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magna grecia ...................2,000 gns
magna grecia ...................2,000 gns
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With Magna Grecia (MG) on the drift today (8->14) his stablemate and Derby prospect Anthony Van Dyck (AVD) has been matched at 28 (from 230) just a week ago - red herring?
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persian king misses the guineas and as i like a few cracks of the whip i have added madhmoon earlier at arounds 20s plus .
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No decision about the participation of Calyx (yet) until the weekend Magna Grecia has come in for further support; he's into 5.6, and is the present fav over his stablemate Ten Sovereigns (6.2). However, I think, if Calyx is given the go-ahead he'd be vying for favouritism given his previous form, and the high regards of his connections.
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Calyx won’t run
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^^
You may be right, Calyx is weak and matched at 24 - the market is usually right. Also, reading between the lines of connections eg ..."nice normal blow out...a decision will be made over the weekend...Frankie seemed pretty happy with him...no decision will be made immediately but a few things to think about.., etc; all these are not exactly bullish remarks eg he'll run if he's ok over the weekend. And, Frankie's reported comment could be significant ie "pretty happy" - to me means as happy as can be given...his past predicament, etc, etc. Money for the two Irish horses ie Magna Grecia and Madhmoon. |
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Frankie to ride Set Piece?
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well at least we(if any were brave enough to follow ) have beaten the price, thats the easy bit !
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Double whammy from Gosden: Two strongly fancied candidates neither made it to post despite positive soundbites; Persian King added salt to the wound.
And, now Ten Sovereigns is taking a walk. Could he be saved for the French version? |
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magna grecia around 4.7 to lay on here and madhmoon 8.6 .............time to green for a nice profit and 2 tasty free bets ! fabre stating earlier that if 1 or 2 of the "better horses come out persian king will run in the english gns ,well one of the so called better ones too darn hot is out so who is he afraid of ? cant be the one he just beat by a head or so last season can it ?
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Magna Grecia (MG) and Skardu (S)G, unless Ten Sovereigns (TS) confounds everyone and stays; was on a nice little earner with TDH eg 4/1 singles, 10/1-->20/1 doubles/trebles, and Persian King 10/1 and 12/1 (cash-out 40/1). Now, down to MG, S, TS, Mad, Avertise, Pheonix plus the long priced ones running for free; I do not want Royal Marine, Mohaather, Set Piece, Urban Icon and Great Scot.
Nevertheless, TDN would have been significantly better for me. |
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With Moore riding Ten Sovereigns Magna Grecia is now 6/1, surely value (?). A strong pace will suit too.
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what puzzles me is why fabre is staying in france with persian king ? looks as though it was there for the taking .
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The English 2000G is a more competitive affair than the French equivalent without the likes of Magna Grecia for one - no certainty Persian King can do the double over him either. Also, no travelling plus no Ten Sovereigns, Skardu and Madhmoon the unknowns to contend with.
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ahem!
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KKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKkkKkKKkKkkKkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM
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wd
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great call
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great call
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Well done Foyleswar, a good selection
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thanks lads hope some of ya were daft enuff to foloow
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Well done.
 Mumble, mumble, squirrels , nuts.  |
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I place laid ten Sovereigns to be in the first five. He was 5th.
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some lessons from this race to be learned as ever, ....... 1.if it looks like a duck ,quacks like a duck swims like a duck its a fookin sprinter ! all this crap about "class will see him through " it wont in top class races . as regards pecking order esp in aobs yard .....they have an idea who is best but its just an educated guess ! and you have to bear that in mind ,they may work them together at home but they wont push them to their limits for obvious reasons ,after all they are thourhobreds potentialy worth millions and no point leaving the race on the gallops . sounds like teaching granny to suck eggs but worth remembering for future races .
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Indeed. For instance Wings Of Eagles (Cliffs Of Moher); Minding (Ballydoyle); High Chaparral (Hawk Wing); Magna Grecia (Ten Sovereigns); Hermosa (Just Wonderful/Fairyland) - the list goes on and on.
So, in this Epsom Derby renewal without Too Darn Hot Ballydoyle are represented by Japan (fav/slight setback); Anthony Van Dyck (their best 2 yr old); Broome (Gp 1 2nd/convincing 10f victor); Circus Maximus (Dee Stakes). The 1st 3 mentioned above are down to run against one another in the Derrinstown Derby Trial at Leopardstown this sunday; 3 heading the market for Ballydoyle in the same Derby Trial? Wholly unlikely I'd think; at least one will be scratched,...most likely Japan given his slight setback just a few weeks ago. |
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1.if it looks like a duck ,quacks like a duck swims like a duck its a fookin sprinter
Lots of people thought that about Canford Cliffs going into the Guineas, including me, and many still thought it after. He didn't win the Guineas but us doubters were wrong. .they have an idea who is best but its just an educated guess They obviously can't know for sure. Over longer distances it would be more difficult because it's less about speed, but it's quite rare for them to miscalculate their milers, particularly colts. For instance when most people were taken with War Command they always had more confidence in Australia, who didn't win but still did better than WC. When we're talking about the good ones the last time I remember them getting one wrong was when Rock of Gibraltar beat Hawk Wing. Even then there was some debate about the draw and Hawk Wing did go on to give a very big performance as a 4yo. My money is still on Ten Sovereigns proving he's a better horse than Magna Grecia, just not over the same trip  |
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persian king wins the french guineas .
