer owners. Racing is paid for by punters, racegoers, owners and sponsors. Sponsors in particular have an ulterior motive. |
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I have to say I have never felt exploited or deceived in my years involved with racing or gambling for that matter.
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think ramruna is 100% right
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ramruma*
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Ramruma, the sport would continue on because we will still be betting on it - but suddenly our business will actually be valued.
The problem for us, as consumers, is that racing, and the media that surround it, is so bloated with bookmaking industry money currently, that those who are supposed to be providing a service in return for our business have come to the conclusion that, actually, they might just as well permanently give us the finger, imho... |
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Some very interesting points made by all. Thank you.
Metro: Your point of view is spot on as far as the traditional working class punters are/were concerned. Maybe the racing game is mirroring the decline of the traditional working class. These media bosses are flush with money and pretty intelligent ( I guess), so I'm sure they've done their research and found a target "audience" who will enjoy and pay for the drivel and nonsense thrown at them. Obviously, bc I'm old I can never look at things through their eyes. However, 'tis not just an age thing: some of the pillocks ( my impression) they chat to about things - fashion, champagne, strawberries, stable cats and dogs, look every bit as old as myself!  Millhouse: Having been interested in flapping, ck fighting, and various other " underground" gambling activities, I would have to agree that horseracing in some shape or form will likely continue, come what may. However, I doubt it would be the multi-million £ type of showbizz and legal gambling industry it is now, should the decline go on. Some of the richest owners - who, depressingly for me, seem to mop up all the top prizes, would probably be content with a private match race at dawn. If we go back to that, I feel a lot would be lost. Feltfair: Fair play to ye, but I cn honestly say that I have often felt "deceived" by the racing game, and, sometimes a bit "exploited" by the tracks. Ramruma: Ye may well be correct for all I know. |
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Isn't the 'racing will die without TV' argument somewhat undermined by the French and US experience?
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the anorak........whats the racing coverage like in those 2 countries??
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i assume pay per view channels??
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I don't care who presents the racing, I don't care about the content of the programme outside of the actual race itself and I don't care which channel covers it. Just so long as it remains on TV. I don't like to be bombarded with the thoughts of pundits, so I dismiss ANYTHING any of the guessers have to offer. Egner posted earlier regarding the benefits attached to "losing", being MORE of a concern within the sport. I cannot disagree with his comments. There will always be those amongst us who will persevere trying to suss out the plotters. Trouble is nowadays, MOST involved in producing a horse to run in a race fall into that bracket. I love the sport , as most on here do, but during the course of ANY day there will be cheats prospering at the expense of the ordinary punter. Good luck today, all of you. I hope your fare as well as the form book and your expertise at reading it suggests. I very much doubt that will be the case though.
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Cardiff,
Pretty much non existent on anything other than Equidia in France and that's effectively a French RUK. In the States as far I'm aware, the only coverage on the main national channels (ABC, CBS, NBC) is the Triple Crown and the Breeders Cup. Certainly neither has a weekly 2hr+ show devoted solely to live racing, let alone any similar midweek programs. Horse racing existed and thrived in this country long before television, sponsorship, the Levy or betting shops existed. Point to point racing does so to this day without three of those elements, but still attracts sponsors. |
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perhaps we need to go back to the days of the itv 7 with someone like john rickman - cover the races only with 1 person to front the programme & you immediately get rid of all the hangers on & all the peripheral nonsense - no need to have 24 hours tv which is merely a cyclical repeat of the days action - sponsors will still pay to have their names advertised for the big "races" and perhaps we should try to encourage attendance at racing during the week - significantly reduced prices and proper betting on course - if there are healthy crowds other than Saturdays then sponsors will still be interested in promoting their product
with all the wages being paid to the "support" acts how much profit actually goes back into racing - I would have thought it is severely diminished |
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Passport to Pimlico ( Lambeth Walk ) along with The Lavender Hill Mob ( City of London & Notting Hill ) are two of the best films produced by Ealing if only for the fantastic scenes of London in the early 1950s. Always worth watching IMO.
