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the problem with some rsa chases is some horses just aren't good enough moving forward...last years race as an example was a poor renewal and was before they started then these poor horses have to go up against seasoned top class campaigners nothing to do with the race itself as these horses would of struggled moving forwards even if they hadn't taken the race in imo
however the race itself is littered with top class horses denman, looks like trouble, albertas run, bobs worth, mr mulligan, long run to name but a few that ran in the race |
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Yep, totally agree....one man, barton bank, good old young hustler and even earth summit ran in it.
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Each to their own really - I've used trends etc as part of my analysis/ betting on the festival for a good few years and have turned a profit in seven of the last eight years so I'd say that approach has served me fairly well! More than one way to skin a cat!
Take on aboard the point about the likelihood of those horses without a recent run not all winning, all part of the fun though with everyone having different approaches etc. |
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By all means stick to what has served you well. I just view things in my own way and it's very analytical. There is such limited data sets that trends are too wide a net for me to use. They're from an older era. The amount of data that is out there now is huge and most importantly the access to race replays.
We've got the RP via the iPad. We've twitter. We've In running odds data. We've downloadable official ratings in excel format. Horse trackers with notes sections. What people try to approximate with trends I feel can be surpassed by individual Analysis. But that as I've said is the approach I'm taking and developing. Meticulous record keeping. I'm still miles off where I want to be but progressing well. I think people should always be looking to adapt. You'll be left behind if you stick to what's tried and trusted. It may be out of date soon. Who knows. |
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cv at this stage what your chelt banker..or have u one til closer to the day?
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I think Faugheen, Hurricane Fly and Felix Yonger look mega strong and the first two are my biggest bets of the festival.
I I think Mullins could be on for a record setting . He has strong favourites in the majority of the grade 1 races. |
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Totally agree Voodo if thats what works for you but some people stick rigidly to the stats. I love the "horses who win the Feltham cant win the RSA". I wonder if trainers after winning the Feltham think "oh well thats ballsed up our chances in the RSA"
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Felix for the Arkle or JLT CV?
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Felix Yonger looks mega strong??
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And how many horses have actually won the RSA after winning the Feltham?
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yes i agree with cvbyrne..felix yonger looks really strong...look at his form bally on gd ground..if he gets his ground he should be favourite for JLT!!
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He's in my ante post bets but wouldn't say he's really strong at all even on good ground. Think CV Byrne fancies Mullins to win every race bar the RSA
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yeah agree with that..totally under estimating the opposition, very biased on the Irish horses or should i say willie mullins horses
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if he gets his ground should be in the Arkle!!
Bally, CV likes Ballycasey for the RSA as well,and hes right to. |
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I don't the problem with fancying Mullins to win in a number of different races, it's different to expecting him to win them all. I fancy a horse of his in all the novice hurdles and novice chases. Do I actually think he'll win them all, hell no... But I don't need them all to win to turn a profit.
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Ballycasey,Vautour and Faugheen at this stage all look the best horses in their races,well to me they do.
So I see nowt wrong with backing accordingly. Who cares who trains them??? |
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Agree Budd.
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Bally Felix is completely ground dependent, so his two 2nds on bad ground look some good runs in my opinion. On better ground he's soundly beaten Defy Logic & Trifolium and when he gets his ground he jumps like a cat.
