* Abandoned meetings during severe weather

For days like this could have the equivalent of the pools panel . The competition settlers could look at the days racing and try and come up with the results . Im sure they will be fair when it comes to their naps

MOMM, I don't think Meydan tomorrow is part of the Dubai carnival, so not sure selections from there are valid

It's just a 'minor' meeting with handicaps and a maiden race.

http://www.dubairacingclub.com/visit/calendar/racing-calendar

Why not put it to the vote in all the divisions then Shane and let the majority decide

N/Rs at abandoned meetings to be replaced by LRF unless a new selection is posted 
The competitions are surely run for everyones enjoyment and not a select few so let the forumites decide which is the fairest solution as the current situation is most definitely open to manipulation .Settlers cant complain as in theory it doesnt give them any further work does it?

It may be all we've got tomorrow George.

No Meydan doesnt count.

Dubai - i replied on the other thread you posted on (calling other settlers), please take a look.

I think i understand where your feeling originate from Dubai.

Why not put it to the vote in all the divisions then Shane and let the majority decide

N/Rs at abandoned meetings to be replaced by LRF unless a new selection is posted 
The competitions are surely run for everyones enjoyment and not a select few so let the forumites decide which is the fairest solution as the current situation is most definitely open to manipulation .Settlers cant complain as in theory it doesnt give them any further work does it?


Firstly see the other thread Dubai & correct me if i`m wrong. Just trying to make sure i understand where views originate.

Whereas the settlers are merely the custodians of the League and any major decisions regarding changes should quite rightly be decided by a majority decision of the players, there is a consistent problem in that the majority never seems to vote! As we've seen time and time again we only ever get a vocal minority involved in discussions, usually accompanied by threats of leaving the comp if a particular change is implemented. So we always tend to go round in circles and the end result is always that nothing changes.

I'm not necessarily saying that I think we're wrong not to have implemented any of the changes previously proposed. 'If it ain't broke, don't fix it' is an expression we often see whenever any potential changes are discussed, and it's a very valid one. All I'm saying is that the highly democratic approach we take coupled with the very small percentage of players who ever voice an opinion probably means that nothing will ever get fixed when it IS broken.

I can see the problem; I don't have the solution.

Please be aware when making selections for Saturday that should the meetings at Kempton and Lingfield both be abandoned before any racing has taken place at either track, then Saturday will be an Optional day with Sunday Rules (i.e. no deductions for non-posters) assuming that Naas is still on.

The meeting at Meydan is not part of the Dubai Festival and is not therefore eligible for Saturday.


Something like that? To be posted when the new threads for tomorrow go up?

Quiet right momms, as you`re aware we`ve had poor turnouts at the polling stations in the past.

See my lated post on the other thread (calling settlers)

Firstly we have to have grounds for major changes, i just don`t feel we need to make major changes in any areas at all, minor ones yes. As i mentioned the other day, as a custodian my main aim is to leave this competition in as good a shape if not better when i retire from settling. I know for sure that with yours, Reg, Weaver & Fch who`s almost on board that will certainly be the case. Reg & yourself have made massive contributions.

We need to ensure that the Betfair comps ship sails on in calm waters.

Going back to my original point, surely we would need more than one or at most two dissenting voices to even look at implementing a minor change. The support would have to be there to begin with, then open it up to the vote.

14:31 post sounds a good idea momms.

Just off out with the dog for half an hour before it gets dark.

Bloody hell momms, me too.

Why has this got so complicated? If a selection is made from an abandoned meeting then its a nr and 0 and if a selection is made at dundalk its still on so should be settled accordingly. For all those that don't want to select one at dundalk tonight tough luck, its on so get the pin out

lag - fair point, as you`re aware i was i favour of it being optional. Problem was, we voted and it came out at 2-2 so i thought the best thing to do in the interests of the whole competition was to back down and move over into to suspended camp in order to reach a swift decision so everyone knew where they stood.

Hi Lagmorian. It's not complicated. This comp is about picking naps at GB meetings organised by the BHA. Presumably at some point a concession was allowed for players to pick from all-Irish meetings governed by the HRI. But a lot of players aren't interested in Irish racing so it definitely shouldn't ever be compulsory. Unfortunately by the time Lingfield was called off today, thereby making it an Optional day, several players had already selected at Dundalk and therefore no longer had the choice of whether to post or not, so to make it fair for everyone the only option was to cancel today.

Are you happy with that wording then Shane? Anything you want to add/amend?

