KING GEORGE

there was def rain forecast overnight, just wondering how much they got.

as you can tell, this bet means quite a lot to me !!!!!!!!

bonnie I am in south London and we have had some rain ,Kempton is not that far from me and I would imagine they have had similar ,but I cant be definite about it ,must be someone who can update ! harry Callaghan ?

thanks foyles, any rain is a bonus !!!!!!!!

am just up the road from kempton and mrs has just put a washing out ,nice morning .

breadnbutter, did you have any rain overnight ?

It is not going to be Soft ground. I think we can safely say that now. GS is fair for every horse. PFN knows the ground is not always guaranteed to be soft at Kempton that's why he was trained for Haydock IMO.

you still fancying dynaste sint? first time P plates i see

Well, I was a little underwhelmed with his peformance at Haydock, he was beaten 10 lengths in 3rd, but it depends how Pipe has trained him this year. I would guess that he will have left a lot to work on and Boxing Day is the main aim. The fact the ground will be better is a bonus as his last three runs on official good ground read 112, but it won't be that quick.

Scu & Pipe are getting a helicopter from Wincanton after the 1.40 to be there..

standard procedure.

thought the jockey rode him like he was out for the run at haydock...i have had a small bet on him but just not sure he is improving anymore and he needs to, to win this imo just not sure he has reached his peak but i suppose that is why they have reached for some headgear with him...agree ground fine...very tough betting heat

metcheck say 7mm between 12 and 3 pm and a further 17mm  between 3pm and 6 pm on boxing day

OK that could swing it in Sc's favour then..depends how soon the rain arrives.

Laying Conti win and place. Have Champagne Fever back antepost, (also fr Gold Cup), will add Menorah.

cvbyrne - as a matter of interest, what is your reasoning for laying conti win and place ?

just curious as we are all punters and your view is the polar opposite to mine, i've bet conti at an average price of 7s to fairly good money, and even tho the ground will not be as testing as last year, conti still has the most solid form going into the race, and he has also won on decent ground at aintree.

http://jumpsadviser.com/king-george/

There is my write up of the race.

Conti will find 3m on a flat speed track on good ground too quick for him. Last season the race fell apart and it turned into 2 horse race when Cue Card got tired. I can't see why Conti would have won that race had the ground been quicker. Similar I don't see him maintaining form with Menorah from the Betfair Chase, this tight track suits Menorah very well, as will the 1 furlong less and better ground.

There is too many dangers the only real strong play is laying the horse who you think will be beaten.

'Beautiful' ground forecast for King George
By Tom Kerr 12:51PM 24 DEC 2014

THE William Hill King George is set to be run on "beautiful jumping ground" after recent mild and dry conditions at Kempton.

A perfect ten runners will line up on December 26 to contest the Grade 1, traditional highlight of Boxing Day racing, on ground that is predicted to dry out to good to soft, good in places from its present good to soft.

Clerk of the course Barney Clifford said: "We had 0.4mm of rain overnight, it's bright and sunny here at present and we're forecast 12C. Tomorrow looks about 8C with 0C overnight into Boxing Day, which itself will be about 4C.

"There's a bit of rain going into the 27th, there's rain forecast on Friday night into the 27th, but I think that's overnight rather than during the day which is good news.

"The lads who were here this morning and had a canter round said it's lovely ground, good to soft. There's no more rain forecast before the King George so inevitably it is going to dry out a little bit, so I would think it will be good to soft, good in places come the King George.

"It's an enormous change [from previous years]. It's been so mild, the track looks in excellent condition. Ten or 12 days ago it was soft ground and it's just drying out slowly. It's beautiful jumping ground."

my views, fwiw - conti won the betfair chase far more comfortably than the distances suggest, from a relatively early stage conti was able to travel easily alongside cue card, giving him a jumping lesson at the same time, because of this conti found himself in front far too early, he dossed in front and it was only when menorah challenged that conti picked up again.

i can see the king george being run at a good pace with cue card and champagne fever both free running sorts who like to dominate, the ground certainly won't be good as you suggest, i hope you aren't taking the charlie hall form literally as we all know that conti needed the run to set him up for the season.

noel fehily said in yesterdays racing post that the horses go for home early at kempton, therfore proven stamina is a must.

its all about opinions

it's not a case of taking the Charlie Hall form literally, it's just about the prices for me. You've got Conti at 5/1 and now close to race time he's 9/4,5/2. all the main contenders have stood their ground and it does n't look like he's going to get his optimum conditions (I'm not saying he can't win on GS).

