Those Hoping for a 2nd referendum

Ferret left.

Be plenty of of Milkshaking Action from the Seethers

I can't wait to see the UK Voter Turnout statistics. In particular the number of votes cast for politicians OTHER than UKIP and the Brexit Party representatives. 

EVERY Remainer would surely have voted against UKIP/Brexit Party, given their much-stated and oft-repeated (Pretendy) LOVE of the European Union. Right?

I'm sure that many will attempt to argue that case once the figures are available, we'll also see other spurious interpretations of the result.

Yes indeed, I'm sure we'll see all sorts of ludicrous 'explanations' of why 'Remain' supporters failed to cast their votes for politicians who oppose Brexit.

Still puzzles me that the UK always holds elections on a weekday because they deem the population too drunk when people don't have to show up for work.

First statistic of note will be on turnout: 1999 24%, 2004 39%, 2009 35%, 2014 36%.

Last five General elections : 2001 59%, 2005 61%, 2010 65%, 2015 66%, 2017 69%
The 2016 EU referendum had a turnout of 72%

sounds like it might not crack 40 from projections

Suspect it will be closer to thirty than forty.

May 25, 2019 -- 3:22PM, edy wrote:

Still puzzles me that the UK always holds elections on a weekday because they deem the population too drunk when people don't have to show up for work.

does that seem all that outrageous by all the Brits you know?

Table: European Parliament election turnout % by country 1979—2014

1979 1984 1989 1994 1999 2004 2009 2014

United Kingdom 
32.35% 32.57% 36.37% 36.43% 24% 38.52% 34.7% 35.60%

Average EU Turnout
61.99% 58.98% 58.41% 56.67% 49.51% 45.47% 42.97% 42.61%


"The reason why British General Elections are held on Thursdays is because this day of the week was, in most cases, the traditional market day. As a result of this, most people would be in town and, therefore, be able to vote in addition to purchasing their wares."

I've not gotten to know the British as being drunk to the level that would render them unable to participate in elections held on a Sunday.

Wikipedia tells me

It has been suggested that this tradition arose as the best of several circumstances: Friday pay-packets would lead to more drunken voters on Fridays and weekends; having the election as far after a Sunday as possible would reduce the influence of Sunday sermons; many towns held markets on Thursdays, thus the local population would be travelling to town that day anyway.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Election_Day_(United_Kingdom)

.

Well if the current deadlock continues then are alternatives are

a) We leave without a deal
b) 2nd Referendum(we will vote to remain would be my prediction)

If leave looks like winning by a bigger margin they'll never have a 2nd vote and they'll make out its leave who don't want it, and then proceed to keep kicking the can down the road for ever and ever

aaronh, I think 40% or under was fav at 10/11 or thereabouts.

I don`t know anybody from the pub who even voted and it`s a big pub

The results for the European elections aren't even in, I highly doubt they will show a heavy leave vote but we will see.

I highly doubt they will show a heavy leave vote but we will see.

n88uk    26 May 19 00:11 

The results for the European elections aren't even in, I highly doubt they will show a heavy leave vote
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Where the F*** have you been?

Have you not heard of this bloke called FARAGE?
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PS ..... You are posting on a Forum on a Betting Site...

- For YOUR OWN SAKE - Please Do NOT ever place a BET again.

Bit harsh to tell him to never place a bet ever again. He could know his stuff about e.g tennis.

Farage doesn't bet, therefore I'd assume that he lacks many of the numeracy, risk assessment, bankroll management etc. skills that us punters acquire along the way.

Go on then, what is the evidence of this heavy leave vote...

May 26, 2019 -- 9:10AM, edy wrote:

Bit harsh to tell him to never place a bet ever again. He could know his stuff about e.g tennis.

doubtful

n88uk    26 May 19 10:13 

Go on then, what is the evidence of this heavy leave vote...
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You WILL find out at 10:00pm tonight.

Maybe you guys have different views on what constitutes a heavy leave vote

BXP are gonna win with 30-40 but it shouldn't be considered as heavy by any means

You could even call it a minority.

Surely if UKIP and the Brexit party get a combined result of less than 51% - it demonstrates that the appetite for leaving has declined?

Labour may also be included. We all know Jeremy is a brexiteer at heart.

We will have a GE before any 2nd ref and that is when Lab/Lib will get together
on a (WE NEED ANOTHER VOTE STAND, SORRY FOR SHOUTING) and will no field a full
team in certain areas to make sure they win the marginal seats to get the 2nd ref majority in parliarment

then we have a second ref and that's when the civil war starts as the army will not protect the likes of Corbin
and his cronies or any politician as they have now seen the way they are thrown to the wolves for political capital.