Perfect momms, more or less how i`d have worded it, sentiment being the same.

No worries, good luck explaining that if someone has picked a winner at dundalk later

Hi all,
Just back from work to find all racing (unsurprisingly) off. I have no betfair access during the day.
Is Dubai Prince telling me that, as I always pick my horse in good faith the night before, then he thinks I have to lose a pound if it is called off unless I now reselect from Dundalk tonight?
Stick where the sun don't shine pal.
Mad.

You want to make a settlers life easier?
Make it a rule that all selections MUST be from afternoon meetings so the bloody tables can be sorted out early evening rather than the poor buggers having to wait for the result of the 10.30 from Dundalk.

Not a bad idea mad.

that's assuming Dundalk actuallyh gets going  ... stalls frozen up apparently!

best idea Ive heard yet mad!

Stalls frozen?

Well sommat's wrong with them - 17.50 still not off, and the wevver's as foul as can be.

Looks like the stalls Reg.

What a chuffin day.

I've only just noticed the 5.50 still isn't off yet. They'll have to flag start it.

The flags are locked in a box and the key has gone missing momms.

They are asking around for a pistol.

To shoot whoever lost it?

madhatter     18 Jan 13 16:51 
You want to make a settlers life easier?
Make it a rule that all selections MUST be from afternoon meetings so the bloody tables can be sorted out early evening rather than the poor buggers having to wait for the result of the 10.30 from Dundalk.

Shanelee1966     18 Jan 13 16:53 
Not a bad idea mad.


Hmmmmmm!

man of many moods     10 Dec 12 15:40 
The only thing which would really benefit the settlers is to do away with evening meetings.

Shanelee1966     10 Dec 12 15:53 
I think it`s great the way it is really.


So it was a crap idea when I suggested, but not a bad idea now that mad's suggested it.

It was a light hearted comment from me, good idea yes, but not something i`d try to implement.

Anyway i never said that.

lol - copied and pasted Shane (but taken from a longer answer to my suggestion, I'll grant you)

I think Reg summed it up pretty well on that occasion:

Reged     10 Dec 12 18:18 

. . . I imagine part of what we do is to make it easy for people who work to post at a convenient time. Some I notice never post until, I assume, they are home from work. That's why I think overall it would be a bad idea.


And he's absolutely right of course. That was a point which hadn't occurred to me.

If you don't follow Irish racing you're missing out on the jump fans so called olympics Cheltenham, and don't say anyone in the four div's doesn't pick Irish horses at Cheltenham

Also if Navan is the only meeting tomorrow is it another non racing day or a Sunday again

It will be optional if only Naas survives.

why is it optional some days and not others. there was racing today and i wasnt allowed a nap. now thats wrong. even more wrong granted i picked a much needed 5/2 winner. not many things rile me up but surely if there is racing then the competition must go on.

Fidway - please read through the whole thread.

I'm with you on that one Fidway

The dicision was made early afternoon and made clear.

We can`t see into the future for what someone may think or post hours later.

I personally sympathize and felt it should have been optional, but reading through the thread you`ll see why.

Don't bother with him Shane. When you were on holiday he pulled up an old thread and confused half the players in The Premiership. Might have been drunk but has never apologised. Should have been booted out then.

Fidway or Stu?

Who`s this bleedin Salman Rushdie, posted on premier thread earlier.

Fidway.
Salmon rushdie is very closely related to Dr Martin luther King,whom I told you about previously. Ignore and with luck he'll go away.

tomorrow will be optional rather than suspended because everyone is aware of all the risks at the outset and thus it is a fair and level playing field ... No one foresaw the total wipeout in Uk today.

Sorry if you dont approve but a decision was made by, in the end, an absolute majority. If you still dont approve then become a settler. We don't make such decisions for our own benefit but for everyone in the comp.

Well said that man!

Must admit I did not know that DUNDALK was in EIRE !!!!!!!

It was AW racing and all much of a muchness IMO....compared to NH racing in all of Ireland!

Not an "easy" "job" you guys/gals have......so thanks for all time spent on the topic......................Wish I had read all posts earlier on subject.....but was spending time on DUNDALK ratings instead....so missed all the posts til AFTER I made my selection!!!!

No problem with me losing a winner today...as odds were c r a p anyway......so did not matter a jot! Had it been a 20-1 shot .....then I suspect I would be nawing my gums and banging my heid against the computer!!!!!!!!


Thanks again for all the time spent today "guys".

I tend to agree with Fidway.