I take the point about the pace, reading between the lines in his column on here, I think Ditcheat might make good use of Wonderful Charm if for some reason Champagne Fever or Cue Card don't want to take it on.

does menorahs jumping worry anyone back on better ground? they went very slow early at wetherby which allowed him to find his rhythm and the slow ground helped him in the betfair...

he will be suited by better ground but this also means they will go quicker so jumping will be at a premium, he certainly worries me in this regard, his wins at kempton really have been egg and spoon races although he clearly likes the track

"i hope you aren't taking the charlie hall form literally as we all know that conti needed the run to set him up for the season"...you put him up before the charlie hall @ 5-1.

he was 10-1 before the betfair, so you must have thought he was fit for wetherby.

hope he wins by the way.

taking the 5s early on wasn't my finest moment, but with lots of subsequent bets i've got conti for an average of 7/1.

i had no idea prior to the charlie hall what his fitness levels were, hindsight is a truly wonderfull thing.
but knowing what i knew post charlie hall (where i didn't bet him), i had a very decent bet on conti to win the betfair.

I don't factor that Charlie Hall form really at all. I haven't mentioned it with regards Conti. I just think it's a high quality renewal. His price is half what I think it should be.

I don't think the track and conditions suit. He just out stayed Cue Card in very soft ground last year and they were the only two horses to run their races. But he has lots of rivals with chances this time.

When the pace quickens down the back he won't be able to go with them. He'll stay on again in the straight as the others tire but the race will be over by then. You've got some fast horses in this field, on a speed track on near good ground.

Imperial Commander was a superb horse. But the Betfair Chase and Gold Cup were more his race than the speed around Kempton. Conti is a dour stayer and this isn't his kind of race.

not having a dig mate,just whatever you post can be scrutinised and brought back up.

would not be that worried about the ground was good at aintree,fancy the surface could be quite holding after this dry spell.

looks pretty certain they will go a fair pace,so you will need to stay even round kempton.

not much you can do about the weather,just sit back and hope the horse runs his race.(might be worth laying a bit of you win bet off)

best of luck.

^^^..to bonnie

He is hardly a dour stayer, he had Cue Card absolutely stuffed well out at Haydock. He has also won twice around Aintree on good ground on a track that hardly suits dour stayers.

It's a really tough race to work out for me but he is a deserving favourite and is about the right price i would say with all the dangers having a lot to prove, about time Conti got the respect he deserves

*hardly just*

ive narrowed down the field either a dom alco or a kings theatre will win

gl all   

When assessing their chances in big races these days it seems standard from trainers and jockeys to say that they wouldn't swap their horses with any of the opposition. Mainly not to upset the owners!

But I actually mean it 100 per cent when I say just that regarding my big two in the King George.

And, with this drying ground, I don't think Wonderful Charm is a bad third string to our bow, either.

All three of mine schooled over 32 obstacles on Monday morning - all with their big race jockeys on board - and did it well.

Ok, it may not be saying that much that I wouldn't swap Conti and Al Ferof when they are the first and third favourites for the race, but I couldn't be happier with my pair, with Silviniaco Conti the proven form horse and Al Ferof having the potential to improve past him.

Of course, you have to respect second favourite Champagne Fever, who is actually a very similar type to Al Ferof. They both won well above-average Supremes and have to fully prove their stamina over this trip, and there is little doubting how impressive Willie's horse was at Clonmel last time.

But you wouldn't say that he has the most consistent profile and, to my mind, he still has it prove in this top company over fences.

That is something that we don't have to worry about with Conti, who went into overdrive from 2 out when beating Cue Card in this race last season.

And I think that his second Betfair Chase win at Haydock last time was just about the equal of that performance, as he beat the Charlie Hall winner Menorah by two lengths, with Dynaste eight lengths back in third and Cue Card a further two lengths back in fourth.

