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Cheltenham Festival
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These 719 comments are related to the topic:
Samcro
Samcro
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Replies: 719
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As posted earlier on the thread, on a line through Paloma Blue and Duc des Genièvres, his form is only comparable with Next Destination.
I think ND will give him a really good race if he goes here. |
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CCM - your comparing races over 2 and 2.5 miles. Need to consider like with like.
If you look at the races over same distance with Jez then you see Samcro is clearly best without even being off the bridle Forty |
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I really like Next Destination and love how he has seemed to quicken clear in his last 2 races, his hurdling last time was a joy to behold as well, as slick as I have seen a novice hurdler this season. Get the idea he is one that will find plenty for pressure and it would not surprise me at all where he to put it right up to Samcro, Samcro was stunning on Sunday though.
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Jetz not Jez
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Forty. Fair point. But if anything Id say both the animals I mentioned are better over 2m4f.
Clearly he looks hugely exciting and has just won a Grade One in a canter. But I just don't think his form sets him so far apart that he's already the winner of the race. |
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Personally I would love to see Samcro in the Neptune because I have Getabird in the Supreme. Just abit worried now how easy Sam disposed of the 2 miler I don't really think it will mayter what race he goes in. It's easily a banker for me
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CCM i can see were you are coming from but this is why racing is so good with the different opinions..
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Exactly Quevega!
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I must say this Cheltenham forum is much more jovial and nice than the main racing one :D
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It has to be the Ballymore for me too - they see him as a big, future, 3m Gold Cup horse, so I personally wouldn't put him in the Supreme. Even looking at recent history, the likes of Best Mate, Kicking King, War of Attrition and Sizing John have all got beat in a Supreme but won a Gold Cup.
I know every year is different, but doesn't seem logical to me to put him over the minimum distance when his future is over much further. Albert Bartlett can be a brutal race, so Ballymore is the best compromise. |
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CCM - I think the fact Cracking Smart was in front of DDG says a lot. If Samcro had run in the same race he would have finished well clear of Cracking Smart. Key bit of form (and assumption) which tells me Samcro is well clear of ND. Just my conclusion. We will see on the day. I still stick to my previous conclusion that ND runs in the AB.
Forty |
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Quevega6 - I’ve got Getabird in the supreme also.
Samcro my big bet and hoping ND goes for AB. Treble on the 3 also. I can hope can’t I. Forty |
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Hope you are right re ND Forty. Would suit me down to the ground. Good luck with the treble.
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That would be a smashing treble to touch considering they were all open to different races. I think Next Dest should run in the AB but will run against Samcro as he's in the A Team for Mullins but Good Luck!!
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My guess is Getabird runs in Supreme and both Samcro and ND in Ballymore. Getabird and ND way ahead of anything Samcro has beaten. The AB is for the slow mos.
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Cracking Smart couldn't shine Samcros hoofs. ND fans clutching at straws.
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arklarkles post 2 posts ago is what Mullins wants to happen. Many seem to agree getabird and samcro have 2 winners medals reserved already. It would suit WPM for samcro to up in trip. He will fancy having a go at him with ND, having already bagged the supreme.
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Would have been nice for CM to have booster the form a bit the other day
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Gordon Elliott is still favouring the Ballymore Novices' Hurdle at the Cheltenham Festival next month for Samcro despite his impressive victory over two miles last Sunday.
The two-mile-five-furlong Ballymore had been viewed as his most likely destination, but he also holds entries in the Albert Bartlett Novices' Hurdle over three miles as well as the Supreme over two. He impressed in winning the Deloitte Novice Hurdle at Leopardstown last weekend, extending his unbeaten run under Rules to six in the process, but Elliott is still favouring the Ballymore above his other Festival options. "He's good. He'll go straight to Cheltenham now anyway," said Elliott. "Everybody probably knows that the Ballymore is where I'd say he's going to go at the moment. We'll let the horse do the talking and Cheltenham is the plan now." |
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Is it right the stat in the racing post that this race is usually finished in a quicker time than the supreme?
If so would that be a pos or neg for him? think 2m where he can call the shots might be best. |
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My mistake in reading what was said sorry folks.
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Stuart Riley, reporter
I would target the Supreme because Samcro looks perfectly designed for the demands of the race. It is in effect a stamina test for inexperienced, young horses and everything connections have said about Samcro suggests his future will be over further. Altior is the only Supreme winner since the 2012 festival to finish off his race quicker than the Ballymore winner – despite the latter being run over five furlongs further. That is because they go slower through the early stages in the Ballymore and then kick for home harder – usually somewhere between the fourth- and second-last. Given the way Samcro travels through his races and his ability to keep galloping relentlessly all the way to the line, he is absolutely made for the Supreme. He may still be up to winning a Ballymore but due to the nature of the two races it is leaving more to chance. |
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That suggests the Ballymore is the best race for Samcro imo.
