Cheltenham Festival
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cue card
cue card
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Replies: 484
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 maybe i should wait till you post judo!! |
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lol we clearly agree on something!
has this ever happened before? |
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not sure it has mate,
they say theres a first time for everything.....even this!!! |
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umm, BW gave him a head start and was having his first run of the season, the point is what caused him to get beat, what made him vulnerable, we know he does not stay 3 miles so he wasn't beaten because it wasn't enough of a test of stamina, and at 2 miles he would have won comfortably that day, so for me, between 2 and 2.4 his competitive ability against the best is compromised, the run was a blinder, but against the best at the trip, he's vulnerable.
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put them at level weights and he pissesss up
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We'll find out just how effective he is over the trip at the festival that's for sure.
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so if CC had beaten bob at level weights by a few lengths,which the finish suggests to me,would it still be doubtful he stayed 2m4?
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yes we will Duffy,especially if the likes of Albertas and Sizing turn up.
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exactly budd
at level weights CC would have won cosily despite the pish poor assistance in the saddle and this discussion would not be taking place watch the replay and you see Tizzard poncing about looking about between the last two fences with the horse swinging... he could have booted much further clear at that point but took it too easy and got worried out of it |
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I agree with Duffy...
He might well have the class (and stamina) to win at the highest level over the trip but we're not sure about that yet. I do have a suspicion that he doesn't want to go that far in the highest company and would worry that there might be some that see out the trip that but better up the Cheltenham hill. Having said this, that comment applies to most of the better ones likely to run in the race, so he could well be good enough to win without running to his best. Also means there could be a mini surprise in the Ryanair... |
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The Newbury run was a shocker of a ride from Tizzard, and yes, he should have won that day.
But I'd be minorly concerned how tamely he dropped out in the King George, with the likes of a not fit Grands Crus staying on the bridle longer and finishing ahead of him despite falling in a hole with two to jump. |
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ffs he is only a second season chaser and tomorrow is only his 8th chase so it is pretty early to be drawing conclusions
and as I said on the antepost forum thread about the race, we should not be paying too much attention to the KG because yet again Tizzard fecked the race up... but this time right at the start. His job was to switch off, get him to settle and get jumping nicely he failed to do any of that right at the start, exposed it on the outside made two jumping errors and had it lit up like a fecking Xmas tree frankly it was a miracle he finished 5th and I am writing it off as an effort |
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He did not settle for a while in the KG and it was desperate ground.
The Ryanair is a furlong more than 2m4 with a hill to climb at the end,so yes a doubt remains,but i would not look at the way he finished with Bobsworth giving 7lb, added to the ride he got,to try and prove he dont stay. |
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he was still pulling Joes arms out about 4 fences from home in the KG!
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All perfectly reasonable explanations, I agree, but so is the one that he doesn't want to go that far in a championship race...
I love the horse and hope he does stay and win well. I'm sure he has the class, just not sure we can make that many excuses based on the King George effort. For one, is there any reason to think Tizzard will ride him much better at the Festival, and for two, he might be relatively inexperienced as a chaser but he's been to the Festival three times and run in some of the biggest races. He's always going to have the potential (especially with Tizzard on board) to light up a bit more readily than perhaps you'd ideally like, so for me he has a big chance but wouldn't necessarily be value just yet. Think he'll win tomorrow as Finian's will hate the ground (and it'll stretch him at the trip), Somersby will do well to get home as well, and Captain Chris must bounce back after a very hard race over what might just be an inadequate trip in this company. That should see his price shorten even more. |
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PS: I am not suggesting his King George form was as good as he is, by any means, but hardly a miracle that he finished fifth! Only seven finished and one of those was Junior, while Grands Crus and Champion Court were in front of him!
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Agree that the jockey is a problem,especially with a horse that can get fizzy.
Horse like him deserves a top jock imo. |
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was a surprise he finished at all after running with the choke out for 2 and a half miles on that going
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yes tomdeane I think he will win on Saturday
will be betting in play though |
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I think Captain Chris looks the most solid tomorrow on the expected ground. I think Somersby is a lay. I think he has no chance personally.
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Well gents, I guess the owners needs to sack the jockey and give the horse to Henderson so Barry can ride it.Or better still,give it to Nicholls so Ruby can do the honours.No word of praise for the fantastic positive ride given to the horse at Exeter,where Cue Card jumped beautifully. Still,when racing is totally dominated by two or three trainers I suppose you will be gratified to see every race won by a handful of jockeys."Horses like hin deserve a top jockey"....it's like saying Garerth Bale deserves to be Brazilian.
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nope not all
very happy to see the smaller yards doing well, the more the merrier but Joe Tizzard is nowhere near a top class jockey and it's more like saying the Red Bull, Ferrari and Maclaren F1 cars deserve to be driven by the fastest drivers not the accident prone idiots that cause all the accidents |
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The reason i said he deserves a top jockey,is because the horse has potential to be a top horse at his optimum distance,whatever that turns out to be,and unfortunately JT is a jock that imo could prevent him doing that.