I think the English novices are a sorry bunch by and large this season - with the exception of Nicholls. I also think Hendo's string are not in the best order, he's been very quiet this season something just doesn't sit right. Also where are his novices? Oscar Whisky is the only one even on the edge of the radar. Mullins has two of the wealthiest owners in Ricci & Wiley arming his ranks both hungry for Gold Cup winners so we have seen a powerful string of novices come his way. The reason I fancy his a lot is mostly due to the complete lack of depth in the novice ranks. Go look at the Neptune or Albert Bartlett you've 2 at a push 3 horses who you could say have a good chance, the rest are much of a muchness. You've Red Sherlock as 2nd Fav in the Neptune, he's trained by Pipe who is atrocious at training Grade 1 horses, gets them beat constant at the festival. Not only that but the horse was all out to beat what was Mullins 3rd string for the Albert Bartlett, Rathvinden who was giving him 3lbs and is a 20/1 shot. I think if you went out and backed Champ Fever (4/1), Hurricane Fly (10/3), Quevega (10/11), Faugheen (7/2), Ballycasey (5/1), Black Hercules(8/1), Felix Yonger(10/1) & Briar Hill(5/1) now for whatever stake you'd come out with a handsome profit. He has a stunning string this season. Just because you fancy a lot of Mullins horses doesn't mean that in some way means you'll go and lose money at the festival. My love of Mullins is getting on his lot in October, November, Decmber and sitting there in early March when they have become over bet and going off 6/4 and 13/8. Then people retrospectively going oh if you'd backed all Mullins at sp you'd have made x loss. When one of those 6/4 winners was 5/1 in Feb & 16/1 in November. I think quite a few of those Mullins horses will halve in odds between now and their final sp. Just simply go through each race, one by one. First remove horses who will not run in it, next remove horses who won't win it, then look at whats left, look at what the book of those is priced to. Actually, I'll do this for the Arkle now this evening and throw it up on my site. Sort of explain my thinking on antepost betting. Everyone has their own methods. I can only give my opinions here, I'm not saying anyone else is wrong etc.. it's all just opinions at this stage. They become facts in March ![]() |
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Good post geez...you know I've always got the tongue in the cheek...backed a few of Mullins myself...Faugheen Felix Bally Annie
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Yeah the trends aren't the be all and end all for me when I'm looking at a race, just something I pay consideration to. Like the sound of your approach - I'd love to spend more time looking at racing like that but my spare time seems to have disappeared somewhat with a nine month old son......! Good luck with it all though, sounds good.
For what it's worth I too think Felix Yonger on better ground would have a great chance in the Arkle, only doubt would be that those two runs on heavy going haven't been an ideal prep. Does twitter really turn up much of use?! |
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Couldn't agree more CV and said the same thing a few days ago. Back your chosen top ten of WPM's runners and I just can't we you not making decent money.
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CVB - I've had a hunch that Ruby knew the quality of the Mullins horses prior to quitting PN. I backed both CF and Faugheen with Bill's and NRFB with Victor in November. Backed Vautour with Fred after it's maiden win and Felix NRFB again with Victor. I have also done some multiple bets with the aforementioned and Briar Hill (for AB), and Avrika (for Rynnair).
At the moment I've got the odds and it appear all bar Avrika are going for the race I would like them to run in. But I'm not counting my chickens yet. As you say one winner out of the first 4 mentioned will mean a nice profit. Good punting to all. Forty |
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I forgot I've also gift Ballycasey in the multiple bets but not to win as a single
Forty |
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Agree with CVB. Mullins could well do at Cheltenham what he's done for years at Punchestown, i.e. completely dominate. Do you think, therefore, CVB that Ruby at around 4/6 is a sound bet for champion jockey?
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He's a cracking bet for top jockey. I wouldn't bet it as it's concentration risk. ie I've backed pretty much every Mullins horse so if he didn't win top jock I'd have had a bad Cheltenham most likely
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buddeliea 11 Feb 14 18:55 Joined: 19 Mar 04 | Topic/replies: 10,078 | Blogger: buddeliea's blog
Ballycasey,Vautour and Faugheen at this stage all look the best horses in their races,well to me they do. So I see nowt wrong with backing accordingly. Who cares who trains them??? Budde, that's 3 favourites. 3 horses, 3 races, and 3 favourites. Often the favourite does look the best horse hence their market position, but you can be pretty sure all 3 won't win. Or are you backing (backed) as singles? |
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buddeliea 11 Feb 14 18:55 Joined: 19 Mar 04 | Topic/replies: 10,078 | Blogger: buddeliea's blog
Ballycasey,Vautour and Faugheen at this stage all look the best horses in their races,well to me they do. So I see nowt wrong with backing accordingly. Who cares who trains them??? Budde, that's 3 favourites. 3 horses, 3 races, and 3 favourites. Often the favourite does look the best horse hence their market position, but you can be pretty sure all 3 won't win. Or are you backing (backed) as singles? |
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Have backed Ballycasey early doors,and been fortunate to have a price.
Other 2 are involved in various covering multiples ,missed the prices on those. It is possible that they are still value,but my sort of punting wont back them now. |
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I would suggest that it is never a good idea to back anyone for the leading jockey for any of the festivals until the Sunday evening.
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Ladbr0kes briefly went 2/1 Walsh for top jockey earlier in the week, albeit to small stakes (max £25 I think).
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