thanks , i never knew that

I must admit that I have no experience of churning at this scale, but suppose you want to do it quick and easy and are prepared to sacrifice a bit of money. (Naturally you wouldn't do it in one big bet, think 100 60k bets on big football matches or something.)

Back Team A £6,060,000 @1.98
Lay Team A (using another market) £6,000,000 @2.00

Team A wins:

Back win = 6,060,000*0.98*0.98 = 5,820,024
Lay loss = 6,000,000
Commission generated = 6,060,000*0.98*0.01+6,000,000*0.015 = 149,388
Sum = 5,820,024-6,000,000+149,388 = -30,588

Team A loses:

Back loss = 6,060,000
Lay win = 6,000,000*0.98 = 5,880,000
Commission generated = 6,060,000*0.015+6,000,000*0.01 = 150,900
Sum = 5,880,000-6,060,000+150,900 = -29,100

So, a 30k loss to generate 150k commission like that, and that's 30k that would be subject to 60% PC, so only 12k really. Still so worth it if you can't do better, and don't tell me it would be difficult to get matched if you're willing to give up value like in this example. Very short payback time on that investment if you intend to keep using your account like before.

Don't correct scores, over unders and total goals all have the same rules regarding abandoned match? I didn't think there was a difference whether someone bets on 'over 2.5 goals' or '3 goals or more'...

Eddie: I have deducted 2% commission from both wins by multiplying with 0.98, so if I have made any mistake I don't think it's that.

Bingo: Weird how more people haven't been attracted by the low commission on Asian handicap, but there are matches when the turnover is pretty big. Draw No Bet-bets can be done in the match odds market. Match odds bets can be done in the HT/FT-market. For certain matches To qualify, Qualifying method, or Group winner etc. could be useful I suppose. I haven't thought about it that match since my commission generated is way above 10%, and always has been.

My point btw, is that I don't expect there to be many active players left in the 60% bracket, not even courtsiders or corrupt jockeys (who probably wouldn't have any qualms about getting a fresh account), and all players who have reached 250k since the charge was introduced will have avoided it if they intended to keep using their account like before.

Yeah, but you also generate 150,000 commission which in my example means that you pay 150,000 less in premium charges.

Sorry, I made an error here.
  Let me take a deeper look at this and come back to you...

Latalomne 04 Jan 14 14:49 

...The alternative, as frog has highlighted, is to increase the bet placement delay.  There are pros and cons to that, particularly in a fast moving sport, and, while that would offer protection for layers, it wouldn't necessarily improve things for price takers.

There is a far, far better alternative, and that is to:-
1) Do away with the delay entirely
2) In-play bets are, by default, "fill or kill" (If you want to be a market-maker, you must choose a "keep bet")
3) Additionally, you may specify an in-running bet/lay range which is acceptable to you. Eg, if you specify 5% and, at the instant that your bet must be filled or killed, the back/lay spread is more than 5%, then your bet is killed.

Under those circumstances I would be quite happy to bet in-running with slow pictures or no pictures. The fast-pics boys (market-makers) will keep the prices fair, and when they aren't fair, my bet won't get matched.

Dear

Since November 13 last year, we have waived all Premium Charges from the Spanish Primera Division football markets as an offer to our Premium Charge customers. To date, more than 1800 of you have benefited from this offer. We are contacting you today to inform you that the offer now finishes on February 1 2014 – as scheduled.

Please note that there is no Premium Charge on Rugby Union markets until June 1 2014, and you only have to pay 0.75% on Asian Handicap markets until May 24 2014.

Any Primera Division markets that have been fully settled before 00:00:00 on February 1 2014 will not be included in your Premium Charge calculations.

Thanks

Betfair Customer Service

* you're

Yes and their just the people it benefited, it cost me - I would have paid less pc without it.

480 was the figure quoted for the higher rates of PC when they were announced, but a lot more on 20% obviously.

In a public company surely it should be a matter of public record how much revenue comes from the premium charge. How critical is it the business?

They break it down by exchange, sportsbook etc and have in the past by sports. Surely its time to reveal on the truth on how much the PC generates.

ttt

ok   spill beans   right why someone on 40% pc make 20k to upward of 500k or more a year while small timers  on 5 to 10k a year pay the same 40 % get it sorted  it not right

and  why the no link to pc on acc on betfair   only found in feedback   that sick

forget it  and chin up as we all 5 to 10k  trying to pay the bills and nice   thanks for 40 %  for the work

long live betfair love u betfair  it do change our world

wow what a robust thread this one is

Lazy? Or criminal?

frog, ZR the worlds biggest punter (t/o billions per yr) is a master negotiator , tying up all manner of rebates on totes, so the more he bets the more he gets back in rebates.....happy to back losers and still win......I believe that he would not cop ANY PC whatsoever.....and in that belief if doesn't pay neither should anyone.......this would be a great question for anyone in senior BF management