Its not a case of smaller yards etc,im all for that,we all are i would think. |
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Big day for Cue Card. If he wins, or goes close he will run in the Ryanair. If he struggles to get home over this trip then I think he will be back in the Champion Chase.
I backed him for the Ryanair in October but have since laid him to give me a free bet if he runs. Despite the ground not being as testing as it has been, Ascot is a very stiff track and I suspect 2 miles 5 and a half furlongs there is a very similar test of stamina to 3 miles round Kempton. |
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gone favourite on the exchange now for Ascot
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Same arguments abound with CC as with Long Run.
The main difference to me is that JTcomes from a hard working family and his job is the within that whole framework - he also comes across as a decent, well meaning and pleasant guy unlike SWC |
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that does not make him a competent jockey though
SWC is another matter, he's a gentleman amateur riding his own (daddies) horse for the fun and excitement Tizzards do not own CC and JT is paid to ride him. There are much better jockeys around that cost exactly the same IMVHO, and as someone who has been in racehorse ownership since 1990, the owners are being short changed Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of the horse and the yard (I'm backing Cannington today as well) but not of JT His effort in the saddle at Kempton was nothing short of lazy, incompetent and downright damaging to the horse and his future. He failed to do the first thing right and that messed the race up (bury amongst horses, get settled, jump the first 2 or 3 cleanly, conserve energy - he did the complete opposite). He is just not good enough |
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SWC a gentleman? Don't think so
I'm not making any judgement on JT as a jockey but if you don't like him, don't bet on his rides. Forgive me but it comes across that you just have a ready made excuse when your horse doesn't win if he is riding it. I'm not going to watch the race again, cannot be arsed, but how was the first fence mistake his fault? That is a genuine question? |
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"Tizzards do not own CC and JT is paid to ride him. There are much better jockeys around that cost exactly the same"
Maybe the owners are very good friends of the family and don't like to say anything. It must be very frustrating to be so keen on a horse and have no confidence in the jockey. I remember many years ago thinking Joe Tizzard could end up being AP's successor. Was a bit wrong there  |
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Firstly, the term 'gentleman Amateur' is a title applied to sporting amateurs that are doing it for the thrill. It is not a personal description of SWC himself and if you think that's what I meant you must be pretty ignorant of the history of sport. No offence but it is common knowledge.
I was paying very close attention to the start of the KG, bearing in mind I had backed the horse for the race and the Gold Cup (VCBet offer). I was saying to myself as they circled around right before the start: 'OK, we are going to drop in and take a lead today so we need to get switched off so go on Joe, get yourself buried amongst horses, near the rail ideally... focus now son, the jump here is important, give him the signal to calm down, keep a tight hold now Joe... no, no don't come to the outside for the line up, get inside, get inside GET THE FECK INSIDE... ok well at least make him jump the first then let's take a tug and get behind horses ... oh noooooo race over...' He lined up in the wrong place, just let horse go as soon as the tape went up and about two/three strides before the first decided to switch left to get a clearer view which just lit the horse up and he made a mistake which he never recovered from. I'm sure he did not intend for any of this to happen but it did. It may seem harsh but really it was a very poor effort. Incompetent and unprofessional imo, the horse had been brilliantly prepared and campaigned and was all set to launch himself as a major player in top Grade 1 races and his chance was fatally compromised by a very poor effort from the rider. Maybe he would say he could not foresee what would happen but I did - exactly what happened was my worst case scenario. Gutted to say the least |
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Most people refer to amateurs as amateurs - you used the word gentleman then purely to show off your knowledge of the sport clearly.
I am in no doubt about my ignorance of the sport compared to you. Tou are the oracle, stroll on. One thing I do know is that jockeys put their life and soul on the line for their profession and actually get paid a pittance for doing so. |
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as I said, I've been in ownership for more than 20 years (almost exclusively in NH) and I know very well what jockeys go through, several got put on the deck very hard off of horses I was involved in and got hurt. One young lad fell at a hurdle in a 25 runner hcp and virtually had the whole field go over him as they were all bunched up and he was right at the front... they couldn't miss him and he was black and blue
The issue is not about whether jockeys are brave it's about whether they are good enough |
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Afternoon, Rick.
I've got Cue Card in the forum comp this afternoon. Maybe Joe will get it right today. |
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Much better today. Lovely horse.
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If the ground comes up soft at Cheltenham, I wouldn't be surprised if he ran in the Champion. He was stopping at the end of the race today.
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well I'm very glad he won and I hope it will be onwards and upwards
bring on the Ryan Air |
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120 grand banked. Grade 2 banked. Grade 1 banked. Don't be too despondent,things can only look up when a proper jockey is on board.
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is there a better looking horse in training than cuecard?
i dont think so..... |
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only the Monster I should think
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