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pulio
13 Aug 21 18:12
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Date Joined: 25 Oct 04
| Topic/replies: 2,298 | Blogger: pulio's blog
Is this the first time? Good development. The other exchange has so many more tracks though. I'd like to see betfair get more of those tracks too.
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Report jamee1 August 13, 2021 7:09 PM BST
Gulfstream also been loaded for tomorrow and Pimlico too!
Report jamee1 August 13, 2021 7:14 PM BST
And Golden Gate Fields!
Report jamee1 August 13, 2021 7:48 PM BST
Laurel Park and Santa Anita are also being added so I am told.

So the total list of new tracks are:
> Gulfstream Park
> Pimlico
> Golden Gate Fields
> Laurel Park
> Santa Anita
Report tinytuco August 13, 2021 11:45 PM BST
Get in there!! Been waiting for these travks to come on for ages - particularly Santa Anita which has some unreal racing.....

Hopefully not to the detriment of the tracks we currently have.... ( ok maybe Parx, Penn and Monmouth...)

Shame Emerald Downs isn't coming back - used to think that place was one of the easier tracks to get a handle on..........
Report swiftynifty August 14, 2021 1:00 AM BST
tuco, where did you hear about Evangeline?
Report sparrow August 14, 2021 10:09 AM BST
Great to see this tracks back on here and all we need now is Bay Meadows and Great Lakes Downs back.Grin
Report sparrow August 14, 2021 10:11 AM BST
pulio 13 Aug 21 17:12 
Is this the first time? Good development. The other exchange has so many more tracks though. I'd like to see betfair get more of those tracks too.



All these tracks were on betfair in the earlier days plus many more as well.
Report swiftynifty August 14, 2021 4:55 PM BST
a glut tonight, let's see how well these are managed, or not.
Report jamee1 August 14, 2021 7:20 PM BST
Pimlico are running way ahead of schedule ruining the markets. They will get ahead of the video feed possibly for the next race the way they are going Sad
Report swiftynifty August 14, 2021 7:40 PM BST
As last night. If Pimlico have relaesed new off times it would be good if betfair acted accordingly like they do in Australia, but i doubt it
Report Kriskin August 14, 2021 7:45 PM BST
jamee - what is the reason the above named tracks have returned to the Exchange?  What has changed?
Report jamee1 August 14, 2021 8:18 PM BST

Aug 14, 2021 -- 1:45PM, Kriskin wrote:


jamee - what is the reason the above named tracks have returned to the Exchange?

Report jamee1 August 14, 2021 8:24 PM BST
Don't know. It is a change in strategy from Betfair as for the last year they seem to have deliberately limited the number of concurrent cards to a max of four.
Report jamee1 August 14, 2021 8:27 PM BST
Pimlico now running so far ahead the video stream was unavailable. Crazy
Report england_v_south_afri August 14, 2021 8:51 PM BST
Delighted to have more betting opportunities on the Betfair Exchange on US Racing. Happy
Report jamee1 August 14, 2021 9:39 PM BST
Golden Gate live stream is available here. No idea what the delay is. https://livestream.com/xbtv/events/9051411
Report jamee1 August 14, 2021 10:37 PM BST
Pimlico ended up 25 mins ahead of schedule by the last race. Once they got more than 12 mins ahead it meant the videos wouldn't load either so we ended up with some tiny markets - the last race achieved only £800 total market traded volume which is the lowest I have ever seen for a US horse race. 

Golden Gate Fields video stream is not working at all.

Hopefully BF will sort these issues out for tomorrow...
Report swiftynifty August 14, 2021 11:58 PM BST
Race 12 missing?
Report Zephyrus August 18, 2021 2:06 AM BST
Hello. I've been following American horde racing on exchange for more than ten years.

Gulfstream Park and Laurel were available here until the beginning of 2014. Pimlico was still here back in 2013. However I don't remember to see Golden Gate on exchange.

Gulfstream was very popular among punters but the liquidity for traders was not high. The reason was the absence of live streaming for this racecourse.

All this racecourses have one thing in common, they belong to Stronach Group. Most probably for any odd reason they refused the presence of their meetings on Betfair Exchange before the Spring of 2014.

On the other hand it seems that CDI refuses to allow the presence of their racetracks here. They bought Presque Isle Downs and Turfway Park two or three years ago. That's the reason this racetracks are not here anymore.

Beulah Park, Atlantic City and Suffolk left because they were shut down.

Lousiana Downs was always here until 2018 and Emerald Downs until last year. I don't know why they are not here anymore.

I just hope to have Zia Park back next Autumn and Sunland Park next Winter, like in the good old days. That would be awesome now that Laurel and Gulfstream are back.
Report Zephyrus August 18, 2021 2:18 AM BST
I still remember when Penn and Charles were racing 4 to 5 days per week all year round. Mountaineer stoping just two months, January and February. Finger Lakes racing five days per week. Aqueduct 4 to 5 days every week. Parx 4 days every week all year round. And all the racecards with at least 9 races.
Report jamee1 August 18, 2021 3:46 AM BST
Thanks for the info Zeph, that was really interesting. Do you still trade now? How does liquidity and value today compare with 10 years ago? Was there in-running available back then?

Zia Park is still being covered but hardly featured last season as most of their cards contained more then 3 quarter horse races which seems to be the limit for Betfair. Also Sunland Park have been covered for the last few years but they haven't raced since Covid.
Report Zephyrus August 18, 2021 6:57 AM BST
Hello jamee1.