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Royal Ascot was less popular than tennis at Queens how sad is that.
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The idea that the people working in front of the camera constitute a significant percentage of the overall running costs for a channel like RUK seems to widely held. But from my own, admittedly brief, experience of working on one of the predecessor channels in 2002/3, for every person you see on screen there are at least five times more back stage.
Even working in a studio with fixed cameras (i.e no cameraman), there was a producer, director, VT operators to create and show replays, slow motion etc, caption writers to do results, shows and keep all that updated, website writers, engineers and secretarial staff to support all of them. And they were all full time employees, with all that means in terms of the extra costs of payroll, National Insurance, holidays, sick pay, pensions etc. And although I can't claim to know the details, by far the largest cost for all the channels is the payment to the satellite company that transmits the pictures, plus the payments to the picture providers on the racecourse. |
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the anorak........when you watch a tv series or a film..........watch at the end for the credits.........its unbelievable.....never knew it took that many people to make them
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@cardifffc if you're surprised by that.. then you'll be shocked to find out that the top hollywood actors have between 30 to 100 people working for them, they all split the cheque that the actor gets for playing in a movie.
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Kpf.
You forgot "The Lady Killers". Some cracking shots of Londons roads and railways. Not sure what the train station is though. |
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TheAnorak
The staff you list are an essential requirement for the broadcast (and add-ons). I believe most peoples' criticism would be that the numerous presenters are superfluous. You could get rid of half of them, and it would enhance the package. The betting ring became redundant 10 years ago. They still persist in having a presenter reporting (usually stuttering) from the empty betting ring. They still try to pretend that on course money influences the market. It's a bleeding waste of time. Clearly, a terrestrial broadcast needs a different type of production to a specialist channel. I've nothing against Mick Fitzgerald personally, however the man has a PhD in stating the bleeding obvious and only adds irritation to the show. He is medically incapable of offering an opinion that could turn out to be wrong. I actually feel like he has no genuine enthusiasm for the sport. He found a niche, and found that he can bluff his way through with nobody who counts seemingly noticing. Where C4 is concerned, the dumbing down makes it near impossible for true horse racing fans to watch. The viewing figures appear to indicate that only true horse racing fans are watching. |
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Amphora,
The railway scenes in The Ladykillers were filmed at St Pancras. One other London based film of that era actually ends with a chase scene staged at a packed White City stadium during a greyhound meeting. That was 'The Blue Lamp' which featured the first appearance of PC George Dixon, who is shot and killed early in the film by a young gangster played by Dirk Bogarde. Dixon was later reincarnated as the lead of a long running BBC TV series. There's also a very good car chase in the film round the deserted streets of Shepherds Bush. They don't call me The Anorak for nothing! |
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Jimmy Hanley was in that film too.
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Like Sean Rua I have a job to work up much enthusiasm for racing these days.
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If they want viewing figures up, put the good racing on a Sunday, move the morning line too Sunday about 10ish and they will go up.???
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Light years behind the Irish we are?
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no charisma.
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Some more good points and a nice bit of reminiscing!
 Thats part of the trouble - several of us are old bggrs and naturally feel that things were better when we were in our prime. However, I still maintain that the racing game itself - with the all-important results - is a major negative in today's modern society. This may not apply to those intent mostly on "socialing" ( getting drassed up, p d up and scoffing their faces etc), or even to some young geek from Dubai university, but, for silly old lags like myself, results like this years Oaks, or, those recently from Frankie's Goodwood don't really inspire. I spent enough time going to "twilight meetings of bandit racing" at places like Wolver and Southwell to know the score re the "form" book, but, nowadays the product is about as convincing as the old Dale Martin Promotions of wrestling. Boxing has already gone down that same road , imo. The day I saw Cassius Clay rolling about in a Japanese wrestling ring, I knew my understanding of things was way behind the times. Now I've started to feel the same way about horse-racing.  Btw, I don't think it helps to scapegoat the tv presenters per se; they are there for a purpose, and, like jockeys and trainers, 'tis NOT to please me. Why would they? |