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Persian King (6/4) has an excellent chance of doubling up in the French Derby the day after Epsom esp if AOB does not gatecrash with one of his big Epsom fancies, I believe.
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Good chance of tomorrow being Wednesday too, apparently.
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cant see coolmore letting the french derby go by without having a go with something .
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If so, which one will be the most likely candidate to be rerouted to France? Very unlikely Broome - he's too lazy - and needs further than 10f; AVD stays 12f well similarly, Sir Dragonet.
A possible could be Japan if he credits himself well in the Dante but seems unlikely to stay further than 10f. Or maybe 1st and/or 2nd in the Dee Stakes ie Circus Maximus and Mohawk - both are too good to be pacesetters for Epsom, I think. |
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if aob sent one of his best over it would weaken the irish races , so he,ll send something , but , it wont be the best they can offer . prestige wise , he may start thinking to himself , hmm we are the best atm lets run em in ireland . basically if the uk cant meet the challenge , the big races could be the irish ones in the future ? its not that far fetched imo / undermine the derby and the oaks 20 years down the line its all about winning in ireland ! right now he has all the ammunition and chooses to go the traditional route . if he foked us off we,d be a second rater !
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i cant see half what i said betfair , basically we are in danger of becoming second rate
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same here gpz,been like it for aweek or so for me
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around 5/4 for the irish guineas ,might appeal to some .
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You're not wrong. I thought I would have to wait until Ascot, by which time a bloodless Irish win might have corrected the general misconception.
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I still say Magna Grecia put up marginally the worst winning Guineas performance since I began taking a serious interest in racing back in '85. Not saying he's necessarily the worst winner, which isn't the same thing, just that it was the weakest winning performance I've seen. Marginally worse than Island Sands.
So I'm obviously itching to take him on but then I look at the opposition. Skardu was an absolutely terrible Craven winner. I reckon Phoenix Of Spain would beat MG if he could return to the form that saw him finish behind Too Darn Hot. However he ran a bit below that in last year's Futurity and hasn't been out since, although the trainer sounds upbeat. Obviously there is also Too Darn Hot himself, but I have his Dante run a huge 16lbs below the form he showed to win the Dewhurst, which puts him behind MG's Guineas win. The question is how much did TDH run below form due to lack of stamina? Personally I find it hard to believe he ran over a stone below his best purely because of the extra distance. My fear is he's gone backwards. I suppose it's possible he needed the run, maybe he won't improve much fitness wise but he may have been a bit fresh and could come on for the experience. If Gosden can get another 5lbs out of him he'll have MG's number. I'm not ruling out a couple of the others may improve but on what they've done so far the rest look untouchable in an Irish classic. |
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Howellsy
Date Joined: 17 Mar 03 Add contact | Send message 22 May 19 17:42 Joined: 17 Mar 03 | Topic/replies: 937 | Blogger: Howellsy's blog You're not wrong. I thought I would have to wait until Ascot, by which time a bloodless Irish win might have corrected the general misconception. mug |
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just bare in mind the french colt sacred life whom was a top notch 2yo with no scope and went backwards , distant music just from my mind without checking up is another one
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Mug, Charlton? The early markets suggest parity. One is hardly a mug to incline one way or the other in such an apparently tight race. Cheers for your constructive contribution though. I'm backing the one that ran a career best last time out as opposed to the one who suffered a first defeat 9 days earlier. MG ran a time almost the same as TDH on Dewhurst day whilst being defeated narrowly by the far more experienced subsequent French Guineas winner. TDH beat an ordinary 6f sprinter and a middle distance horse, and had raced once more than MG at the time. MG is trained by the guy who's won, what, 7 of the last 10? For me, TDH ran his race at York and people just don't want to accept that. He ran a good race, and established himself as the 3rd best middle distance 3yo in training. None of this entitles me to say MG will definitely win or that TDH won't be a superstar over 8f. However, I am entitled to argue that MG is probably the better horse now, is in a much better position to run his race on Saturday, and is tremendous value at odds against. Now let's hear your arguments as to why TDH is such a good thing please.
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