Was the rider stood down for this TH??

You can hardly ever eliminate all offences, but you can punish more severely, the people who go that far

Headmaster. Bet you wail into the naughty boys when breeches are down with a lot more vigour than Buick.

Agree, zil, but I firmly lay this at the foot of the jockeys.  900 breaches, horses marked and cut....a massive culture change had to happen and it's like a bomb's gone off in the weighing room...probably the only way to do it to be fair.  Bloody mess though, isn't it?

I can't stand that firm, watchit....but the facts don't lie and they've got their's right for once. 

I'm not anti-whip....I don't completeley go along with the new rules as they stand either....but I can't stomach racing fans trotting out these tired old cliches like they're the experts.  It doesn't hurt?  FFS do me a favour!

900 breaches, now how does that compare with the previous regime, all im saying, at the top end of those offences there should have been more severe penalties.

If there are now MORE offences, as there would be if we carried on the way we are then the authorities could say, we need less strokes and so on.

If you made the drink driving limit zero then you would catch MORE people, even ones that ate something in a wine sauce or took certain Medicines. Doesnt make it right though

We will see how the stones fall, but imo the 8 on jumps in unworkable and may mean the end of NH racing in the Uk

Things will change with the rules otherwise the formbook can be thrown out of the window whats going to happen soft heavy ground 2 and a half 3 mile plus chases its going to produce bollocks racing some horses need geeing up 3 or 4 winders before they really get on the final circuit it has to change.

The Trainers should turn up with about 300 Lazy animals and ask the RSPCA to home em all.....

David Muir, equine advisor for the RSPCA, said he accepts the whips currently in use do not hurt the animals with correct and reasonable use


Take it up with him Headmaster, i'm sure he will be sympathetic to you and Animal Aid.

And i will do you a favour, before you go slating "racing fans" on here, please note "correct and reasonable use"

Apathy is king in the uk,everyone waiting for someone else to do something,because they fear there own thoughts and actions,and have no concept of reality.

What a pompous eejit you are. When you go to your study and think of replies, email David Muir with your concerns. Its all about "perception" after all...

Headmaster, Mark Johnston, Vet, was on this morning saying there is not a welfare issue with racehorses and whips.

By now every organisation standing has declared in public about the whip so what exactly are you on about?

By using immotive language like marked and cut you are just grossly exaggerating to try to prove your point.
A bit like afriend of mine who is for the return of the death penalty, something I am firmly against. His argument is 'what if someone raped and murdered your wife and daughter'. That is exactly what you are doing. Simply because, supposedly, someone marked a horse the whole industry should capitulate. Get real ffs.

As a headmaster you should know one paedophile does not implicate every teacher.

And to lay this at the door of the jockeys is naive in the extreme. If you listened to any of the interviews, including from the BHA, the jockeys were conned into this agreement. This lays directly at the door of the BHA.

They should remove all of the rules and start again.

a) No limit to whip use by number. (Removing any excuse for a jockey not trying sufficiently and because no 2 jockeys hit either in the same place or with the same intensity).

b) Stewards to be trained in recognise abuse of the whip.

c) Very stringent penalties for transgressors including oss of licence.

How difficult is that?

That Roly Poly guy is the chairman of "World Horse Welfare" , is he telling me that the other 250 countries in the world treat horses better than we do , obviously that would be total nonsense , so why doesn't he just f**k off.

will RUBY be riding TUESDAY

NG got plenty of support on here.

She gave a great interview on ATR as well..

Can't argue with that. As i can't argue with the Jocks continually shooting themselves in the arris..

Scouser, it is the high profile jock's who carry the clout. Whether you or I like it or not if only jockeys of the stature of Nat object no-one would listen. You are misguided my friend.

Also though I agree about the GN winner I bet no-one came on here directly after the Frankie Dettori ride criticising his use of the whip. Anyone want to bring up a thread where, directly after the race, they raised this issue I would be pleased to see it.

So out of thousands of races you can pick up 2 possible this year, 1 I agree with? How can you call that abuse?

Gallbladder is on one end of the extreme while Brigust holds the high ground on other end of the extreme, compromise is out of the question?.
Brigust, speaking of Frankies ride on rewilding while Frankie might have hit his horse twice as much as Moore but when you look back on the race you can barely even see Frankie's whip because he's merely flicking it, compared to Moore where you can quite clearly see his whip raised borderline shoulder height, to me Moore was actually inflicting more pain on his horse than Frankie even though the strokes were 2-1 ratio in Frankies favour, both jockeys deserved their bans but they didn't really care because there was no incentive not to break the whip rules now that there is he jockeys are spitting fury because they're getting hit in the pocket. 
As I've said before I didn't think the original rules before the recent changes were all that bad if policed properly but the punishments for an offence were ripe for abuse.
People talk about Fallon not been a whip jockey and only goes for it late in the race?, c'mon!!! when he does resort to it he uses his whip nearly always above shoulder and regulary down the neck in the forehand position, he has spawned many copycats of his whip style, why else do you think Turner amd Milczarek can cut it with the big boys?, yeh thats right they use their whip with a Fallon over shoulder like ferocity and you can throw in Catlin into that mix as well, which in effect is cheating the other riders who use their whips correctly.
To me the main problem was the BHA never cracked down on the ugly side of whip use but preferred to count how many instead.
Maguire's use of it in the National was both frequent and ugly, if you removed the ugly side of his whip use nobody would have been too bothered about it at all?.
I gave a few links to a certain jockey riding in Ireland which I presume nobody bothered their backsides to look at?, he like many other riders in Ireland use the whip as a first resort and a last resort once they meet the business end of a race, jockeys are never held accountable over there as such whip abuse flourishes, and I'm no prude I don't curl up on my couch and hide my eyes when I see a horse getting hit by the whip but some jump racing finishes in Ireland have often made me squirm, its nothing short of butchery, and if the authorities in Ireland couldn't be assed to crack down on this butchery then all young jockeys coming into Irish racing will know no different, whip them hard, whip them good and whip them as many times as you like.

From a personal point of view my compromise would for the BHA to allow jockeys to hit their horses 10 times during a race both flat and national hunt, 10 hits should be more than enough for most races?, and crack down heavier on over shoulder and down the neck in the forehand position, seems a bit odd that the offence for this is lighter than for say a jockey using one more strike with the whip in the correct position?.
I can't see the argument where very tired jump horses should be hit more?, nothing uglier than tired horses getting flogged home on very testing ground.

I'm all for compromise Silver.

I suggest they should remove all of the rules and start again.

Then the rules should as follows:

a) No limit to whip use by number. (Removing any excuse for a jockey not trying sufficiently and because no 2 jockeys hit either in the same place or with the same intensity).

b) Stewards to be trained intensively to recognise any abuse of the whip.
  (Existing rules plus hitting when not in contention)

c) Very stringent penalties for transgressors including retrainind and potentially loss of licence.

How difficult is that?

What would GG, the Animal Activist, suggest.

brigust

I don't believe that you don't know what I'd suggest!

1. Ban the whip altogether (except for correction). This would negate the need for both 'b' and 'c' in your suggested solution.

Beat that for simplicity.

Now please don't bother me with this again unless you can either make your existing argument more cogent or unless you are able to construct a completely new argument.

Walsh and his da think they run Irish racing, the Brits should tell him to **** off and obey the rules or stay away.

Like any professional sportsman you must obey the rules of the governing body of the sport or you will be suspended. Either that or we have anarchy.

The rules have changed adapt or **** off and bore the arse off TV viewers with your (Irish blarney I know everything).

Somebody else will take your place who can work to the rules.

Jockeys the root of the problem here from start to fnish.