The explanation that - oh it's really an UK racing naps league and we just happen to tolerate that Irish stuff blah blah blah...And cos the English stuff was off, we decided to change the rules for the day as there was only an Irish meeting remaining...

How 'pathetic' was that? Some might say 'racist'!!!

The bottom line was there was still an eligible meeting remaining under the rules of the comp, and those of us take part in the naps league know that Irish racing is included for selections.

It's not as if the weather took us by surprise, it was forecasted.

The Irish racing is either part of the comp or it's not, you can't class it as 'secondary' and outside of the usual rules.

There were days in Novemeber when there was only the hedgehopper stuff on, which I no longer have any interest in. It's become a bit alien to me now, but I still had to make a selection from it on the days when there wasn't any Flat racing.
My point is? If there wasn't any Flat racing through the winter I wouldn't be in the comp, but most days there is, yet I accept there will be a few days when I will have to select from meetings I'd rather not ie the jumps - and I just get on with it, I don't ask for the comp to be cancelled!

George read the posts. The comp was not cancelled simply because only an Irish meeting was left.

Reged     10 Dec 12 18:18 

. . . I imagine part of what we do is to make it easy for people who work to post at a convenient time. Some I notice never post until, I assume, they are home from work. That's why I think overall it would be a bad idea.


And he's absolutely right of course. That was a point which hadn't occurred to me.


How does that reasoning hold water?

Surely if they can only pick in the evening then why can't they pick one for the next afternoon rather than one for the evening that they are posting?
They are looking at the final declarations and all the form and tissues and tipsters etc are there for them use?

There are many of us that manage to post the night before for the following afternoon.

Read china above mad ...

Reged, I have read the thread.

The bottom line is there was still an eligible meeting remaining after all the abandonments. Had there just been Wolverhampton remaining, the comp would have gone ahead as usual, so why not just because there was only Dundalk left? The Irish racing is either part of the comp or it's not.

Fidway has a record of causing trouble,which is exactly what he was doing this evening in selecting when the post above his was quite clear.

china? his post on page three doesn;t seem relevant? Did you mean someone else reg?

According to rule 2, there is no way the comp should have been cancelled today, imo.


1. - You have to choose 1 horse each day. Winners will be returned at SP/Industry Prices and stake is 1 point. If no SP/Industry Price is returned winning selections will be settled as non-runners. Non selection means a loser.

2. - All UK and Irish races are eligible along with the Dubai Festival and the Sunday Arc de Triomphe meet.

3. - Selections must be made AT LEAST 1 hour before your selected race. Failure to comply will result in the selection being declared Invalid and treated as a Non Selection.

4. - Selections may be changed as long as it is BEFORE 1hr prior to original race OR if selection is a NR or deemed invalid ( Rule 3 MUST still be adhered to).

5. - Rule 4 and Dead Heat rules will apply to SP/Industry Prices.

6. - Sunday selections will be optional. No deductions for non posters. (it will be compulsory if Sunday is last day of the month).

7. - LAST DAY RULES for every last day of the month : all selections must be made BY THE SCHEDULED OFF OF THE FIRST RACE of the day, you can't choose any horse already selected and only named horses are allowed (no instructions).

8. Instructions to cover holiday / days can't post will be allowed but under the following STRICT guidelines :
- The instructions you wish to use must be clearly stated (Sundays will not have instructions applied unless EXPLICITLY stated otherwise).
- Instructions will be applied to GB mainland races only UNLESS explicitly stated otherwise. Ie Eire & Northern Ireland
- Only 10 days on instructions which do not name horses (i.e last fav , Spotform's nap etc) will be allowed each month. Once that has been exceeded one point per day will be deducted.
- Horses selected from the five day entries will be allowed. If they do not run they will be treated under the non runners rule and will not count towards the 10 day instruction maximum.
- In the case of more than one favourite in a race Instructions will be settled on the favourite with lowest race-card number.

9. In the event of a tie the person who has used least instructions will be deemed to finish above the person they have tied with.

10. In the event of a major Betfair upgrade which may affect the ability to post on the Forum before racing starts that day will have Sunday rules applied (ie. no deduction for non-posters).

*cancelled yesterday!

Which reminds me, past my bedtime. Night all!

it was simple when i got up yesterday,friday was still friday.Then we were told that friday had become sunday ,before then being informed that friday would no longer be sunday,nor would it revert back to friday,it had now become xmas day.Then saturday arrives and we are told saturday can remain as saturday provided a uk meet is still on ,if naas is the only to survive then saturday will be sunday.tomorrow is sunday.will it stay sunday or will sunday become saturday as saturday nicked sundays spot in the week or maybe it could become friday.Surely it makes more sense to leave sunday rules just for real sundays

Under the rules of the comp, Saturday is NOT an optional day.

