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why do people eat animals?
why do people eat animals?
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although i'm certainly not saying that vegans have the higher taste - that would be wrong ,but i feel vegans do eat a wider range of food over time , maybe frequent visits to ethnic shops and greater likelihood of cooking skills/cook-books
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meat is a treat.
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I'm not sure you can make that generalisation, coachbuster. Vegans probably do eat a wider range of vegetation than omnivores but exclude all meat, fish, egg and dairy products which run into the hundreds. Just think of all the cheeses and all the things you can make with eggs and milk for a start.
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there is more choice in the dairy/meat area agreed Foinavon,but as a general rule folk don't explore that much maybe because of cost , effort or lack of knowledge so stick to the safe meat and 2 veg ....
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first time i went to a vegan restaraunt i noticed there was a wide range of foods on offer which surprised me somewhat but i wouldn't have the skill to replicate those dishes ...and the ones i tried were tasty .
if i went to a standard restaraunt/ pub and asked for the vegan choice i would get served the biggest pile of slop imaginable |
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should have added that there are also a HUGE number of vegans out there who eat 'badly' .... so it's an either/or situation .
nice to see a vegan winner on CMDW the other day ..that's an achievement considering how much grief they get from the MTV crew (meat and two veg)  |
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CDWM*
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The meat and two veg crew have the money behind them. That's the food manufacturers.
They'll use any tactic available to rubbish the claims or concerns of vegans. |
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They boldly claim that drinking cows milk promotes strong bones and teeth.
Milk contains calcium, so why shouldn't it? Yet in a lecture here, reports conducted by the milk manufacturers to prove exactly that, fall down badly under scrutiny and seem to show the reverse. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TJvrlwnEqbs |
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there is more choice in the dairy/meat area agreed Foinavon,but as a general rule folk don't explore that much maybe because of cost , effort or lack of knowledge so stick to the safe meat and 2 veg ....
Agree that is often the case and a lot of people live mainly on junk food or ready meals because they can't find the time to cook. That's a long video Dr C and I haven't watched it yet. There is a huge vested interest in the dairy industry and we have been brain-washed by commercials. Many of the products aimed at children are laced with sugar to make them more acceptable and this could be adding to potential problems down the line. Flooding our bodies with calcium doesn't necessarily lead to healthy teeth and bones, there are other factors such as Vitamin D and we know that sugar is a major cause of tooth decay. |
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It's not the amount of calcium we eat that matters, it's the amount we can absorb and use that is the point.
The excuse the manufactures made for the milk study showing the opposite of what they wanted to prove in the video I gave, was that the high protein present in the skimmed milk was responsible for leeching calcium from the bodies of the women in the control group. As regards sugar, a high sugar diet is in fact a high fat diet. There's absolutely no doubt about that, when 30% of fructose turns to fat. These free fatty acids then cause insulin resistance which becomes pre-stage 2 diabetes and finally Stage 2 diabetes. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ckN6WM6MeJI |
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people too influenced by adverts - some folk need protecting from themselves
 on the vegan front i believe that all vegans will be satisfied regardless as they haven't resorted to killing /mistreating animals to survive ... many have found ways of making food taste good ,and even if it doesn't taste great they will feel it's a victory anyway . I have worried about the diet of some vegans though and worried about how they get ANY vitamins as their diet seems devoid of goodness ,esp those that don't eat like veggies  ...although that could equally apply to carnivores |
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Erectile dysfunction is a problem in men caused mainly by clogged arteries.
Which is an early warning sign of a future heart attack. Your John Thomas needs an adequate supply of blood in order to stand to attention. All Viagra does is to open up the arteries temporally to allow it to happen. Vegan doctors claim that when a plant-based diet without animal products is eaten, the problem of erectile dysfunction can cure itself without the need for drugs. I'd say if true, that is pretty strong evidence of the damage that eating animal based foods is doing to us. |
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Love the half baked and non scientific studies peddled by the vegan propoganda puppets on here (The China Diet tripe is completely debunked in the first link below for example). Proper, scientific study shows us meat is very beneficial to our health. And, as a bonus it's the best part of any meal
 http://www.healthy-holistic-living.com/top-11-biggest-lies-vegan-diets.html https://www.authorityhealthmag.com/eating-meat-is-good-for-health/ https://naturalon.com/6-of-the-biggest-lies-most-vegans-believe-4-is-the-worst/view-all/ The key is a healthy, balanced diet (including good quality meat) and cut out over eating processed meats loaded with sugar and bad fats. |
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Fair enough charwell.
You believe what you want to believe. |
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"The key is a healthy, balanced diet (including good quality meat) and cut out over eating processed meats loaded with sugar and bad fats."
Which part of this quote is unbelievable Dr ? |
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I've already set out my position, you'll have to read through the thread.