He is rock solid, even allowing for his below-par Wetherby comeback.

So on Haydock form, I think that we have the beating of those horses in behind - though if Cue Card came back to his best on this better ground he would prove troublesome - and the only real potential negative is the prospect of drying ground here, as Conti is a stayer and he loves it soft. But it was decent ground when he beat Dynaste at Aintree, so we will just have to take whatever the weather hands us and get on with it.

But if it remains good to soft ground, or better, then Al Ferof becomes an even bigger player.

I got all sorts of grief on Twitter when he won at Ascot on his reappearance, as I said that he came in four weeks late and would definitely need the run. And both were correct.

It is just that he absolutely hacked up, anyway.

Ruby got off him and said he blew up going to the last, and for the horse to still go and beat the subsequent Tingle Creek second Somersby by seven lengths with Peterborough winner Wishfull Thinking back in third was clearly some performance.

It must have been a career-best from him.

Granted, he didn't look an obvious stayer when third in this race last year - and he has so much class and natural pace that I think he could hold his own in the best company over 2m - but the ground was very testing there, and it is conceivable there could be even more to come from him.

For a 9yo, he doesn't have that many miles on the clock and we have kept him fresh for this. And he comes into this race bouncing, as does Conti.

Of the others, top class 2m4f handicapper John's Spirit is interesting stepping up in trip, and I am happy to give Wonderful Charm another try at 3m.

I appreciate that he is among the lowest-rated horses in here and is officially rated 15lb inferior to Conti, as well as having not looked a stayer in his two attempts at this trip.

But he wasn't at his best on either of those occasions- both were at the end of the season -  and he was less than two lengths behind Wishfull Thinking in the Peterborough last time and, like Al Ferof, he loves good ground. And Sam did get off him at Huntingdon and say 3m could be what he wants.

He may be a 50-1 chance but I'd like to think that he will outrun those odds. And the pace angle is an interesting aspect of this race.

But I'll keep that under my hat for now, if you don't mind!

wonderfull charm to hassle cue card early on then !!!!

I'll be looking to lay Menorah 1st 4 places waiting on what price that will be

i'm starting to like dynaste for this. clearly needed the run in the betfair, had back problems after last year's race. kempton suits him down to the ground. think it's possible with the experience of last year under his belt that he can find the required improvement.

W.Mullins is sending over a solid 4/1 2nd best to the kg  that  cant win .....does not sound right tbh .

Kempton Park
Next Race     Friday 26th December
Report Date     Wednesday 24th December; 12:45 pm
Going     Good to Soft
GoingStick     Chase 6.0; Hurdle 5.7 on Wednesday at 12:30


not sure after 0.4mm of rain the ground could worsen from yesterday...very confusing

I have narrowed it further, no Supreme winner will win!

Hey PF

I just feel 3 miles on good ground given this opposition he is too short at 5/2 so felt the need to lay him. At 4/1 I wouldn't be a layer. My reasoning is he's run at best a low 160's in his 2 wins at Aintree in spring and that was over 1 furlong further. Dynaste doesn't stay that trip, nor does Menorah in the 3m1f on soft of Haydock. I wouldn't be surprised if either those two reverse their 2l defeats to Conti here.

If Cue Card and Conti ran to the exact same level as last years race I would expect Cue Card to not tire like he did and win. Al Ferof has his excuses, rightly or wrongly for last years running. He put up a superb performance lto and is a big danger.

Then we have Champagne Fever who is a big danger if he stays, Ruby may be allowed to dictate from the front. He's a high class horse.

So we've got dangers everywhere and rather than try pick one of them when they're all around or near their right prices, I think it's the call to lay Conti and hopefully one of them (or 3 preferably) will beat him. It's a very open race, I think the top 6 all have good claims

with Silviniaco Conti the proven form horse and Al Ferof having the potential to improve past him.


very interesting nicholls feels this way.....

and you,d expect him to say conti,s not the form horse ,i,m running al ferof because he,s in the one man colours and wondeful charm because ive always wanted a 50 to 1 shot in the race
wasnt the word from ditcheat last week that al ferof doesnt see which way conti goes on the gallops
different day different shoite twas ever pumpkins way

slybet go 124% the field, god i hate bookmakers.