Under the rules of the comp, Irish meetings ARE eligible.

Today is Saturday and there is an Irish meeting going ahead (at the moment).

What am I missing here?

mad I dont know where china's post has gone - nuthger thread, been pulled? He ws talking about preferring to decide on his shortlist as close to racing as the rules allowed

Reg, top of Page 5 on the Settling instructions thread

cheers MoMM

I`m not going to bang on regarding my view being optional yesterday. What`s done is done.

We now need to clarify as clearly as we can for similar situations. It can get complicated as someone pointed out yesterday, we need a hard and fast rule that leaves everyone in no doubt.

I propose what GEORGE has said above 08:56 post. As long as an eligible meeting is on then it`s a normal day, regardless of anything else. In the event of meetings getting cancelled etc non-runners are settled as such. People may or may not re-select, that`s up to them.

This way is the only definate solution and leaves no doubt for any napsters or settlers.

Like i said, what`s done is done. Let`s move forward with a solution. I`d appreciate it if the other settlers were on board here.

I agree with shane

I don't. I dont agree with George. Irish is not a full parft of the comp, as the rules suggest by excluding it from automatic instructions. May I also say that one or two people have complainedd about the decision on here, as they are entitled to. But from the vast majority - not a peep. I take that as an endorsement of our decision.

And in any case, yesterdays decision was not just about it being Ireland but the fact that the situation changed so much so late that it left a very uneven playing field for competitors which was deemed unfair. It's all very well with hindsight saying everyone could see what was going to happen. But I for one did not expect both UK AW meetings to go under, although in part that has to do with my complete misunderstanding of the term All Weather. I can be so naive at times!

And finally - you cant have hard and fast rules for every situation. Either the settlers are trusted to make decisions in the best interests of ALL (and I emphasise that word) competitors or there is not much point in being a settler and I'll find something else to occupy my day.

Many points were raised and discussed Reg.

My point in future would be to remove any doubt.

As yesterday, it would be compulsory but effectively optional because for example 18 out of 19 in the premier didn`t re-post. Most will have made a concious decision not too.

Surely Irish is a full part of the comp? As far as instructions go, in the past we had grey areas re last race fav so i decided to clear that up by stating GB mainland only unless otherwise stated. Seperate issue really, just needed to tighten the instruction ruling.

If Ireland is the only available meeting it should never be a normal day as its a foreign meeting . No problem with it being in the competition but it should never be forced on people .

I fully support the settlers' decision yesterday. As Reged says they had to make a decision quickly as the particular circumstances had thrown up some anomalies. I have some sympathy with GEORGE's argument about Irish racing being on a par with GB and maybe there is a way of reflecting that in future. But I really wish people would try and refrain from criticising the settlers who are clearly putting an awful lot of time and effort into running the thing for our benefit.

No you can`t Reg, hence my Rule 12.

As you said yesterday, we need to tighten up as much as we can to avoid ill feeling/bitching.

Do you see my point above? We had a situation when i began settling where instructions were difficult to police for many reasons. In a nutshell, i tightened it all up by making regular posts/requests and posting my list of instructions at least once a week, along with new comers being asked to clearly state if they wished to use them, instead of them expecting instructions from 6 months back when they were in Div 2 being in force.

Okay i didnt know that shane. But having just seen china's post I have to say it strikes a strong chord with me.

But in any case, carping on about irish racing is rather getting away from the point. You say most would have made a conscious decision etc I'm not so sure. Many just make the one post and get on with the rest of their lives, some can't post again in time etc. I don't have a problem with doubt because i don't have a problem with making decisions as a settler in special circumstances.

When the subject of Meydan cropped up a year ago Shane said that we'd happily accept selections from any foreign prestige event if anyone wanted it. And that's still the case. If you want the Melbourne Cup for example, you only have to ask. But speaking as a player, I don't think anyone should ever be forced to make a selection from a foreign country on a day when there's no GB racing. And yes, I realise that Dundalk is in Northern Ireland but racing is all-Ireland over there and governed by HRI. The mainstay of this competition is GB racing governed by the BHA, and that's the form which most of us study. You only have to look at how few players ever select from Ireland or Meydan to see that they're very much optional extras. And this is reinforced by Rule 8 which clearly states that "Instructions will be applied to GB races only UNLESS explicitly stated otherwise. i.e. Eire & Northern Ireland". In my opinion, being forced to select from an Irish or Meydan card would just make it a lottery for most of us rather than a game of skill, which is what it's meant to be.