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What is my position by the way?
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“What is my position by the way?”
Well you appear to be a very gullible and naive person who believes everything he/she watches on YouTube imho. Now if you could give me the common courtesy of answering my specific question that would be great, if it’s beyond your intellectual capacity then that’s not a problem ‘Dr’ |
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I see rudeness and lack of decent manners of how to address others from certain people don't get any better on here.
THEMONEYSHOT, asks for common courtisy. Yet without any provocation, he comes on calling me gullible and naive and questioning my intellectual capacity to answer anyway. The same applies to charwell, whose post I failed to address in detail simply because I feel there is no point in discussing stuff with people who express themselves in that way. I could easily prove the case with a couple of posts, yet why should I give them anything? What is about posting on here that brings out so much aggression and anger in people? |
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I agree about milk, it's a substance that has been heavily misadvertised. Re meat and veganism i personally don't think that natural meat is the problem. I don't think that the meat studies done use organic pasture-fed animals. Instead they use animals that are pumped full of hormones and toxins and fed food full of toxins. As such they store all of this cr*p in their flesh (and milk) which people consume. It's a bit like getting people to go for a run around Oxford Street twice a day for 5 years and then concluding that running causes lung cancer.
I'm not saying people should eat meat, not at all, but if you do, then make sure it's the right kind of meat. And if you are a vegan make sure you are getting B12, I know a lot of vegans take supplements for this. |
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Interesting that you know about B12 U.A.
It's obvious that you've taken more than just a passing interest in diet. |
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The milk study and the loss of bone density suffered by the control group in the video I submitted, is understandable if one is aware of the role that protein plays here.
Meat and animal products loaded with protein are acidic. The kidneys don't like an acid environment so they attempt to neutralise the acid using calcium, which they pull from the bones. This can lead to calcium deficiency and osteoporosis. And what's the answer to this? Why of course to drink more milk which contains more calcium. Only it doesn't get absorbed. And completely ignores the protein contained in the milk which is the real culprit. Yet the Western diet is based on consuming large amounts of animal protein. |
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Oooooh I do love a good steak !
However ...I guess our reason for this is we consider them (animals) as "inferior" So then how would we feel if Aliens ...on the same basis that we're inferior ate us ? Maybe it's already happening..  |
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Dr Crippen; you have misrepresented flawed study 'as fact.'
I have posted links to proper, scientific study which show the obvious shortcomings on the 'China Study' etc. You make this research sound like it was written on the back of a **** packet with an off hand, pompous retort; when the opposite is true. Unlike the biased propaganda you have swallowed which contains little to zero credibility. Vitamin B12 is onLy found in meat products. Taking supplements for this is questionable as the body struggles to absorb any vitamins via supplements. If you choose to be vegan then that is your prerogative. However, your moral crusade with it's half baked theories is rather difficult to swallow. |
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Oh, Dr please be aware that animal proteins are complete; unlike plant proteins. BOTTOM LINE:
Animal foods are the highest quality protein sources. Plant sources lack one or more amino acids, which makes it more difficult to get all the amino acids that your body needs. https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/animal-vs-plant-protein |
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I have posted links to proper, scientific study
No you haven't you've simply offered magazine type on-line articles about eating food. The second link that promotes meat eating shows a young girl eating a piece of scorched meat, which flies in the face of even conventional wisdom about the dangers of eating burned protein. They don't seem to be aware of the obvious dangers let alone the more far-reaching health hazards of eating meat. All they talk about is nutrition. The last link again is not a study, but simply more opinion which fails to even consider the dangers in eating meat, which extensive studies such as the China Project have drawn our attention to. That's a common trick to talk about nutritional values, instead of addressing the dangers associated with eating animal products. And you talk about half-baked theories, yet you can't even begin to address them. |
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Long story short, the only data from The China Study that supports Thomas and Colin Campbell’s book is that conducted on rats. However, much of the findings actually disprove him. The book is completely made up so that he could line his pockets with PETA’s handouts. The fact that he had to so blatantly misrepresent his own research supports my argument that no study ever conducted suggests a vegan diet is preferential for health. NOWADAYS NO SELF RESPECTING SCIENTIST BELIEVES THIS TWADDLE.