My book The Very Wild Assumption Of A Ticket Office Clerk (Man of the People) goes into print in 2525 published by Zager & Evans

In the year 2525....

#RevokeA50

Heavy Brexit vote delivered in England. In your face, n88!

With the treasonous Welsh and Scottish people delivering a remain vote it is becoming increasingly obvious that English nationalism must rise and get rid of the quislings, the leeches, the enemies of the real people that surround the nation.

English money for English priorities!
English democracy for English people without Welsh and Scottish sabotage!

The racist remainers will still want us to stay in the 99% white European Parliament with its strong National Front presence.

A huge shame on you to the racist Liberal Democrats. They must be stopped.

Well if the current deadlock continues then are alternatives are

a) We leave without a deal
b) 2nd Referendum(we will vote to remain would be my prediction)

There will be all sorts of spin put on the statistics but if you amalgamate the Brexit and UKIP vote and do a bit of educated maths as to the percentage of Conservative and Labour vote that want Brexit. Put that down as ‘The Leave Vote’ and all else as ‘The Remain Vote’.

Haircut the Remain Vote (again, admitting this is educated guesswork) to account for the EU nationals that voted in the EU elections, presumably overwhelmingly for Remain - who cannot vote in a second referendum - and you get a roughly even split, just like we did in 2016 and just like we will if we go for another referendum.

NO ONE HAS, EFFECTIVELY CHANGED THEIR MINDS!

So for all the column inches, the social media postings, the ‘education of the elctorate’, the interviews, the speeches, the negotiations and the blather, we are still where we were.

Another referendum is another coin toss that will satisfy nobody.

Either revoke Article 50 or prepare for then initiate WTO and face the political consequences of either course of action, ideally by articulating a vision of the country you want under either.

The time for a mythical, non-existent compromise is over. We need conviction politicians with energy and vision and a civil service to back them

There will be more interpretations of the EU election results than the number of votes that were cast, confirming that people can only see what they want to see when it comes to Brexit.

What needs to be understood is that the EU has changed overnight, all EU MP's were up for re-election.

Additionally, both Donald Tusk and Jean-Claude Juncker's terms of office will come to a close, the positions of President of the European Council and President of the European Commission are now subject to an election process.

It only takes one EU member to veto a UK request for a further extension to the article 50 process.
France was very close to applying that veto prior to the granting of the October extension, Tusk and Juncker using their influence to make it happen.

As such, the only way that the UK can take back control of this crazy process is to revoke Article 50.

Crashing out with no deal is not taking control, requesting a further extension under current circumstances is equally not something where we can guarantee that we get what we want.

As such, the only way that the UK can take back control of this crazy process is to revoke Article 50.

Fine - then what?

Pause and reflect.

If you want to have a subsequent referendum, then you can.
If you want to have a general election, then you can.

But first, take away the ticking clock that has paralysed the function of government and get back to doing some governing.

There will be huge consequences if you take either of those options so doing the one you think is best for the country would be a better idea.

I think we leave Europe and become the chief middle man between USA and China, our New best friends.

Indeed there would be significant consequences, there are also consequences of continuing to drift aimlessly as we presently are.
I do not pretend to have all, or any, of the definitive answers, and nobody has a solution that will satisfy all.

So what is best for the country?

I would suggest that leaving the EU without knowing what your are leaving to do is not in the best interest of the country.

the queens been bit once by mrs mays  lies about a stable government
a new tory leader telling the queen they can form a government around a no deal scenario ,where 2,3 tory mp,s against it blows the government apart is for the birds, imo

alun2005    25 May 19 14:47 
I can't wait to see the UK Voter Turnout statistics. In particular the number of votes cast for politicians OTHER than UKIP and the Brexit Party representatives. 

EVERY Remainer would surely have voted against UKIP/Brexit Party, given their much-stated and oft-repeated (Pretendy) LOVE of the European Union. Right?



65%

Pause and reflect.

If you want to have a subsequent referendum, then you can.
If you want to have a general election, then you can.

But first, take away the ticking clock that has paralysed the function of government and get back to doing some governing.

A subsequent referendum would be another cointoss (if it was a pure In / Out vote), satisfying noboldy or gerrymandered to give an obviously flawed result in the case of any other options.

A General Election has appeal. The flaw is that, as with last time, it wouldn't be all about Brexit but, paradoxically that is also it's strength. It would force parties to articulate not only their stance on Brexit but on their vision of the country after Brexit or (I'm guessing in the case of Lib Dems or Smallchange UK if they are still going next week) Unilaterally remaining in the EU.

