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These 2556 comments are related to the topic:
old time jockeys ...
old time jockeys ...
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That Catterick meeting mentioned above was the first National Hunt meeting that I went to. I've never been so cold. I think JFK was ridden by a young Brian Fletcher, he was just beginning to make a name for himself and was claiming 5lb or 7lb at the time. The following year he won the National.
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Whitwhitlaw. once again many thanks for the Ayrshire story i always wondered.
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The first National Hunt meeting i went to was at Sandown on
saturday 10th march 1979,i had wondered what it was like to watch horses jump and fall whilst standing by a fence. I stood by the open ditch in front of the stands(next to the last). I had backed Straightjacket ridden by Paul Leach in the first race ,the beech open novice chase, As they jumped it for the first time,the first time i'd seen a horse jump in the flesh, there was a crash and lots of shouting,amongst the legs and hooves i saw a jockey hit the deck and roll along the floor, you've guessed it,Paul Leech,spat out the mud,got up covered in grass staines and walked away,i never moaned,i was in awe at the courage of the man, and i've been in awe ever since.. |
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reculver
Saturday 10th March at Sandown, sounds like Imperial Cup Day. What won it ? |
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Flying Diplomat, i had 2 pounds at 5-1, paid for my day at the time.i remember standing by the final flight with my mates when a horse who was tailed off tried to refuse and the jockey screamed ''Go on you cn ut'', that jockey was R.Cochrane claiming 4lb.
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I tend to forget that Ray Cochrane was a hurdles jockey before he was a flat jockey. As for Flying Diplomat, the best horse Beverley trainer Alf Smith ever had. I saw it win a flat maiden as a 5-y-o up north somewhere, Brian Henry was Alf's jockey at the time, although winners were few and far between. When FD went hurdling it was a revelation giving Alf his biggest success ever in the Imperial. Did Alan Dickman ride it at Sandown ?
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^ Life will be very different and busy for agent Ray Cochrane next year with Dettori going freelance.
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Paulbu, i think Tim Thompson Jones rode it.
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Yes, he did, first ride for the stable, Alan Dickman rode most of Alf's but not that day. Thanks.
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Couple of clips on RP (Bobby) Elliot from 2003.Top jockey in his day..does anybody know if he's still involved with racing.
POPULAR ex-Flat jockey Bobby Elliott is switching Middleham for Merseyside to become a trainer at a purpose built complex in Formby. The 62-year- old has resigned from his role as assistant at the powerful Mark Johnston establishment and expects to begin his new career in a matter of weeks. ``This offer came out of the blue. I was approached by a backer and it's an opportunity I couldn't refuse,''he said. ``I know a lot of people would be considering retirement at my age, but I don't do that --I just keep going.'' Elliott, a former champion apprentice, won over 1,000 races during his career and was retained by the Queen as her lightweight jockey. He retired from the saddle nine years ago. He is no stranger to the training side of the sport having enjoyed a spell training in Florida during the early 1980s. And as a partner in new business South Moss Racing, he will operate from a 30-box stable owned by main backer Peter Grayson, who has horses with Liverpool-born Ann Duffield. During his early years as an apprentice,Elliott rode for Lewes-based Tom Masson and was described as ``a boy in a million - 99lbs of sheer horse riding genius''. Byline: Roy Briggs Name: Bobby Elliott Age: 62 Stables: South Moss Stud, Pasture Lane, Formby, Merseyside Background: Served his time with Tom Masson at Lewes and was a dual champion apprentice; was retained by The Queen as her lightweight jockey and rode more than 1,000 winners worldwide; spent last nine years assisting Mark Johnston Targets: "Just to train winners" FORMER Royal jockey Bobby Elliott, 62, embarks on a new career today when he saddles Wendy's Girl in the opening race at Pontefract - his first runner since being granted a Flat trainers' licence by the Jockey Club, writes Roy Briggs. Elliott, a key figure in Mark Johnston's successful Middleham yard after quitting the saddle nine years ago, is operating from a new, purpose-built training base at Formby, Merseyside, owned by his main backer Peter Grayson. He said yesterday: "I'm starting up from scratch with just five horses at present and possibly a further five coming in next week. "Wendy's Girl has already been placed and I hope she'll run very well. "I've always wanted to have a serious crack at training and I'm grateful to get the chance." If Wendy's Girl beats her 16 rivals in tonight's Sycamore Maiden Auction Stakes, it won't be Elliott's first winner, as 20 years ago he enjoyed a brief spell training in Florida and saddled Hexgreave Star to win four races. COPYRIGHT 2003 MGN |
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R P appropriately rode the last ever winner at Lewes before it closed.
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TMan, good read on Bobby Elliott (also the drummer with the Hollies). He came to Middleham around 1982 after not riding in the UK since the mid 70s, and had many rides for Squeak Fairhurst over a few seasons, although winners were few and far between.