American horse racing was the biggest secret of exchange among a few traders in the know. With some knowledge and experience it was possible to make between 40 and 200 pounds everyday. The markets were so different!

- There were everyday free PDFs for all the tracks on exchange with BSPs and some useful information and tips. This was very helpful. Unfortunately this free service ended somewhere around 2016.

- Until 2015/2016 punters with big stakes, 1000, 2000, sometimes 5000 or even more were common here. Imagine a stake of 5000 starting at 3 and slowly going down until 2, and then the market going up again to 3.

- Liquidity used to be low in the Summer months between 5 pm and 9 pm, 5 to 10k, and higher after the last English or Irish race of the day, usually between 20 and 50k, sometimes 100k. But the biggest difference was the market behaviour. Far more punters; and it was common to trade following the odds on the screen, but now 20 minutes before the post time someone knows already the final odds on the America tote. Just imagine an horse opening at 5 on the Tote and starting on exchange at 7 and then going down on tote until 2 and here until 3, this was a very common pattern. During the Winter months liquidity was always high between 6 pm and 2 am, until the first Australian horse race of the day, usually between 20 and 50k, reaching sometimes 100k.

- In-running was not available until 2016. Only for the Breeder's Cup.

- The Belmont stakes and The Breeder's Cup used to have huge liquidity. I still remember the day that California Chrome lost the Belmont Stakes, back in 2014. The liquidity on exchange was almost 1 million. This year, 2021, the liquidity for the Belmont Stakes was below 200k. It was common for the Breeder's Cup to have more than 1 million traded on exchange.

-My best trade gave me almost 250 at Zia Park back in 2014. That year my profits were 1k one evening, just trading at American horse racing markets, great liquidity and punters with huge stakes, at Turf Paradise, Zia, Parx and Mountaineer.

- Many traders and punters from Greece, Italy, Spain, Portugal, Germany, Austria or France were here giving liquidity but they left between 2012 and 2015, due to legal restrictions. Unfortunately Betfair left those countries. Those laws are completely against the single market rules but the EU just doesn't care about the British and Irish betting and gambling industry. I'm from one of those European countries and my first account was closed because Betfair left my country. Then I moved to England where I live now and I opened my new account 6 years ago. 

- The last great year for traders was 2015. Since 2016 the market has changed. Less liquidity, less punters, but the biggest challenge is how the market behaves ten minutes before post time.
Report Zephyrus August 18, 2021 7:09 AM BST
Now I prefer to trade in the early morning. Australian markets, horse racing and greyhounds. Currently I find American horse racing markets more interesting for punting. I know already how they work in Charles Town, Mountaineer, Penn National, Delaware, Parx, Finger Lakes and many others. How to find backs and lays just looking for the Morning line, the odds behaviour on the Tote market and here on exchange markets. Many times I don't need any PPPs. This year I tried Eurovision for the first time and it was amazing to trade. I would love to see the liquidity improving here and I hope that now with the new racetracks some traders and punters are going to be back, but the biggest challenge remains the legal restrictions for Betfair that are blocking customers from many European countries and from the USA.
Report Zephyrus August 18, 2021 7:29 AM BST
A typical July and August in the past.

Racetracks available and number of racing days.

Finger Lakes, 5
Mountaineer, 4 to 5
Charles Town, 4 to 5
Penn, 4
Parx, 4
Louisiana Downs, 4
Saratoga, 5
Woodbine, 4
Fort Erie, 2
Gulfstream, 4
Pimlico, 4
Evangeline, 4
Presque Isle Downs, 5
Suffolk, 4
Emerald, 2/3

Those racetracks of the list were always here. Other racetracks were occasionally on exchange during the summer months. Prairie Meadows, Indiana or Ruidoso are some examples.
Report Zephyrus August 18, 2021 7:31 AM BST
I forgot Delaware when I was making the list!
Report Zephyrus August 18, 2021 7:42 AM BST
And Monmouth!
Report jamee1 August 18, 2021 7:39 PM BST
Thanks for your insights. Fascinating to understand some of the history.

Surprised the in-running only began in 2016 as a major tranche of BF commission must come from the high frequency of 1.01 turnovers you get on US racing due to the amount of DQs? I don't know why they don't leave the markets open until 20 secs after the finish to be honest. Would be a quick and easy way for them to increase commission significantly.

The amount of cards per week changed at many tracks following Covid as they are struggling to fill races from a lower pool of entrants. Finger Lakes, Mountaineer, Charles Town and Penn have all had to cancel the odd date here and there despite racing less often. Same for the days of the week they race as suddenly priorities changed from maximising on-track handle to off-track handle. This has led to a drop in weekend activity from the traditional BF tracks and I wonder if this prompted the introduction of the Stronach tracks which mainly race at the weekend?
Report swiftynifty August 19, 2021 11:33 AM BST
Zephyrus, do you have records of the first in-running month/meetings. I can only remember it being in the autumn, Aqueduct etc?
Report sparrow August 20, 2021 10:57 PM BST
Zephyrus Golden Gate was on for quite some time in the early years along with Bay Meadows. I remember Laurel Park being covered by the old RUK American Racing Channel on 433.
Report jamee1 August 22, 2021 1:02 PM BST
Emerald Downs racing has been added for this evening.
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