So I agree with George.B in that the wording of Rule 3 probably ought to be clarified so that there's no misunderstanding in the future.

Dundalk is in The Republic momm.

Yes, it most certainly is

If Irish racing was forced upon us just look at the overrounds . Impossible to make a profit unless you have a few small fields or group races on the card .

Is it? Backs up how much I know about Irish racing then. Well whichever one it is then. Downpatrick? Down Royal? Are they in NI?

Yep those two momm.

heres the trouble maker back .so salmon spray (lucky winner of champion hurdle) agrees with GEORGE B  but when i said exactly the same thing he turns on me. maybe we should only have naps when there is a horse at 1/5 or under.if not then the day should be classed as a sunday.

Yesterday, if I'd not seen the thread cancelling the comp and nothing had been said, I would have just gone ahead and selected at Dundalk and thought nothing more of it.

The rules are unequivocal in this instance -

Fridays are compulsory and Irish meetings are elgible.

You cannot allow a country's racing into a competition and then state at a later date - oh, by the way, we just happen to have different rules for that foreign 'sh!t' and if there's no UK racing, we're taking our ball home and not playing!

If you are going to allow racing from other coutries to be eligible for the naps comp, then the same rules have to apply across the board. You can't treat it as second-class fodder and not worthy of the same rules and conditions.

I didn't agree with you making a selection at Dundalk when you knew that a decision had already been made Fidway ( or you couldn't be bothered to read the post above yours )but yes I'm not convinced that Ireland has always been secondary to GB. However there are quite a lot of people who go back further than me.

Right, if we have a similar situation, do we vote (settlers) as per yesterday?

Three options:

Compulsory
Optional
Cancellation

Wot do you mean LUCKY winner       

salmon i never knew it had been cancelled.if you look where the post saying today was cancelled,it was at the top of the 2nd page which i didnt even realise existed as i only read the whole of the 1st page.it wasnt until you pointed out the post that i realised it was there. p/s Aupcharlie is a good nap but how did you manage to select it,must have been reading through the formbook for hours

Judging by the other selection in the Premiership I am the only one who knows how to read Irish form         

Honestly, you'd think we were trying to solve the Algerian crisis. This is a free comp and, as per the proposed rule 12, settlers took a difficult decision in difficult circumstances. If the few carpers so thoroughly disapprove of that then it is open to them either to quit the comp or volunteer as settlers in order that it may be run more in accordance with their views. Otherwise, thank you very much and here's today's selection.

shane, cant see the point of repeating that question. We all voted according to whatever conscience we have and in the best interests of all. I stand by my decision 100%. I see no reason to tinker with the rules as a result. If others do not approve then my advice is in the previous paragraph.

A naps comp is a naps comp if GB and Ireland are included and racing is on either side of the Irish Sea be it jumps or AW you make a choice or lose a point IMO. if  you don't like the AW you still have to make a selection.

I'm the same as GEORGE.B and have no interest in jump racing but when there is no flat I still make a selection, I even compete in Undecided's NH big race comp' for a bit of interest over the winter, but that's my choice.

Anyway the settlers decision if final as it should be, even if Premier, 1,2,3 settlers are slightly different in the way they run things.

And that's the last you'll hear from me on the subject, over and out

Surely GEORGE B's post on rules is clear enough for all?...Namely :-


1. - You have to choose 1 horse each day. Winners will be returned at SP/Industry Prices and stake is 1 point. If no SP/Industry Price is returned winning selections will be settled as non-runners. Non selection means a loser.

2. - All UK and Irish races are eligible along with the Dubai Festival and the Sunday Arc de Triomphe meet.

3. - Selections must be made AT LEAST 1 hour before your selected race. Failure to comply will result in the selection being declared Invalid and treated as a Non Selection.

4. - Selections may be changed as long as it is BEFORE 1hr prior to original race OR if selection is a NR or deemed invalid ( Rule 3 MUST still be adhered to).

5. - Rule 4 and Dead Heat rules will apply to SP/Industry Prices.

6. - Sunday selections will be optional. No deductions for non posters. (it will be compulsory if Sunday is last day of the month).

