Cosmic, the easiest way is to get yr bf accnt. in lifetime loss now that the pc rules have changed.

Usually arbing on best prices w/ fresh accounts in enough to do this.

Strangely some bm s that limit you for singles allow you to take best prices in outsize bets on multiples (to a 20k and sometimes 50k takeout). Just one win on one of these and you won't be worrying about pc for a long time.

You can also defray a lot of pc costs by racking up a big win/big loss here on related markets. The win is taken off yr p&l for pc calc purposes.

nobody would be complaining about this if they went the other colours way when they had the chance. most people chose to stay here and you cant complain about that now.

There ARE other choices, yes i understand that in-running etc which some people focus on would not be liquid enough to carry on as you are but if people were that serious about avoiding the PC then there would be more than just the odd little rumour about switch days etc...something would actually be done.

I think its stu1pid guys who are on FULL 5% commission paying a further 17% Premiun Charges every week. :(

I know it has killed much of my betting on here and just looking around some golf, football, rugby and tennis markets especially the Outright ones and I see I'm not the only one who has curtailed my betting here.

In the 10 years I've been on here now I have never seen so many huge overounds on some Betfair books or so many markets been held up by £2 lays.

Yeah the in-running markets in soccer and racing are holding up alright but where else can you bet them.The rest look pretty questionable sure even the Racing Post pundits are now recommending to check prices elsewhere before you rush in here to bet for better value...Two years that was unheard of.

The only consolation is my commission paid is well down this year so Betfair are losing out there B-) and happily not from backing losers but just from tranfer of my business back to the bookmakers.....Cheers

I don't want to up the £2 bets up till I know they are value bets!

Lori 31 Mar 16:44
You don't remember the cricket liquidity falling to zero on here then rod?

no, i never touch the cricket. how long did it last or is it still going on and all the cricket punters moved? if they came back then why didnt they stay?

It lasted about 2 weeks. People came back because nobody else bothered to move across for other sports.

well at least some people had the right idea. its a shame everyone didnt move across together. i tried it ages ago but the tennis in play was non existent. now prematch it isnt too bad for some matches so ill try doing some over there and gradually move it all across should the chance arise but im not getting my hopes up because like you say, most people failed to move across.

Where can you find out your premium charge? Why is it not in the my account?

not just PC payers to move, i meant the smaller players too, and the mugs too, and the newbies with high hopes of winning enough to qualify for it in the future.

well they did offer 2% comm for a while, that was why i swapped over at first, every little helps. i personally dont mind the site layout etc, although i have heard many say the same as you.

The worst thing is that they dont want to do anything themselves with regards to advertising etc to get people to swap...they seem happy with what they have got.

** don't have anywhere near the depth of markets - of the 25 or so in running events a week I play,** will cover about 3 of them

ROD...Some of these markets here like the Golf and Tennis are only held together by 6 -10 big players at most. So it boils down to when or if these big players enter Premiun Charge land whether they move. Otherwise they just keep betting between themselves generating commissionas they go on.

Which is fair enough if these guys are making big profits and generating enough charges why would they leave.....Likewise the small guy.

So what happens is the middle of the road guy who pays the pc moves but now all the smart minds are competing against each other on a rival exchange, but without the small fish the (regular loser) who's left behind obivious to it al the commotionl..... Which is why he's often the regular loser.

That forces some of us to come back for the moment as the world doesn't change over night.

But I know the bets I'm placing now or any lays I take on at now at a lot less generous or attrative than they would have been 2 years ago. :0

As I simply building in the premiun charge that I now expect to pay by relying on the Betfair populary of old to hide the value that I'm taking or offering.

So yeah in some ways its the guys who I'm now betting against me are paying the Premiun Charges those who are matching me at higher odds than I normally would have looked at or lays I would have matched at lowers odd than before.

Funny thing is it probaly the same guys here who are saying I couldn't care less about the Premiun Charges since I never pay it.......

But in fact in a lots of cases now it is the losers who are now paying it, for the winners.

They just don't realise it. :^0

Blessington 31 Mar 18:35
ROD...Some of these markets here like the Golf and Tennis are only held together by 6 -10 big players at most.

I can assure you mate there are more than 6-10 big players on the tennis....far far more. Golf, maybe, i never touch it but tennis, you are way with that prediction.

blessington, hit nail on head, golf particulary you are worse off in regards value back bets due to the market makers having to factor it their prices due to pc, thats my main gripe with it. lori, i think it was you on the golf forum, you were talking about" hybrid exchanges " i thought a budding entrepreneur could do a lot worse.

Lori , the site looks like its beendesigned by a 7 year old ,for a 7 year old .

There is no difference in appearance for me Coach, other than one has green and blue instead of purple and blue in the boxes.

Then menus, forum, and price boxes all have the same layout

The correct score market layout doesnt follow any logical sequence ...obviously designed by someone with a lower IQ than a Daily Mail reader.

The trading markets look like something pulled off CeeBeebies ffs.

The navigation bar index is all over the shop . It's a feckin shambles .

I actually prefer their correct score layout!

The markets should be in alphabetical order, but at least you can find them, unlike here where you can often not even find a televised soccer game or something. (Again, it would be just as bad there if they were as big as here.)

Not sure what you mean by the trading markets. Mine look identical on both sites with the slight colour differences excepted.

In fact, it's worse than a mess, it's pointless (but again, who uses it?)

I don't find any operational differences at all, other than the advantage there of not having to wait five seconds if you're pricing up a market, and the ability to suspend bets.

That's offset of course by the fact that nobody plays there :|