General Betting
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21 Dec 09
09:40
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Date Joined:
06 Jul 05
Ok, i make a living from betting. No other source of income.
Getting some heat at the moment from student loans about how i am supporting myself and would like to know what the legal status of all this is.
Do i need to start declaring it as a taxable income?
On top of the 25% paid in commission and PC that's going to make it extremely difficult as a sustainable living.
Thanks :)
Getting some heat at the moment from student loans about how i am supporting myself and would like to know what the legal status of all this is.
Do i need to start declaring it as a taxable income?
On top of the 25% paid in commission and PC that's going to make it extremely difficult as a sustainable living.
Thanks :)
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It is not taxable income.
However if you are means tested for any benefits then your saving + gambling kitty may well make you ineligible for them. You could have won 50k on lottery and decide not to get a job for now and enjoy life. Not sure what your student loan agreement says, but you have no job and no taxable income beyond interest accrued in banks. |
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Ok. Thanks. I am not claiming any benefit, although in terms of the student loan i suppose that is from the government and if i have enough money i have to pay that back which is fine.
So you can earn say £100k a year from sports betting and legally you do not have to pay any VAT or income tax?? |
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You can earn as much as you like- it's not taxable. Currently it's as simple as that (and long may it continue). You can tell the student loans people what you like, whether they believe you or not is their problem. As I understand it; if you don't have a taxable income you don't have to pay, end of.
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you will pay VAT like the rest of us when you buy things with your tax free income.
You can win millions on the lottery and it is tax free, its gambling. There has been an argument that those whom regularly make a profit on a place such as here are no longer gambling as such as they have an edge, but then poker players would fall in to that category as well. Whether any future legislation would come in to play to address this is anyone's guess. |
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I thought the Student Loans company was sold off and is now a private co.
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Right brilliant, cheers chaps.
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ActiveX 21 Dec 10:48 It is not taxable income. You are not a tax expert are you ActiveX? It could be taxable income depending on what you do. These internet supposed tax experts just get on my t1ts. |
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aye robot 21 Dec 10:58 You can earn as much as you like- it's not taxable Another tax expert ffs!! |
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I just ticked the 'other income' and sent them a P+L printout, haven't heard a peep since
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Sorry Alex,
You are correct that there are ways of gambling which could incur taxation, particularly if you bet with other peoples money or place bets on behalf of other people or are a company of some sort. I was keeping it simple as it seemed it was just one chap betting by himself, but I should have mentioned, that if this was not the case then it could be different. I am not a tax expert by the way, though have approached one or two chartered accountants on the subject in the past so have some grasp of it and how it related to myself. |
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Thanks Active.
I spoke to thje students loan and they have said just to send them a bank statement but that you do not start repaying them unless you are on a taxable income. Works for me. |
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Alex- I have never caimed to be a tax expert but it is perfectly clear that as things stand betting on the exchanges is tax free. All the guidance you need is here;
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/bimmanual/BIM22018.htm As far as HMRC and the courts are concerned (and they ARE tax experts) we are compulsive gamblers, nothing more. |
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Alex the old wrinkled retainer 21 Dec 11:28
ActiveX 21 Dec 10:48 It is not taxable income. You are not a tax expert are you ActiveX? It could be taxable income depending on what you do. These internet supposed tax experts just get on my t1ts. perhap's as you know so much about tax you'd like to actually contribute to the thread and share your tax insights???? failing that you could just be a **ing annoying forum know it all troll though. |
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And up pops Mashy my stalker. Forum troll? Kettle, pot, black Mashy!
I will advise on tax when paid to do it and all I am doing is pointing up that the first thing is to gain full facts before you advise and tax is not as straightforward as one might imagine. |
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Alex the old wrinkled retainer 21 Dec 11:28
ActiveX 21 Dec 10:48 It is not taxable income. You are not a tax expert are you ActiveX? It could be taxable income depending on what you do. These internet supposed tax experts just get on my t1ts. What are you referring to when you say "It could be taxable income depending on what you do." I would have thought you really don't need to be a tax expert, as the issue is very clear cut. In my case I simply called up HMRC, explained my situation and got a verbal confirmation that I would not have to pay any tax on this unearned income. Anyone in the same situation that isn't satisfied with this, could request a confirmation by letter or email. Then you won't need to worry about problems in the future. This is what I know about my situation: Not only is the income not taxable, but I don't even need to tell HMRC about it. Occasionally I get a form asking me what I've been doing for the past months/ year etc. I simply put unemployed, not on benefits etc. They haven't followed it up at all, which surprised me, but if they do, I can simply tell them I'm living off savings, which is true, but my savings are in a betfair account rather than a savings account. |
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ALEX IS A NUMPTY - STILL WAITING (ABOUT A YEAR NOW) FOR HIM TO PROVIDE EVIDENCE OF ANYONE PAYING INCOME TAX ON BETFAIR WINNINGS - PMSL AT THE TAX "EXPERT" :)
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iirc reuben, you were the one dishing out tax advice. Not only did you fail to determine what tax jurisdiction the poster was within but you also failed to determine how the profit was generated. Nevertheless you were happy to dish out free and potentially misleading advice as you had failed to gather the facts.
