Peace and Co (Triumph hurdle)

Dear god man. I knew you were mad but not this mad. What's changed between him being 8-1 and 10-1 following his last run and now when the best you can get is less than 3-1? That ship has sailed. Piling in now is madness. They are running him next week to see if they can switch him off for the big day. What happens if he lights up like a Roman Candle and starts flagging off the home turn next week?

Don't get me wrong. I've backed him but at the right price and this isn't the right price.

its gambling though EO   if he hoses up he will be odds on, and it could still be a shrewd move, or he could win by a diminishing margin and he could drift a point or two, not shrewd, or he could flop, drift alarmingly and the lumping on will prob break the bank


I have a decent price and don,t think its as good as yours but im happy

If he performs at a top track i will be convinced.

odds on?!?!for the triumph!?!?  the most idiotic statement i ever seen here!!

ok maybe a bit melodramatic but he will shorten don't you agree kavvy?

Of course alleged. Stick another piece of the jigsaw in place, given he'll be running at Cheltenham it's a pretty big one, and he may well go shorter, stay the same or lengthen. That's the nature of the beast but you make the relevant point. It's gambling and that involves getting in when the price is right or staying away if the price is wrong. As of now without next week to go on a best price of 11/4 is complete lunacy in my book and anybody taking it won't make the game pay in my view.

looks like a better my tent or yours to me

could be astonishing short for the truimph if all goes well next week

sometimes you can miss the boat though EO , if he wins at chelts in the trial anyones best chance of a decent bet then will be day of the race, if they take him on of course...

My old man sadly long gone was as good a judge as anyone I've known but he gave me great advice about betting and the first one was to remember that they have to price up every race and you don't have to bet in any race. If the boat has gone it's just not cool chasing it down the quay trying to jump aboard.

If it were in the supreme , I would probably bet it, the Triumph looks easy, and in comparison too say Faugheen in the champion, Peace and Co looks the better price, this is a beast!

http://youtu.be/DdltvU5BXco, they will be going quicker than this in the Triumph, should settle better and if not he could dominate non stayers!

Could have been 10 clear at any stage in that race, could have won another 15L +(WOW)

The RP have him on 142,I have him at a much higher figure,  I think he had 10 - 15L in the locker at least so I believe this is already close too a  160+ rated figure on only his second start?(yes a guess,and speculation).

On the subject of the Triumph does anyone know if Karezak is heading for this or a different race?

In the Triumph at minute, not one for me , only beat the Wallace Line 5L,wears blinkers, can't see any appeal in form!

Yeah i see that MJ was just wondering because of the obvious form lines if he may be rerouted elsewhere?
Ive seen he is in at Warwick this week and in the betfair

glad I didn't miss the boat

I did

Does it say HMS Titanic on the back?

HMS  dauntless when he destroys the opposition....

He did jink left on debut, and yes he could be headstrong,so something for layers too get excited about(just put him out in the betting you brave folk)

patrick gone up 4/6 for saturday looks like a gift

The risk of a non runner due to injury etc. is the same whatever the price a horse is now so I prefer to restrict my ante post bets to 20/1 plus. An ante post bet (apart from NRNB) is a treble. Will the horse be healthy, will it run in the race you expect and will it win. The first 2 parts are significant in a bet at short prices.

Most silliest betting proposition really in terms of winning the Triumph - best bet at the festival - No... in most recent years winner of the triumph is not 5/2 in January... winner of the triumph is lurking around at bigger prices... will see what unfolds in the coming weeks....

I think it will be 5/4 or shorter come the hour.So yes I expect a bloodless victory the weekend,this could be the most progressive hurdler in Europe(the world)?

For those betting faugheen going up in class against proven rivals with minor differences at the weights and opinion,and three of those including faugheen who make significant jumping errors,I just believe that for all the possible quirks Peace and Co may reveal or not?He looks much better value than faugheen at current price against a much less proven field.

He's at it again.

I think this is potentially a superstar horse based on his first runs so far. Hopefully he confirms it on Saturday.

Let's hope not but tomorrow there may be few other sounds coming from Cheltenham other than air rushing out of a popped balloon and metro sobbing uncontrollably.

Crazy short for tomorrow considering what he actually beat on his british debut.