7. - LAST DAY RULES for every last day of the month : all selections must be made BY THE SCHEDULED OFF OF THE FIRST RACE of the day, you can't choose any horse already selected and only named horses are allowed (no instructions).

8. Instructions to cover holiday / days can't post will be allowed but under the following STRICT guidelines :
- The instructions you wish to use must be clearly stated (Sundays will not have instructions applied unless EXPLICITLY stated otherwise).
- Instructions will be applied to GB mainland races only UNLESS explicitly stated otherwise. Ie Eire & Northern Ireland
- Only 10 days on instructions which do not name horses (i.e last fav , Spotform's nap etc) will be allowed each month. Once that has been exceeded one point per day will be deducted.
- Horses selected from the five day entries will be allowed. If they do not run they will be treated under the non runners rule and will not count towards the 10 day instruction maximum.
- In the case of more than one favourite in a race Instructions will be settled on the favourite with lowest race-card number.

9. In the event of a tie the person who has used least instructions will be deemed to finish above the person they have tied with.

10. In the event of a major Betfair upgrade which may affect the ability to post on the Forum before racing starts that day will have Sunday rules applied (ie. no deduction for non-posters).
=============================================================================================


There is as much "skill" necessary re EIRE races as with AW anyway as there is with BRITISH races on AW......so really was surprised at all the fuss over rules.......when rules are pretty clear to all.

Whether someone does not like a particular type of race is irrelevant....as the rules when they entered comp were clear ...IMO.  Surely the competition is to test participants skills....on a broad range of races . If from EIRE or MEYDAN ...the key factors still apply to race types...especially re CLASS races.

Anyway yesterday has gone...and today ad-lib rules apply.......

Does this mean the above RULE 2 no longer applies?????

* should be, the settlers decision is final*

I'm coming round to Reged's view here that after pages and pages of discussion no one seems to be happy.

We give our time voluntarily and for the fun of it.

Judging by some peoples comments and attitudes on here you'd think that we were being paid and making the rules up to suit ourselves.

I don't see many of these people being so keen to pipe up when we ask for volunteers.

I go back to my original point that sparked the whole debate. The minute it stops being fun, get's to serious and untold hassle then that is the time to walk away.

That time is looming unless we can bang a few heads together and adopt some common sense rules.....

At the end of the day the settlers have to make decisions and sometimes these wont please everybody

Hi DFC

Does this mean the above RULE 2 no longer applies?????


I think it just means it needs clarifying that 'eligible' is not synonymous with 'compulsory'. Maybe this situation has never cropped before so it's never needed clarifying before.

I did ask on page 1 if there was a precedent and got the reply that it now becomes optional. Although reading it again, Shane may have just been voicing his opinion of how we should proceed rather than answering my question. Not sure. But he went on to say that making it compulsory for the few remaining would be unfair.on those who had not already selected. "Optional seems the fairest way to proceed". And having made it optional we then realised that this disadvantaged some players who had already posted, and the only sensible option which would be fair on absolutely everyone would be to suspend the competition for that day and then clarify it for any future occurrence. Which is what we did.

And that's the key to any decision where the circumstances are unusual or unprecedented. You have to do what's fairest for the majority of players, which I firmly believe we succeeded in doing.

And if that means that Rule 2 now needs rewording in case this ever happens again, then so be it. Let's reword it.

i agree with weaver fish. settlers decision is final. even if it is blatantly wrong

Fidway is right. There are going to be circumstances which arise that are unforeseen. The settlers have to make a decision and those of us who disagree with it will just have to accept it. Otherwise there will be no settlers and therefore no comp.

perhaps be better if just one settler made the decision,as their vote was 2-2 anyway.

no, as far as I am aware it ended 4-0

oh ,shane said origanal vote was 2-2.But whatever,sorry if i've got up your nose in voicing my opinion on what i saw to be a poor decision reg.I agree that you did do it with good intentions though and i am grateful for all the hard work you settlers put in.still think a dictatorship would be better in decision making though.Democracy is so overrated

no you didnt get up my nose at all ... wld be diffic, its very tight! we all see things in a different light but someone's got to make a decision and the four of us did quite amicably. yesterday was simply a one-off where rapidly changing circumstances put a significant number of people at a disadvantage

To clarify, the original vote was 2-2, which was a stalemate. I personally didn`t want that and felt a decision had to be reached straight away rather than going round in circles. So i opted to switch to momms & Reg`s camp in the overall interests of the comp and to offer clarity to all.

This could be of interest today

Yes, some of it it makes for an interesting read.

Well resurrected.