As for finding a precedent that has not come before the Specials or the Courts you are just showing yourself up to be as stupid as you appeared first time around. Investor: In your circumstances your profit may currently be considered to not be within the charge to tax. But your circumstances may not be the same as others. |
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THE ONLY MISLEADING SH1TE N HERE COMES FROM YOU TELLING PEOPLE THEY COULD BE LIABLE TO PAY INCOME TAX ON THEIR BETFAIR WINNINGS - DOUGH PEAK HUNT
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Please continue to show your ignorance Reuben.
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PLEASE CONTINUE TO BE AN @RSE
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Good logical thoughts there Reuben. The use of upper case is particularly impressive.
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MAKES IT EASIER FOR YOU TO READ NUMPTY. NO WONDER THEY GOT RID OF YOU FROM YOUR JOB AS A TAX INSPECTOR - PMSL
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I don't know what makes you think that I have been a tax inspector.
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Guessing reuben. Just like you did when you dished out your last piece of tax advice.
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""I will advise on tax when paid to do it""
When someone said the above, you can tell that it was best interest for him if there are nobody willing to give any free advice or discussion on the subject matter. When there is any competition, price usually goes down!!!! end of it. |
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WELL SAID ALWAYS
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If anyone does pay tax on their winnings then please contact me ASAP....I have lots of gambling losses to offset against other taxable income :^0
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How petty can you get Alex, still good to see you shown up for the pedantic old fool you are.
How old are you Alex, just wondering how many more years of your witty quips i have to put up with, over 100, please say yes ? Just carry on getting your little arbs you irrelevant old meldrew. |
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F*ck me. Just remembered I'm due a rebate from the Student Loans people. Whoopee! :)
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You appear to be easily upset Mr RAT. Have you considered anger management therapy? Perhaps you ought to trot along with reuben.
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once more alex the old wrinkled bawbag turns a genuine thread into a huge**ging match.
moron. |
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hello stalker
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Alex the old wrinkled retainer 21 Dec 17:12
[..] Investor: In your circumstances your profit may currently be considered to not be within the charge to tax. But your circumstances may not be the same as others. Would you say the following is correct: A private individual living and paying tax in Britain, will not be liable to pay tax on their betfair winnings under any circumstances, unless current rules are changed. |
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Suppose that "private individual living and paying tax in Britain" were a bookmaker. I think under those circumstances HMRC might be a bit interested in his betfair winnings.
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Dr Evil has it right. They might also be interested in skimmers for example.
It is just plain wrong to say that profits from a betting exchange are not liable to tax without understanding how the profit is generated. Bear in mind that the tax case on which the current R&C view is based was not by a unanimous decision and was heard 83 years prior to the existence of betting exchanges. |
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Suddenly it not so black and whyte :)
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I had the same problem as the OP re the student loans company coming after me for payments and I had to provide lots of statements and an explanation of how I was supporting myself with no income and no benefits. They were fine with it once a proper explanation was provided. You can't blame them for chasing these cases up.
I've also had a confirmation from Inland Revenue saying none of my gambling winnings are taxable and it is not classed as income. |
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Dr Evil 21 Dec 18:45
Suppose that "private individual living and paying tax in Britain" were a bookmaker. I think under those circumstances HMRC might be a bit interested in his betfair winnings. Alex the old wrinkled retainer 21 Dec 19:00 Dr Evil has it right. They might also be interested in skimmers for example. It is just plain wrong to say that profits from a betting exchange are not liable to tax without understanding how the profit is generated. Bear in mind that the tax case on which the current R&C view is based was not by a unanimous decision and was heard 83 years prior to the existence of betting exchanges. The reason I said 'private individual' was to rule out bookmakers, who are obviously operating a business! |
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Do all businesses (as opposed to just bookmakers) pay tax on gambling profits?
Surely you couldn't get away with lowering your profit with gambling losses if you run a restaurant or a shop :D I would expect these guys do for instance: http://www.centaursportfunds.com/ |