Can't believe the boldness of some to compare with Faugheen at such early stage. I wouldn't want most on this page to be disapointed tomorrow so hopefully he puts up a nice performance to keep the magic going. For myself I'm thinking of going on a decent lay with Nicholls unexposed Ibis, the consistent Bivouac and the `nearly` one Karezak all three coming with good claims into the race, not as good as P&C but his price is too small should be at least 2/1.

I think you'd get knocked over at 2-1 but I certainly wouldn't be backing odds on.

I wouldn't him back at 2/1(I would however take anything at or above 3/1 considering all tomorrow's dangers), I think that would be a minimum fair price coming into the race from beating a very tired horse in second last time out; as you can tell that hasn't impressed me as much as it has others but I'll be glad to be set straight tomorrow afternoon ;-)

Fair play tintin putting up your views before the race which is always welcome here.

I think he should be 1.88

Im already 300 deep, mainly down to history and not his blinding uk debut.

He comes on back of beating a good ground very tired horse on soft conditions on a flat and galloping course. It doesn't take too much courage for me to lay him at anything below evens, considering the demanding Cheltenham and those 3 with good claims in behind. Triumph is 2 months away, money can be made tomorrow with this horse, either as a backer or layer(will find out tomorrow which)

layed him now at 1.5 with the fear of smart money coming in tomorrow and going into evens, better now than later in this case :-)

Just watched Karezak december trial in second, the 2 leaders left Stars Over The Sea 29 lengths behind, Karezak was sent home much too earlier for my liking but still managed to stay up there until he blundered the last hurdle and also went on the far side of the rails, plus he also gave 3 pounds to the winner, this performance looks more impressive to my eyes than P&Cs...

Of course he disapointed last time in the champions juvenile finale ridden for the first time by Aidan Coleman who gave him a too confident ride but that one came too soon after a hard race at Chelt and again blundered at 2 hurdles in the home straight which didn't helped but again proved he devours soft ground which will get tomorrow as well.

At the odds he stands for value at 8/1 but there are other dangers for this `nearly` one to be backed so better to simply lay the odds-on favourite who comes with shady form beating a very tired horse by a flattered margin on a totally different type of track. The favourite could find a lot more under pressure tomorrow but is odds-on worth of finding that out?

Fir play Timtin,wish you luck.
Personally I think sometimes a race comes along that is better just watching,i have a feeling this is one.
No money involved for me,but bl00dy fascinating to see this horse again,blimey did he look good ..

Good to see opposing views timtin. I'm as opposite to you in my views on this horse. What he did at Donny was astonishing and I think he has the potential to be on a different planet of good. He has a 147 rated Bivouac and 142 rated Karazek in the race. If he can smash them we're looking at a high 150's juvenile.

well backers were right, but what a farce of a race, form wise we learned nothing because the race wasn't a race until well after they've covered a mile.

We learned that the horse acts on the track.

Good enough performance from Peace & Co, but not wirthy of 7/4 fav tag for Triumph.  Theres interesting candidates in Ireland, and they have produced the last two winners in Our Conor and Tiger Roll.

worthy of course, not wirthy.

don't back this horse at stupid odds. u can back it in running n the day and probably get double odds

you'll probably get 3/1 plus on the day pre race...pretty much everyone agrees that his price now is daft, there's only one way it will go on the day I'd have thought.

Bit of (small) money for him in the Supreme. I wonder...

This years Dunquib. Just watch it bomb.

g not a q!

I may be talking nonsense, but I have visions of a fast run race and peace and co coming to the end of his tether after the last..and being swallowed up by a horse with more stamina. I know the race is 2m 1, but it was a slowly run race at the weekend. His dosage mark indicates he has it all to do as all horses with his dosage have not won the triumph in the last 10 years as it indicates all speed.

I think it very much depends on the ground. I wouldn't want to be a backer on soft ground at the festival. Lets not forget though that The New One was outstayed on trials day before sluicing up at the festival over course and distance. I think on good ground he will take all the beating.

All the above points valid, but what is gonna beat it? Oh yes, should be a bigger price without any doubt,but we never get those prices very often do we?

often you see one 3/4 weeks before the triumph sluicing up ..mayne the triumph winner hasnt appeared yet.