RPE never really hit the big time, and if he rode over 1000 winners as your article says, then around 600 of them weren't in this country. |
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Bobby Elliot. I knew Bobby Elliot when he worked for Tom Masson at Lewes in the sixties. Remember Tom Masson Had a horse of the Queens, Flashy chestnut White blaze four white socks,decent stayer cant remember its name. It used to walk on its hind legs from the stables up to the Downs, Bobby Elliot was the only one brave enough to ride it. the story went that they used to virtually strap him on,dont know the truth of that ,a risky thing to do with it rearing all the time in case it came back on top of you.Tom Masson had something to do with the circus years before ,so you never know,He used to get all Boyd Rochfort horses that they couldnt do anything with ,and there were plenty of those around at that time. Didnt cross paths with Bobby much ,as i was based in the north most of the time. One occasion i did when he rode one of Harry Wraggs in the old "Dockers Derby" run at Manchester in June. Must have been around 1962 ,He rode a horse called Tuning Fork as i said trained by Harry Wragg beat our horse Johns Kent trained by Frank Carr ridden by Lester Piggott ,beat us about 1/2 length,cost us plenty.
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A few of my mates paid peanuts for a horse that turned out to be quite useful. Eary 80's I think, It was trained by Ron Thompson in Donny ans Bobby Elliott was the stable jockey at the time. He was geting on a bit by then.
It got beat in one race, the owners wanted RP jocked off and Ron wouldn't hear of it, which was loyal of him. They ended up selling it abroad for a lot of money. Been wracking my brain to get the name of the horse. I'll post it if I remember. |
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Looking at 1969 Bobby had 29 wins while at Derek Candy's in Newbury....that year Greville only had 30.
I guess nobody at the Sporting Chronicle proof read the Formbook..it shows Geoff Lewis with a strike rate of 32% 146/618. Thought it seemed a lot..should be 23%. I don't think he was at Formby with Peter Grayson for long just wondered what he was doing now ..prob. retired. |
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Here's Bobby winning the'60 Hunt Cup on Small Slam......bit of a jerky video for me.
http://www.britishpathe.com/video/royal-ascot-15/query/Piggott |
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Collywobble, Ronald Thompson wouldn't have a word said against Bobby Elliott. One season, around 1986, the stable had 100 runners and Elliott rode 97 of them. There was much confusion in those days, there was Ronald Thompson at Doncaster, there was Ron Thompson who trained at Grantham. Ron Thompson's jockey was Paul Bradwell, remember him ?
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Collywobble, Improvise only cost 300gns and won 2 races for Ronald Thompson.
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No wasn't that one paulbu, it's doing my head in trying to remember.
I know things got a bit nasty, but Ron stood his ground. He was part of the syndicate, they fell out big time and the horse was sold as I said. |
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R P Elliott – The first five years…According to Cope.
1957 - Registered as an apprentice to Tom Masson – Weight 5st 7lbs 1958 – Still with Masson – weight “shot up” to 6st 7lbs. Rode first winner (at Lewes) on the 18th August, and then rode three more winners in the next eight days. “The remarkable thing about this first quartet of winners was that they were all gained against experienced jockeys and over distances from 10 furlongs up to 2 miles. His master Tom Masson had tutored him well in the difficult art of riding a waiting race, and this youngster combines plenty of sound common sense with his undoubted riding ability” 1959 – Still with Masson, still 6st 7lbs. Champion Apprentice with 27 winners. Won the Wokingham and very nearly won the Cambridgeshire. His father (a Newspaper compositor on a London daily) moves the family to a small village in Sussex (Wivelsfield Green) to give the “boy” nice home surroundings and to move him closer to Lewes. Bobby makes the journey to the stables by motorbike and is “always punctual” (Tom Masson) 1960 - 7st and still with Masson. HM the Queen has only two winners this season and Bobby rode both of them. So Masson did twice for her Majesty something that neither Boyd-Rochfort nor Murless could achieve that season. Rode 39 winners (one more than Duncan Keith), including the Royal Hunt Cup. Lost his claim but still an “apprentice” 1961 – Runner up to Brian Lee as top apprentice with 35 winners. “The season was little more than a month old when Bobby put up one of the most remarkable displays of horsemanship of the year. He was riding Naratious Lad for the 1m 7f Burlington Handicap at Hurst Park when one of his irons broke before he had covered a furlong. Undaunted, Bobby kicked the other foot free and rode the rest of the way without stirrups. Yet even on this sharp track he was still able to keep full control of his mount and hold him in a handy position until making a final effort which landed him the winner by a length and a half. It was a performance which very few jockeys could have equalled” “As soon as the season was over Bobby set off for the Argentine where he rode during the early part of the winter to gain further experience” He completes his apprenticeship on 20th March 1962, his 21st birthday. “I am pleased to say that he will remain attached to my stable” – Tom Masson |
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The Cope publication appears to be very detailed. Three older southern based jockeys who I saw ride at the smaller Yorkshire tracks just before they retired around 1970 were D (Sparks) Richardson, R (Snowy) Fawdon and Stan Clayton. Any info on these ?