Every horse exposed apart from Champagne Fever. Get On.

The forecast rain for Boxing Day evening seems to have drifted forward a bit and is due to start in the afternoon now. Doesn't seem to be suggesting much at the moment, unless it comes in a little earlier again.

Exposed, you understand what that means? Being exposed as a 174 chaser means you can run to a 174! which will almost certainly win this race.

I think some believe exposed means, I know how good you are etc..

haha, the expected rain is now due on or around race time, hows my luck ??

merry christmas everyone

unfortunately its going to come well after the race


merry xmas

heavy rain now expected 16.00 hrs, race off time 15.10 !!!!!!

now if the heavy rain could shift itself forwards to say, 11.00..........................

or backwards lol

Yeah he's right, rain due arund 2pm.

I'll not lay Conti if it's raining long enough to get into the ground. I'll get out of my bet. I'll wait for the forecast tomorrow morning as bookies will probably push Conti out anyway I can get off on better terms.

alleged22 24 Dec 14 17:54 Joined: 18 Feb 12 | Topic/replies: 3,545 | Blogger: alleged22's blog

with Silviniaco Conti the proven form horse and Al Ferof having the potential to improve past him.

Utter rubbish!! I am a firm believer that trainers ALWAYS KNOW EXACTLY WHAT THE GOT at home and how good horses are against others etc, they either just choose not to relay that info to the public OR and most likely they are not allowed to owing to the privileged information rule which is most likely.

In a lot of cases us punters just need to follow the markets on the day, there are always bookmakers much slower than others to react to shortening of prices, it is these i pounce on

Has Champagne Fever lost a leg? There seems to be a big difference in prices, as small as 3-1 but as big as 11/2 with hills and drifting it seems.

Trainers with different owners will always sound universally optimistic Seathestars. Nicholl's is not going to tell an owner his horse is running for place money. Any optimism is not unfounded anyway, serves to keep the other owners feet on the ground and open a portal to any dissapointment.

I would be very worried that Hills are going nearly twice the price of some other bookies, expect the announcement; "he's not eaten up" or something along those lines. Too much Champagne and He's definately showing withdrawal symtoms...

And that is also utter bollox sisyphus, the very fact that hills are nearly twice the price is nothing to do with horses that may or may not turn up etc, more to do with it is their own race, they sponsor it so will try to be best price on everything. They do it every year that they have been sponsor of the race. Expect a 100% or even an under round book come 9am Friday from hills. Or at least some tasty push outs for a limited period of time of the morning.

The fact that other books have horrific over rounds currently is to try and grab as much sheep as possible into the dismal prices so then its more affordable for any advertisements they might be planning on doing. I know 365 often do it, cut most night before the match best price after 10am.

I am expecting hills to be 3/1 conti and hold 11/2 CF and be joint top price on oddschecker the others

At least for a short time from 9am

In shops

Ok, he's got a temperature! lol

You could be right .

I was hoping for 7/2 or even 4s for Conti earlier in the week. I was expecting a drift for the drying ground which hasn't materialised, followed by a battle for top price by the books. 3/1 looks more realistic now.

With the amounts holding on Conti at 3.75 currently there's no chance of 7/2 or even 10/3. Tho I have been wrong plenty times before.

The clock says Champagne Fever but it is based on a two mile time at Leopardstown so a big question mark but can`t not back it e-w.

Have already backed Cue Card e-w at 10 thinking that if the ground is decent then the price was too big. Will probably trade at 7.8 or less.

My view is that any of the first six in the betting can win this given well being and jumping well on the day but one has to make a decision and I have settled on the above aforementioned.

I know I get slayed for this but I dont care what the 123 is as long as double ross dont win. I'm at 70% win book and was threatened with restrictions at my local Stan James shop because of this. As they price match oddschecker its easy to get on at the best price! Happy

I like Champagne Fever myself, at 7/1 ap anyway. Not ticking alot of box's, but i think he ought to be there or there abouts. I'd be dissapointed if he was out of the 2.