Chartbreaker would be one interesting one that we've not seen yet, Nicholls has entered him in both Triumph and Supreme, Flat RPR of 92 and got within 10 lengths of Sea The Moon in a Group 2 at Cologne last summer.

Intriguing that he's entered in both races (though I could be reading too much into that), looks like he prefers a softer surface so they may just be thinking he's more likely to get that in Supreme.

Anyway, a lot of supposition for a horse yet to run over hurdles but one to keep an eye out for when he appears.

^^ agree good post.

Yes Reaseheath, any horse getting within 10L of Sea The Moon(In my opinion the best individual performance I witnessed last year) must be considered. Hope the books read this and ease the jolly a few points.

I have to say I'm enjoying the wild disparity of the comments about the horse in this thread and the one in the other forum. Lots opposing him (rightly so at his odds in a Triumph) but I think every possible reason has been brought up. He won't win for 19 reason now by my count.

I'm still wildly confident. I call him wonder horse, our WhatsApp chat is renamed Peace & Co Fan Club after that one Donny race!! He's just a phenominal talent and I hope he progresses to fulfill that promise.

Well to my eyes there has not been a more impressive Juvenile seen thus far,so to see he cannot win is just plain stupid,and probably being said by backers of other horses,and those that missed prices.
Yeh,fair enough re the price,i cant back him at that,but just cos one has backed something else or missed the price,dont come on forums saying he cannot win!!

Pathetic imo.

Now I am confused CV, Thinking  they could all use a flat track myself, Nichols thinking the same? and Hendo? Still the best seen thus far over here,for all the obvious quirks(Nervous),I do wonder if they will reach for headgear?

Cannot win

wind up merchant

Oi Oi

So let me get this right. Two months ago you advised people to back a horse who was 11/4 and on the day you could back it at 4-1 with it opening on course at 11/4 and you are running around like you are King Dong?

well done - metro john

Did slate your thread a bit... but you firmly believed in this horse.. and although short odds... hope you backed it heavily ... and got your reward.

There are still question marks with this horse in terms of how close Top Notch was... but does clearly have a bit of class and you definately caught him at the right time.

Jan 23, 2015 -- 4:49PM, Eeternaloptimist wrote:

Let's hope not but tomorrow there may be few other sounds coming from Cheltenham other than air rushing out of a popped balloon and metro sobbing uncontrollably.

Notears here my son

You were about a month late to the bandwagon. Son:

Don't get me wrong. I've backed him but at the right price and this isn't the right price.

Jan 17, 2015 -- 7:44PM, Eeternaloptimist wrote:

Dear god man. I knew you were mad but not this mad. What's changed between him being 8-1 and 10-1 following his last run and now when the best you can get is less than 3-1? That ship has sailed. Piling in now is madness. They are running him next week to see if they can switch him off for the big day. What happens if he lights up like a Roman Candle and starts flagging off the home turn next week?Don't get me wrong. I've backed him but at the right price and this isn't the right price.

The horse was about too win a Cheltenham thus proving his effectiveness for the track,his previous win was just wfa short of Champion hurdle class(yes I did see previous run),most would expect the horse too shorten,many would have been surprised at the layers optimism too get it beat?,even if we can see attitude and possible flaws in character?(high head carriage). Value we never really get that unless you match a few quid(and they only match you for a few quid at bigger prices has the charge happens just after the event) a good trading angle maybe?,but I much prefer the old days(pre betfair, concerning ante post) when the old guys had more patience(lets get them too the event first), you remain one of the better forum trolls around sir

But well done too all who did match,trade at bigger prices(above 7/2) at whatever stage you did it at!

Jan 28, 2015 -- 7:32PM, Eeternaloptimist wrote:

I think it very much depends on the ground. I wouldn't want to be a backer on soft ground at the festival. Lets not forget though that The New One was outstayed on trials day before sluicing up at the festival over course and distance. I think on good ground he will take all the beating.

Did you trade out sir?

I didn't and it was far closer at the finish than I was comfortable with.

The horse was about too win a Cheltenham thus proving his effectiveness for the track,


Clearly you have a special crystal ball.

circle ,square ,triangle

https://youtu.be/qr1tB3Fy1Xs 

4/9 spooky predictions alright