Can’t agree with Stuart Riley’s conclusion. Forty |
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Samcro is not just a relentless galloper, he also has speed and quickens away from his rivals. Although i'd agree that he would be suited to the Supreme i think he would be better suited to the Ballymore for those reasons.
Some serious pocket talking going on with this horse given there were some decent prices NRNB for the Supreme, to be had, before his Deloitte win. |
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Connections have stated his ultimate target is winning the Gold Cup, and the Ballymore/Neptune is a stepping stone towards it. I think the Supreme is unlikely, even less lightly than the Champion Hurdle given the prestige and admiration attached - he has the class and ability, just lacking the experience. And many here, yours truly included, would back him at 3/1 or less; he exudes class, and a future champion.
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Either the Supreme or Ballymore would not hinder his ultimate path toward staying chaser, this business about running in the Supreme wouldn't be ideal because it would get him used to running too quick, well...
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Assuming the shoe is on the other foot and you are the lucky owner of Samcro whose ultimate objective is winning the Gold Cup.
Apart from offloading him to the highest bidder which race would you run him in? For me, and without a moment's hesitation I'd go for the Ballymore/Neptune; if not, I'd go for the Champion Hurdle rather than the Supreme, why? If it was the Supreme then the following year I'd be very tempted to go for the Champion Hurdle after winning the Supreme - just as good a chance and a short price fav too - which is not the normal progression for the Gold Cup, I firmly believe. |
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Samcro will run in the Ballymore (imo), I've no doubt about but the utter sh1te being posted on here about this crap the Ballymore - Gold Cup horse being the natural progression is utter bull. FFS go back to 2000 and I'd say there is a fair chance more Gold Cup winners have ran in the Supreme than the Ballymore if my memory is correct (Best Mate, Kicking King, War Of Attrition, Sizing John). As far as I can remember only Denman and Imperial Commander ran in the RSA/Neptune/Ballymore Hurdle and went on to win the Gold Cup, the same number that actually ran in the Albert Bartlett (Bobs Worth and Coneygree) and went on to win the Gold Cup.
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It's a wonder that the likes of Faugheen, Hardy Eustace and Istabraq won a CH after being taught to run too slow in their novice season and My Way De Solzen must have been a super horse to win a Stayers before an Arkle.!!
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My view. Its totally irrelevant and complete b0ll0x for anyone to suggest running Samcro in either the Supreme or Ballymore makes the slightest difference to his Gold Cup potential 2-3 years down the line. What a load of tripe being spewed on here on this topic. Elliott is clear he wants to run him in Ballymore. O'Leary has suggested Ballymore. Supreme its is then !!!!
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99% of the time horses aren't racing competitively so surely they would pick up bad habits on the gallops doing fast canters etc... There can be various reasons why a horse doesn't settle in a race and pace might be one. Sometimes a horse gets worked up or is fresh.
MTOY could never settle regardless of how fast they went. Total Recall couldn't settle last Sunday because he was clearly fresh and wanted to race early. Anyhow that's how i see it. GL |
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Stick to your opinions chaps and I'll stick to mine! Really doesn't bother me either way, the horse will run in the Ballymore and p*ss up, everything else is rather irrelevant in the grand scheme of things
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Does not bother me either. Got any race at 2/1 with Footpad at 5/1.
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cheeky, big time bet?
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Only for £20 each doubles/trebles: with Faugheen; with Faugheen and Footpad; with Might Bite (King George); with Might Bite and Footpad. Footpad was a pure punt solely because of the owners otherwise would abstained from Mullins/Ricci antepost post Vautour Ryanair debacle. Hoping all turn up, but looking to lay Faugheen on opening day, come what may.
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some nice looking doubles and trebles there mate, best of luck with them!
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Footpad was a pure punt solely because of the owners otherwise would abstained from Mullins/Ricci antepost post Vautour Ryanair debacle.
But you backed Faugheen! |
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But Faugheen at 13/8 and 15/8 and Might Bite at 5/2 and 11/4; Footpard was the asture one (as above) and £2 trebles with Clemmie (1000G) and either Saxon Warrior or Pentagon (both Derby).
Samcro and Footpad will make or break my Festival, and a consolation if either Sizing John or Might Bite wins the Gold Cup. |
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Eddie O’Leary today “Samcro runs in the Ballymore and that’s final”
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