Thursday 25th December; 10:30 am
Going     Good to Soft (Good in places)
GoingStick     Chase 6.4; Hurdle 6.0 on Thursday at 10:30

A really tricky betting race this.
Plenty of depth in the race and a grade one to enjoy.
Plenty of horses have chances but also plenty of questions to answer.
I've always been against Conti but recently I have warmed to him. He is thoroughly consistent and should run his race.  I'm  not convinced this his race but he won last year and is respected.
This years renewal looks deeper than last year and if a horse can get a lead on him and keep on to the line I think he can be beaten.
The only horse I think can run that sort of race is Champagne. I will wait to see the going and if his price is worth the punt.
Should be an interesting race
Good luck all

Just to add. I love Cue Card. Thought he would win this last year then on to the Gold Cup.

But I've always been against a horse coming back from injuries so can't support him here.
If he were to win though I'd happily suffer my loses.

Really trappy race, so many questions against them all.

I have backed CF ap as stated on the first few pages. Siding with my mate Alfie nearer the ko.

1-Al Ferof, are the ulcers stopping him from being top class ?
2-Champagne Fever, will he get the trip
3-CUe Card, easy for me, doesnt get 3miles. recent form ?
4-Double Ross, pass
5-Dynaste, 2m5f horse. Probably the place horse.
6-Johns Spirit, PP winners can do ok in this race, trainer form makes it a pass
7-Menorah, cant have this horse, suddenly performs at 3miles, has no staying form.
8-Silviniaco Conti, still does it when you think he cant, still not convinced.
9-Wishful Thinking, if it came down to jumping then he would win.
10-Wonderful Charm, has ability and flatspots but 3miles may suit

Real tricky race to work out,and like others would not be surprised if any of 6 win. Probably going to side with my ol mate Alf,he looks improved horse this season over his problems,but a fairly tentative bet it will be.just hope the rain don't affect it too much if if gets to Kempton before the race.

Good luck all.

bonnie currently doing a raindance

rain would probably make the ground easier to get through.

looks holding and stamina sapping to my eyes.

ground no excuse.

Great performance from horse and jockey. Again.
Well done winners

oi oi w/d bonnie winners and me.

Wow he showed me, superb ride and huge performance by a class horse. He ran them ragged and cost me a fair whack of cash. He's also inflicted the biggest single day loss of money I've ever had

I got my comeuppance, now time for a whiskey.


Well done bonnie and all other Conti backers. It'll take a mighty performance to beat him in the Gold Cup. I've consistently underestimated Conti. Never again.

My laying days are also well and truly behind me

lets bury this 2 mile ,20 furlong horses can go well in king george,if your on an out and out satyer like conti and get the pace right you,ve beaten these speed horses before the race starts,so called speed horses dynaste,al ferof, cue card plugging on like 4 milers,its fanciful to think speed horses can show 2 mile speed at the end of 3 miles

Well done op, hope you copped loads..... I did, happy days.

Excellent performance by the winner and great ride from Noel.

Cue Card clearly needs to be retired - never going to be the horse he was.

Hope CF goes for the Champion under a positive ride from Ruby.

Dynaste will be very hard to beat in the Ryanair again.

I agree with you 1st time poster. The likes of Dynaste and Cue Card will probably head for the Ryanair which both have won previously and it's probably the most suitable race for them. Al Ferof in the Champion Chase would be interesting. I don't think we'll see Cue Card or Al Ferof over 3 miles again ... maybe Dynaste will attempt it once more.... there's probably something amiss with Cue Card since his injury too.

pumpkin wants to run al ferof in the champion chase

I hope Champagne Fever goes for the Gold Cup. Good ground at Cheltenham in March .... year after year that horse proves that's what he wants. It was inconclusive today as regards his stamina.

Well done Silviniaco Conti backers.

Superb ride by Sir Noel of Fehily.

People a bit hard on the beaten horses. Just because they lost today doesn't mean they all didn't stay. Conti was just relentless and at Kempton when you get into the Rhythm and stay very well your opponents don't get a chance to get a breather like say downhill in a Gold Cup.

My take on today's race CV:

Dynaste and Al Ferof are better over shorter and to be fair, the post race comments from Pipe and Nicholls sounds like they are Ryanair and CC bound. They both ran good races today behind an exceptionally good winner.