Loads of links in this article which show the obvious flaws and selective use of data: https://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/the-china-study-more-flaws-exposed-in-the-vegan-bible/ P.S within all my links the scientific research used is quoted and indexed in the 'magazine' type articles. These aren't from OK or Hello; but from respected health publications. They have no allegiance or axe to grind. All my articles used are recent (unlike your out of date and debunked links). |
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much of the findings actually disprove him
Disprove what? Back to proper science; we know that animal protein causes the kidneys to pull calcium from our bones to neutralise the acid environment due to the acid nature of meat. What is also well known is the waste product uric acid which is produced from digesting animal protein. Uric acid is the primary cause of Gout. High levels of uric acid are also a very good indication of the vulnerability of someone in getting a heart attack. Another little trick of uric acid is to inhibit the job of the enzyme responsible for lowering blood pressure. This is all standard stuff. So to recap; the meat eater is: Vulnerable to calcium deficiency. (Osteoporosis) Vulnerable to high blood pressure (Hypertension) And far more likely to get gout than someone who doesn't eat meat and fish. I'd say the three reasons there are enough to consider giving up meat, or at least reducing your intake dramatically, and we haven't even mentioned the three big killers diabetes, heart disease and cancer. |
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What is also well known is the waste product uric acid which is produced from digesting animal protein.
Amongst other things I should add. The body produces uric acid as well independent of diet. |
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"What is about posting on here that brings out so much aggression and anger in people?"
My guess is pompous bores like your good self. Don't bother replying with your predictable mock outrage...I'm off to paint a wall and watch it drying, while eating a steak... Pomposity is when you always think your right. Arrogance is when you know... |
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we know that animal protein causes the kidneys to pull calcium from our bones to neutralise the acid environment due to the acid nature of meat.
That is absolute bollox: https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/is-too-much-protein-bad-for-you All your supposed facts are myths. Science doesn't exist in myth and propaganda. Keep swallowing the flawed ramblings of ardent activists. You have willfully ignored all the proper scientific study within the articles I have linked which include the scientific source references. These include debunking the oft used and incredibly misleading 'studies' that you quote as fact verbatim. If you want to deprive yourself of the pleasure of meat and the goodness it contains then carry on; but cease with the activism in trying to convince everybody else using 'fake facts.' In the land of the blind the one eyed man is king. |
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Brockville seems very angry, that's what becomes of eating too much red meat.
To be fair to charwell, he's in the grip of the food manufacturers and their propaganda machine. Much the same as the cigarette manufactures told us that smoking wasn't harmful. For every study there's another that shows the opposite, depending how the figures are presented or interpreted. Lies damned lies and statistics. I notice he's only challenged one of my examples. What about the other two? |
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Here's the reply to charwell's magazine article.
http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/78/3/584S.full My source is the American Journal of Clinical Nutrition. And you can't get better than that. First line: High dietary protein intakes are known to increase urinary calcium excretion and, if maintained, will result in sustained hypercalciuria. Looks like the first set goes to me - two to go. |
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We eat animals because if we didnt we would forever be walking through animal sh1t
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It's a shame you read the first line and not the complete article as it goes against what you are saying and supports me
 High dietary protein intakes are known to increase urinary calcium excretion and, if maintained, will result in sustained hypercalciuria. To date, the majority of calcium balance studies in humans have not detected an effect of dietary protein on intestinal calcium absorption or serum parathyroid hormone. Therefore, it is commonly concluded that the source of the excess urinary calcium is increased bone resorption. Recent studies from our laboratory indicate that alterations in dietary protein can, in fact, profoundly affect intestinal calcium absorption. In short-term dietary trials in healthy adults, we fixed calcium intake at 20 mmol/d while dietary protein was increased from 0.7 to 2.1 g/kg. Increasing dietary protein induced hypercalciuria in 20 women [from 3.4 +/- 0.3 ( +/- SE) during the low-protein to 5.4 +/- 0.4 mmol/d during the high-protein diet]. The increased dietary protein was accompanied by a significant increase in intestinal calcium absorption from 18.4 +/- 1.3% to 26.3 +/- 1.5% (as determined by dual stable isotopic methodology). Dietary protein intakes at and below 0.8 g/kg were associated with a probable reduction in intestinal calcium absorption sufficient to cause secondary hyperparathyroidism. The long-term consequences of these low-protein diet-induced changes in mineral metabolism are not known, but the diet could be detrimental to skeletal health. Of concern are several recent epidemiologic studies that demonstrate reduced bone density and increased rates of bone loss in individuals habitually consuming low-protein diets. Studies are needed to determine whether low protein intakes directly affect rates of bone resorption, bone formation, or both. I simply couldn't be bothered to highlight the glaring factual errors of your other myths represented as facts; as the answers are in my earlier links. You can lead a horse to water............... |
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I make that GSM.
Dr Charwell wins v Pompous Quack 6-0, 6-0, 6-0. My work here is done. Dr Charwell. |
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Increasing dietary protein induced hypercalciuria in 20 women [from 3.4 +/- 0.3 ( +/- SE) during the low-protein to 5.4 +/- 0.4 mmol/d during the high-protein diet].
Why didn't you highlight that bit? You're getting confused - the first line of the message is the one you should read if the rest is beyond you. |
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I'm afraid comprehension of the written word is your handicap charwell.
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I have to admit to having a sirloin wing rib today.
And I loved every bite. |