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Here's a good Pathe video of Sea Bird's Derby...well worth a look.
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http://www.britishpathe.com/search/query/epsom+derby+sea+bird
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The horses ridden by R P Elliott for R Thompson in the early eighties include...Big Smile, Inishpour, Grey Coral, Penryn Boy, Helen Boy, Lucky Starkist, Lucky Sarah, Team Effort, Senor Ramos, Danum Lad, Today Eddy, Arday Wednesday, Lindon, Our Ginger and Ribobelle.
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Paulbu. Regarding your "where are they now", David "sparks" Richardson to my knowledge was apprenticed over here but then went over to Germany where he had a long and successful career as a jockey and then I believe as a trainer. His nickname came from the fact he was from Flint in Wales.
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forgotmyusername, that explains a lot, thanks. I was at Catterick, early season, late 60s, when I noticed this oldish jockey whose face I didn't recognise going down on this 2-y-o favourite, small stable down Epsom way. D Richardson said the rider's board, 'never heard of him', I thought. Anyway, he won the race.
Another similar instance around the same time was at Redcar in the 'Zetland'. The Queen's Castle Yard was in the race up from Newmarket and again I didn't recognise the oldish jockey. S Smith was his name and I've never heard of him before or since. Again he won the race so if you see a horse ridden by an old jockey who you don't recognise, BACK IT!! |
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Paulbu - The 1959 Cope's has a little profile of Stanley Clayton (S T Clayton)
"One of Britain's "quiet" jockeys who likes to sit still and let their horses do much of the work, a style particularly suited to two year olds. The son of a Yorkshire farmer, he was born at Belton (nr Doncaster) in 1926. He rode show ponies as a boy and at the age of 14 was apprenticed to the late Willie Smallwood at Swinton, nr Rotherham. He rode his first winner Yorkist at Pontefract in April 1943. Biggest success as an apprentice was on Wragby, owned by Major Lionel B Holliday in the Apprentices Championship Cup at Thirsk in 1946. Invited to ride as first jockey for Major Holliday , he won the Oaks on Neasham Belle in 1951. The Holliday/Clayton partnership ended amicably at the end of 1953 but was resumed with marked success last year (1958) when Major Holliday won 27 races worth £41265, and Stanley wound up with 60 winners". Not sure exactly when he retired, but he seems to have ridden throughout the sixties. Apart from the Oaks, he won the Goodwood Cup twice, the Ribblesdale, The Yorkshire Oaks and several big handicaps and 2 year old races. He rode winners for Winston Churchill and the Queen in addition to Major Holliday. I will take a look at the other as soon as I have time. |
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What great little books those Copes books were. Were they sent out to anyone who had an account with Copes? I don't know whether their comments on jockeys were accurate, but I think its great that someone took the trouble to give an opinion on their style and merits, as well as the brief bio. I came across the books as a kid when I went to my aunt's on Saturday afternoons when I was about 10. She used to give my a threepenny bit(!) for polishing her bits of brass (doorknobs, plates) that she bought from secondhand stalls in the Caledonian Market in Deptford. She and her husband had betting accounts as far back as I can remember. When I was a kid, their accounts were with Hills, but before that (presumably) with Copes. I remember the books also had a cartoon with The Tout(?) who supposedly was watching the classic candidates on the gallops.
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Great work blackbarn.