Cue Card has been disappointing this season. Fantastic effort last season in the Betfair Chase. Whether he idled or got outstayed or whatever in last year's KG, I'm not sure. I don't think we actually saw the best of him over 3m.

Champagne Fever is worth another try over 3m. M

well done bonnie   

well done bonnie.

A good performance from Dynaste.

I thought Champagne Fever just proved he is not good enough at G1 level over fences.

WPM really is bad a training chasers. Poor Vautour and Adriana Des Mottes hitting the deck today.

yep, well done bonnie and other winners, was also a fair point about him not getting the respect he deserves.

Conti's proven he's the best staying chaser in the UK right now (at least but I would n't want to disrespect Lord Windermere) and I won't be underestimating him in future.

Classy post from you CV too, don't think there was a lot wrong with your reasoning pre race personally but we all live and learn in this game.

Merry Christmas all, on to the Welsh National, just checked the weather and looking for something shod with flippers in first time diving mask and snorkel.

mountainous and hawkes are your men ,

I thought Champagne Fever just proved he is not good enough at G1 level over fences.

Sint this sentence actually had a penny drop moment. He won the Supreme, it was an exceptional performance at the time, but other than that!! Western Warhorse, 4th in a King George today. I know hes always ran his best races at the festival and nowhere else. Like Albertas Run, but maybe he is another Albertas. Ryanair level is his level.

I think you're right that's not up to winning the proper top level races over fences. Just doesn't jump well enough, doesn;t stay enough and doesn't have enough speed. He's stuck in the middle.

For all my comments about WPM and training chasers, i've just baked on of his for the Gold Cup..Boston Bob ew at 20/1.

Rease I wouldn't call it a classy post man!!. Let's put it this way.

There are people who have seen the talent in Conti and always defended him, said he was a top class horse. I've disagreed with that pretty much for 2 years. It was a matter of opinion, differing views.

But after today, it's clear as the light of day who was right and who was wrong. Unfortunatley for myself I'm on the wrong side. He was utterly stunning today. The cheek pieces made the difference, had he simply had them on in the Gold Cup he may have won 5 grade 1's on the bounce!!

He is a cut above in an average era. I hope his fans enjoyed today. Vindication fellas, superb horse. Hope you enjoyed it.

It's always the way that the beaten horses in the KG are always kind of viewed on as Ryanair horses, e.g. Champagne Fever, Dynaste, Cue Card and in the case of Al Ferof maybe even the Champion Chase. All of those have all finished close together behind a very good winner. If anything happened the winner either before the race, or during it, you'd like to be there to capitalize.

In fairness the others have been found out at 3 miles a few times against the best opposition but I think Champagne Fever is worth another go at 3m+. I couldn't say that staying distances will turn out to be his best but I couldn't be sure they aren't after today. I see he is 25/1 for the Gold Cup. I think this is quite big as we know how likes good ground in Cheltenham and how he finds extra up the hill. It's interesting though where they go next .... maybe Boston Bob in the Lexus will help make their mind up one way or the other.

If he goes for the Gold Cup though and is anything like those odds, he'll certainly carry my money.

booooom that was fun - cheltenham paid for - soooo hammered, looking forward to watchin the race sober in the mornin - crikey i'm hanmerd, lovin conti n noel- get the fcuk in, goodnight n allthat

he wins when he wants ............................

Well done bonnie, he was awesome today. Anyone who starts a threat about backing a horse deserves all the credit. Well done.

cheers - its been fun.  strange feelings tbh, no more checking bbc weather on a daily basis, turtrax  and racing post.

fairly pissed, very content, roll on march, nothing on going as yet - but, house paid for, tickets x4 sorted etc etc

isn't life amazing

Aye. WD winners.

Fully understand why he is fav for the GC but I'm still intending to take him on.

Full credit to the horse for what he's achieved though. Two betfair chases and two king george's is no small achievement.

He lead over the last in the Gold Cup, surely he should win in that scenario,hes not for me at Cheltenham.
Flat tracks yes, Cheltenham no.

Well done op and backers and conti. That was never good to soft on the chase course!

which donut place layed SC?

*raises hand*

its all about opinions - luckily i got this one right.

looking forward to tomorrow morning, pay out time !!!!