That would be very interesting. It would force Brexit to become a grown-up party rather than a vehicle for protest and it would force the Lib Dems to say a) how they think Britain's future in the EU would go after we've caused all this trouble - our rebate? Our adherance to the £? Our Schengen opt out? and b) the effect of cancelling democracy for 17.4 million eople on social cohesion and law and order?

It would also force Labour and Conservatives to p1$$ or get off the pot

I think leave would win by more

The fact the remain lot are applying some ridiculous logic that clearly doesn't exist tells me they are petrified, watching the BBC entertain that last night was cringe worthy

all the other parties combined are now a super duper coalition remain party? you can't distinguish between a "remainer" voting for tories and someone who is voting for them because they are their lifelong party, some will never betray the party they have voted for all their life, they are to loyal at that point

But let the remain lot have their little illogical argument

Brexit Party is sending loads of MEPs, but the fact still remains we shouldn't be there ffs

The remain voters had more reason to vote this time round ,the leave voters had more reason to vote in 2016 so would think it comes in around maybe 54-46 remain this time so remainers get a 2nd ref and win 52-48.AH the Scots now demand another ref would not be abl to refuse this now and they vote to leave the UK,calls now for another ref on the EU as it now 55-45 leave vote.

its not rocket science leavers don't want a 2nd reff and the tory,s don't want a GE, and theres a simple reason for both, but both leavers and torys will tell you its undemocratic to find out the simple reason

If there was another vote leave would win absolutely guaranteed

There's no way remain win now and its actually them that don't want the vote again, in case people haven't noticed its a bunch of remainers running the damn show down there in westwinster

if you take the view as people keep telling us labour brexiteer voters left the party in droves that gives Brexit supporting parties 40% at best on yesterdays vote 12% less than the reff ,take those out who don't want to leave without a deal its probably sub 35% and that's with a one policy Brexit party with a simple one party one policy message

One thing that strikes me as odd increasingly so at every election these days, is big halls filled with people sitting at trestle tables counting thousands of bits of paper by hand.

Why on earth, in this day and age, can't voting be done online?  Not only would this allow far more people to vote easily without having to traipse to a local polling station (not to mention the tens of thousands that aren't at home on election day, and don't organise themselves enough to get a postal or proxy vote), but also results could be declared pretty much instantly as soon as polls close.

Just issue each registered voter with a one-time code that they use to record their vote.  Will cut down on some of the multiple frauds we've seen in certain constituencies.  Surely it's the way forward.  Or hasn't the last twenty years happened to the political decision makers?

dear god don't advocate for everything to go online. the technology really isn't there yet.
the internet is still in its infancy

This is what i think would happen

As i said above 2016 it was in the leavers interest to come out and vote(remainers thought it was a no brainer)

this time round it was in the remainers interest to come out and vote and as yougov came out and said at this election the heavy leave areas of the country did not vote same as remainers last time

And look at Scotland if they do for any reason get independence leave would win comfortably

The only thing that is clear in this almighty mess, is that there is not a simple solution, no matter how much certain individuals wish to tell you that there is.

A second referendum would create untold devise debate, the process of attempting to arrive at the question to be put to the electorate would be carnage.
We would see more of the same one eyed behaviours that plight UK political discussion, various parties arguing their case, unwilling or unable to acknowledge the merits of alternatives.

After that process, you would be guaranteed to have dissatisfaction with any result that it produced.
As for a general election, it is difficult to imagine that it wouldn't result in a hung parliament.

Anyway, I was digging around last week, researching the results of past general elections, when memories of James Goldsmith's Referendum party were reignited.

I'd forgotten all about him, picked up 2.6% of the popular vote way back in 1997 when Tony Blair swept to power in a landslide 177 majority victory for Labour. 

A bit of trivia for you regarding Jimmy courtesy of Wikipedia:

He received his formal education at Millfield, and Eton College, which he left early in 1949 at the age of 16, after winning a horse racing bet of £10 on a three-horsed accumulator Lewes, winning £8,000 (equivalent to about £262,000 in March 2017).[7] With his winnings he decided that he should leave Eton immediately; in a speech at his boarding house he declared that, "a man of my means should not remain a schoolboy!"

2 myths put out daily by leavers heard francois,baker continue the myth in last 24hrs
1,eu agreed a Canada style free trade deal not a shred of evidence to prove this and eu always insisted any deal follows agreement on a withdrawl bill,
and only thing agreed in commons malthouse agreement might have been agreed between tory,s but laughed out of court by eu and just a smokescreen used by may and whips to keep illusion of agreement in commons going, for eu,s benefit