Found a bit on Snowy on his death in 2002....these pieces often don't do justice to the subject whose achievements have faded into the mists of time. SNOWY FAWDON, the former jockey who won the 1953 Ebor Handicap on Norooz, has died in hospital at Newmarket at the age of 90. Having started in racing at the age of 14, he achieved most of his success after the age of 40 and did not retire from the saddle until his late 50s. Christened Richard but always known as Snowy, he was born on Teesside in July 1911, the son of a shipyard worker whose brother was a trainer in South Africa. He started his apprenticeship with Fred Archer (nephew of the great jockey) in Newmarket and his first winner was Haputale at Yarmouth in September 1927. On Archer's death the following year Fawdon's indentures were transferred to Harvey Leader, but in 1932 he joined his uncle Alf in South Africa and rode in that country, Denmark and India for several years. On his return he found it difficult to re-establish himself and rode under Pony Turf Club Rules at Northolt Park; it was not until after the war that his career took off in earnest. Norooz, trained by Marcus Marsh for the Aga Khan, was his most notable winner. Others included the sprint handicapper Denikin, Oleandrin, Stavros Niarchos's first winner in Britain and third in the 2,000 Guineas, True Cavalier, who won the Craven Stakes and Lingfield Derby Trial, and Father Thames, who the Great Metropolitan Handicap. Fawdon had his best season numerically at the age of 48 with 34 wins in 1959, and gained his last four victories in 1968, the year before he retired. The funeral will be on June 24 at St Agnes Church, Bury Road, Newmarket at 2pm. There will be a private cremation for family only. No flowers are requested but donations for the Rosemary Ward at Newmarket Hospital should be sent to Southgates, Duchess Drive, Newmarket CB8 9HD. COPYRIGHT 2002 MGN LTD |
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Blackbarn, T Man, ten out of ten, re Snowy Fawdon and Stan Clayton, Redcar Saturday September 20th 1969, (meeting sponsored by Contour panti-hose and stockings), Snowy had one ride for Peter Evans, he will have been 58 years old and that must have been just about his last ride. Stan had two rides, one for Bruce Hobbs and one for Walter Wharton and again he can't have had too many more rides as he also retired at the end of that season. The fact that rookie trainer Guy Harwood won the seller that day shows just how far we are going back.
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Was reading in a Copes a while back that Kenny Glover was born in Peterborough went to Harry Storey's yard weighing 3st.10lbs.
They had to get the Stewards permission for the trainer to unsaddle the horse and carry the tack back to the weighing room. He went to Avril Vasey's yard soon after....Avril thought highly of him but he never really made it big. |
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Ged, I agree about the Cope's books. Re The Tout, his real name was Peter Ronald Buchanan and he was a brilliant caricaturist (witty but quite kind). His watercolours make thousands - I have several of his prints on my study wall. My favourite is the Duke of Richmond, obviously failing manfully to hand crank start his yellow and red roller. The only thing he seemed really exaggerate was size - in one of my prints trainer George Lambton looks about the size of a good lunch for his owner Lord Derby. Another is of the Hon. Mrs Violet Mundy who looks as though she might have been tough to train for.
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TMan, by the mid 60s,if Kenny Glover had a ride then the racecourse jockey board man had to chalk his name up. As for Harry Storey, he trained once at Horton in Ribblesdale. Heaven knows how you could gallop horses over terrain like that. You seem to have an interest in little trainers from the West Riding of Yorkshire. Although just over the border in Lancashire, trainer W Carr had a small string at Bromley Cross and he had a horse called The Country Lane. The horse ran twice in 1969 and twice in 1970 and won on each outing and always by a bus ride landing big bets on a couple of occasions under Brig Robson. Another of his was Spavintoso.
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Regarding billy carr and the country lane,he trained quite near me,after the horse had won at ayr,breaking the course record he entered it for the ayr gold cup and backed it at fancy prices,unfortunately the horse slipped in the yard and dislocated a hip,he then bred from it from his retirement in 1970 up to his death in 1975.
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By the way,that ayr race in september 1969, his instructions to the jockey [Denis Mckay] "Dont fall off!
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Paul
I'd forgotten all about Willie Carr...I see from this he trained Anlaby Bug too which I remember well.Hi Forties. Billy Carr, who trained at Bromley Cross, near Bolton, for many years. The Anorak says: Billy (or Willie) Carr enjoyed his biggest success early in his career, in a war-time substitute November Handicap in 1942 with Golden Boy, a gelding whom he also bred and owned. The race was transferred from Manchester to Pontefract, and Golden Boy defied a 14lb penalty. Carr, who was no relation to jockey Harry Carr, had only a small string and was never a fashionable trainer, but his later winners included Flatford Mill and Anlaby Bug. He retired in 1970 and died in 1975, aged 71. |
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fortieschild, sound instructions to Denis McKay, if you ask me. The Country Lane was a bit of a nutter and little Denis at six stone odd will have found it a handful. As it happens, the horse won by a long looking 8 lengths over 6f. I saw it run at a night meeting at Ripon in 1970, the horse had to be mounted on the course on the way to the start and in the race itself, the horse hung so badly that even a strong pilot like Brig Robson had trouble steering it round the bend after the finish. It doesn't surprise me that it finally came to grief and The Country Lane is a horse that I will never forget.
TMan, I remember Anlaby Bug also, I didn't know who trained it though. |
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Heres an interesting stat,billy carrs last ever runner was a winner,spavintoso ridden by pat eddery at nottingham on oct 26th.billy had had a stroke earlier that year and decided to retire.
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Thanks to WHITWHITLAW, the Ron Thompson horse I was trying to remember was Team Effort. Won or ran well in some good 2yo old races then went abroad.
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